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[Odyssey] Capital Rigs

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Dilbert HighSeed
Pirannha Corp
#81 - 2013-04-23 17:31:36 UTC
Mynas Atoch wrote:
Destoya wrote:
[quote=Fango Mango]It will raise the price of all rigs since salvage (especially t2 armor plates and ward consoles) is a resource with a fairly limited supply. Since every new super capital, bling WH cap, or dreads with gun rigs will be using 5x the supply of T2 salvage this will bring the price up.

Probably won't have too much of an effect on the t1 market, at least in the long run, both because supply of materials is larger and the amount of capitals that get rigged everyday is nothing compared to how many battleships do the same.


You alliance must be smugging it right now. If T2 salvage triples in price due to this, as seems possible, this is potentially a 15 trillion isk boost to the value of your supercapital fleet.

Way to go CCPL.


So, if 3 T2 rigs go for 4.5 BIllion, as your newest CSM mouthpiece says, and you are suggesting this is a boost of 15 trillion in value, 15,000/ 4.5 = approx 3300 supercaps. So, you are saying that PL has 3300 supercaps? Or are you just really dumb at math?
Jita altSpyAdnqwioudf Anneto
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#82 - 2013-04-23 17:32:11 UTC
Odyssey doesn't have 2 Ds
fukier
Gallente Federation
#83 - 2013-04-23 17:32:25 UTC
James Amril-Kesh wrote:
fukier wrote:
CCP Tallest wrote:
mynnna wrote:
What are the skill requirements for these rigs?

Same skill requirements for fitting these as other rigs.



What if I install large rigs that dont currently work on capitals... Will they work after the patch?

Why would you do that?


If I had a triage carrier right now.aux pumps dont work but they will after the patch...

So lets say day before patch I install tech ii large aux pumps cuss they are not overly expensive... Would they then work the day when the patch goes live?

Not saying I want to do it just saying if you wanted to to save isk would they work?
At the end of the game both the pawn and the Queen go in the same box.
Gizznitt Malikite
Agony Unleashed
Agony Empire
#84 - 2013-04-23 17:36:22 UTC
Skia Aumer wrote:
Gizznitt Malikite wrote:
But so what? You have warning! Everyone is on an equal footing now, everyone has adequate time to compensate...

Am I on equal footing with PL supercap fleet? Oh, you're over-estimating me.


Yes, you are, in terms of fitting your ship! You have equal access to modules, equal access to fitting options, and equal access to rigs.

Now, do you have equal access to the ship hulls themselves? Maybe, maybe not... but this change doesn't alter that in the slightest!

Ripard Teg
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#85 - 2013-04-23 17:36:43 UTC
Hi Tallest,

Can you please clarify the T2 question? WILL there be T2 capital rigs? ie, will the invention cycle even work on these new BPOs?

Also, I assume you guys went into this understanding the impact this is going to have on the salvage and rig markets. Can you talk a bit about that? Because it sure seems like this change is going to severely hurt newer players and smaller alliances, enormously raising their risk when actually using capitals. It's also going to severely strain the already absurdly volatile T2 salvage market.

But maybe there are other factors in play that I'm not aware of?

aka Jester, who apparently was once Deemed Worthy To Wield The Banhammer to good effect.
Andski
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#86 - 2013-04-23 17:37:18 UTC
my titan will still be in build :\

Twitter: @EVEAndski

"It's easy to speak for the silent majority. They rarely object to what you put into their mouths."    - Abrazzar
Forlorn Wongraven
Habitual Euthanasia
Pandemic Legion
#87 - 2013-04-23 17:38:35 UTC
Andski wrote:
my titan will still be in build :\


Goon nerf. Lol

Winner ATXI , 3rd place ATXII, winner ATXIII, 2nd ATXIV - follow me on twitter: @ForlornW
Lex Arson
Adversity.
Psychotic Tendencies.
#88 - 2013-04-23 17:42:35 UTC
Mynas Atoch wrote:
This is a 7.5 Billion isk boost for anyone who already has a T2 rigged supercap. You should seriously consider making existing rigs which are too small for their ship class ineffective to create a level playing field.

