Intergalactic Summit

Technically Heth is half-correct. He claims that Caldari corporatism started in response to "The Gallente enforcing their culture on us[the Caldari]"

It is debatable how, when, why or even if this was the case, and this is not the place for that argument. However, the Caldari as a people had their culture from long before the first-contact event, and in that culture lies the roots of the Caldari version of what can be termed modern Federal corporatism.

In short, there was no such thing as 'corporate' culture among the Caldari, divided as they were along national lines, but there was that original ideal, that concept that would mesh so nicely with the corporate idea. As I recall, when the Gallente introduced this corporate concept to the Caldari, the latter did not simply take use of it as it was, but they apparently liked the idea - with a few changes and tweaks the Caldari version of the concept was born - in many ways simply the ideals and means of the Caldari culture distilled into practical form, well-suited to the Caldari way of life.

This created the bed-rock that the soon-to-be Mega-corporations would grow on and soon Caldari society was divided between their nations (all successors of the Raata Empire) and the corporations that were pervasive in them. Soon after the Federation's founding the Mega's would independently found the secret colonies for themselves (without their Nation's knowledge, IIRC) and after some time it was not uncommon to find CEO's and corporate spokespersons speaking with more weight in the Federal senate than even the senators from Caldari nation-states themselves. History ensues.

When Heth claims that the Caldari corporate culture that the State is effectively built on, was a "reaction" to the Gallente, he speaks half the truth. It can be debated that the State itself exists as a consequence of the Gallente and the Federation itself. I imagine he dislikes this idea intensely, and his idea for changing it is to abolish it entirely and re-create the Raata Empire with himself as Emperor. I doubt this will go down very well with your average State citizen-employee, but that remains to be seen.

In closing, I would like to offer an apology: I stated in the start of this tread I would not get involved as this does not concern me, and while that might be true I find myself unable to give Heth at least some credit for his statement - he is not completely off the mark, as it is. Shame that it's spun with his typical take on things, but that's to be expected, I suppose.

For what it's worth, I'm sorry.

It's good that someone mentioned the Heth loyalists. I was just wondering if they're going to all commit honorary suicide if Heth falls. This will be the true test of their faith. We will see if their actions match their words.

Other people seem to have got on fine (although that number is probably smaller than one might think). She's definitely deranged though.

Where we disagree is only in the matter of degrees, I think. I have seen this coming for some time - although I hoped that cooler heads would council wisdom.

Aspects of your solution are attractive to me - since it has become clear that he will not take the honourable way out himself.

Murder is such a base word. Remove permanently from office has a much nicer ring to it.

I'm going to play advocate in the same manner a UoC professor would in challenging her students; as in, by playing contrarian, one may reinforce their own beliefs by backing it up in the face of counter-points. It's a key element to the art of debate. Unfortunately, it is mistaken for unbridled attacks and reciprocated with rage.

What is inherently wrong with what Executor Heth has said? As an outsider, what I might see is just another echo chamber response to how nobody likes Tibus Heth. After all, it is easy to score points with other capsuleers if there is a mutual channeling of dislike towards Heth. Look at how Diana Kim is ostracized amongst capsuleers for her beliefs. Even if there is logical thought to backing up the disapproval, are we confident this logic isn't derived from entrenched bias?

Executor Heth is proposing a single State where all Caldari are united under one nation, not eight corporations that each claim to be representing the Caldari (I am not saying their claims are invalid). If you removed the corporations, the threat of civil war is eliminated, as you do not have eight gargantuan interstellar entities that each have their own military. There will be no internecine warfare based on human greed and competition. You can still have a meritocracy in a unitary system. There will be many benefits, I'm sure, though I do not have the time to do my reading and list them all out here.

So, are we sure our dissent is rational, rather than not influenced by desiring the approval of other capsuleers, or coloured by our historical grievances with Executor Tibus Heth? Is this exactly what the megacorporations want you to think? Tibus Heth is proposing their abolition; when referring to realpolitik, they are naturally going to do anything to maintain power by spinning their own propaganda against the Provist proposal. Through this light, you are doing what those in power want you to do; vehemently disapprove of it rather than consider the other side of the argument.

Neither the Federated Union nor the Caldari State were around 300 years ago. They may not be in another 300. Any merits in what Tibus Heth has said has been lost in the noise of the echo chamber.

The Caldari are a relatively homogenized civilization; in my opinion, that is what makes the State megacorporations so efficient. It is far easier to administer a homogeneous population than a composite group of multiple populations with different expectations and world views. But that is the challenge of pluralism.

A single New Eden entity will have the difficulty of trying to administer a heterogeneous population. We can see the pitfalls of this with the current Federation.

Mr. Inhonores;

Tuulinen-haan has already addressed some core points. Let me simply highlight one of his comments, and expand on it: "...forge the State into a weapon for the sole purpose of striking at the Gallente."

This cannot be stressed enough. Through his attempt to prevent food and medical aid from being delivered to Caldari Prime, to his arrest of those who executives that resigned in protest, to this latest effort to dismantle the existing State, Heth has demonstrated that his objective is not a stronger Caldari people.His objective is to do harm to -- ideally, in his mind, destroy -- the Gallente Federation.

We of the State honor those who best serve the State and its ideals -- duty, productivity, competition. Heth has conflated duty with personal loyalty, and has replaced the other ideals with the desire to commit genocide.

Heth's State isn't the State I grew up in, and it's not the State I serve.

it did? I must have blinked and missed it.