Giving the thousands of existing supercapital pilots a 7.5 billion isk advantage over new pilots is too much.


stealth PL buff

There's no use crying after every mistake, you just keep on trying 'til you run out of cake.
Skia Aumer
Planetary Harvesting and Processing LLC
#89 - 2013-04-23 17:45:04 UTC
Gizznitt Malikite wrote:
Yes, you are, in terms of fitting your ship! You have equal access to modules, equal access to fitting options, and equal access to rigs.
Now, do you have equal access to the ship hulls themselves? Maybe, maybe not... but this change doesn't alter that in the slightest!

The change assures existing monopoly on supercaps even futher. And this is bad. Rich becomes richer, poor becomes poorer.
Mrs Winter
Insane Shadow Boxers
#90 - 2013-04-23 17:46:04 UTC
Its not really. You cannot take the rigs off the ships. And its not like you can sell your rigged Super/Titan for profit....
Aerallo
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#91 - 2013-04-23 17:47:31 UTC
Andski wrote:
my titan will still be in build :\



Mine will be done just in time :sun:
fukier
Gallente Federation
#92 - 2013-04-23 17:49:10 UTC  |  Edited by: fukier
Ripard Teg wrote:
Hi Tallest,

Can you please clarify the T2 question? WILL there be T2 capital rigs? ie, will the invention cycle even work on these new BPOs?

Also, I assume you guys went into this understanding the impact this is going to have on the salvage and rig markets. Can you talk a bit about that? Because it sure seems like this change is going to severely hurt newer players and smaller alliances, enormously raising their risk when actually using capitals. It's also going to severely strain the already absurdly volatile T2 salvage market.

But maybe there are other factors in play that I'm not aware of?


Odessey is exploration theme so maybe mag(salvage) sites wil be boosted?

Edit typing on a phone in the can is pretty ******
At the end of the game both the pawn and the Queen go in the same box.
Dilbert HighSeed
Pirannha Corp
#93 - 2013-04-23 17:51:24 UTC
Ripard Teg wrote:
Hi Tallest,

Can you please clarify the T2 question? WILL there be T2 capital rigs? ie, will the invention cycle even work on these new BPOs?

Also, I assume you guys went into this understanding the impact this is going to have on the salvage and rig markets. Can you talk a bit about that? Because it sure seems like this change is going to severely hurt newer players and smaller alliances, enormously raising their risk when actually using capitals. It's also going to severely strain the already absurdly volatile T2 salvage market.

But maybe there are other factors in play that I'm not aware of?


Ripard, be assured, the large null sec alliances will not be hurt by this. No way that would be allowed.
Newer players, smaller alliances being hurt by this, maybe they will, maybe they won't.
But the devs who design changes like this are not interested in those entities.
IIt all depends on if any additional changes being applied to mitigate the cost to the large alliances trickles down to the smaller players as well.

But it is pretty clear that there won't be many T2 rig fitted carriers out there, at current T2 salvage prices.
It is kind of hard to justify 4.5 billion of rigs on a 1.3 billion hull.

Oh, and of course, T2 armor plates in Jita are at 20M, and rising. An hour ago they were 16M.
Ivana Twinkle
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#94 - 2013-04-23 17:52:24 UTC
I'm pretty smug about plopping in t2 rigs in my super just earlier today before this thread was made.
Llyona
Lazerhawks
L A Z E R H A W K S
#95 - 2013-04-23 17:55:19 UTC
Chinicata Shihari wrote:
Llyona wrote:
xXyoloxXxbroswagxXx420Xx wrote:
Love it.

Spend 1.3b on an Archon then 4.5b on T2 rigs. Good job CCP!


Look at the tools posting like they know what's up. Let's all point and laugh at them!

Seriously, if the MATERIAL price increases by 5x, then that means a T2 rigged carrier will cost you 2.3-2.4b isk.

The math is pretty easy:

Intact Armor Plates x70 - 1.12b

Interface Circuit x85 - 22m

Nanite Compound x55 - 4.73m

RAM x0.2 - 20k

Total: 1.147b

So, we'd get the following as a price calculation: 1.147*2 , then we'd add another 40m for the 3rd rig, which will be T1.

2.334b (This includes a 15% markup)

Your maths is very poor. It will cost 1.5bil per Capital T2 trimark at mineral cost.

Are you high, or do you normally post about **** you have no clue about? Rigs aren't manufactured with minerals, they're manufactured with salvage. T2 rigs require "blue salvage".

What I listed were the exact amounts required from an invention run with a +2/+1/+4 modifier (which is what will be used, seeing as what the material costs are).

Chinicata Shihari wrote:

That means 4.5bil for 3 before markup. Thats going to make the price on a armour super sky rocket. So if a fitted aeon costs 22bil now then a fitted aeon afterwards would cost at least 26bil.

Oh man, even if we assume your wildly inflated figures are right, that's a T2 rig cost of 20.5% "fitted value".

Let's compare:
Loki: Fitted, 600m
T2 Rigs: 270m
45% rig value ratio.

I could do this over and over, but who gives a ****. T2 rigs have been far too cheap for caps for way too long.

EVE is an illness, for which there is no cure.
Allison A'vani
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#96 - 2013-04-23 17:56:12 UTC
You all QQing about slow cats do realize that almost no one fits t2 rigs on their slow cats or dreads right?
Dramaticus
State War Academy
Caldari State
#97 - 2013-04-23 17:57:35 UTC
Pocket change

The 'do-nothing' member of the GoonSwarm Economic Warfare Cabal

The edge is REALLY hard to see at times but it DOES exist and in this case we were looking at a situation where a new feature created for all of our customers was being virtually curbstomped by five of them
TrouserDeagle
Beyond Divinity Inc
Shadow Cartel
#98 - 2013-04-23 17:59:30 UTC
So rigging a tonne of capitals before odyssey = free isk, right? This doesn't seem well thought-out to me.
Llyona
Lazerhawks
L A Z E R H A W K S
#99 - 2013-04-23 18:01:18 UTC
TrouserDeagle wrote:
So rigging a tonne of capitals before odyssey = free isk, right? This doesn't seem well thought-out to me.


You should've seen the profits my buddy and I made off the mineral cost increases on retrievers. Thanks CCP for making my indy wallet that much fatter! Blink

EVE is an illness, for which there is no cure.
Mynas Atoch
Eternity INC.
Goonswarm Federation
#100 - 2013-04-23 18:12:43 UTC  |  Edited by: Mynas Atoch
Dilbert HighSeed wrote:
Mynas Atoch wrote:
Destoya wrote:
[quote=Fango Mango]It will raise the price of all rigs since salvage (especially t2 armor plates and ward consoles) is a resource with a fairly limited supply. Since every new super capital, bling WH cap, or dreads with gun rigs will be using 5x the supply of T2 salvage this will bring the price up.

Probably won't have too much of an effect on the t1 market, at least in the long run, both because supply of materials is larger and the amount of capitals that get rigged everyday is nothing compared to how many battleships do the same.


You alliance must be smugging it right now. If T2 salvage triples in price due to this, as seems possible, this is potentially a 15 trillion isk boost to the value of your supercapital fleet.

Way to go CCPL.


So, if 3 T2 rigs go for 4.5 BIllion, as your newest CSM mouthpiece says, and you are suggesting this is a boost of 15 trillion in value, 15,000/ 4.5 = approx 3300 supercaps. So, you are saying that PL has 3300 supercaps? Or are you just really dumb at math?
You missed the "T2 salvage triples in price". So yes, PL and their current set of allies have far MORE than 1100 supercaps. I knocked off about 25% to allow for those who may have quit or been banned since last seen in the previous 12 calendar months.

A stealth 15 Trillion isk boost to one group in EVE's null sec power balance is a big deal.

Would CCP Tallest care to comment at this massive boost for the haves over the have nots?