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Player Features and Ideas Discussion

 
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[Odyssey] Tech 1 Battleships - Gallente

First post
Author
Prometheus Exenthal
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#1101 - 2013-04-10 10:12:29 UTC
@dez
The new Hyperion is basically an old Mega with a rep bonus.

should be fun

https://www.youtube.com/user/promsrage

DO YOUR JOBS, CCP DEVS. FIX THE GAME INSTEAD OF FKING IT

Dez Affinity
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#1102 - 2013-04-10 10:13:00 UTC
There should be a Features and Ideas Discussion forum but for only people who aren't worthless trash at this game.

Honestly over half the people in this forum just don't have any place discussing balance.
GallowsCalibrator
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#1103 - 2013-04-10 10:13:07 UTC
Omnathious Deninard wrote:

Why is 1k extra power grid needed when you take a gun off to put a DLA on?


I'd love to see this fit in your head where you're going with long range guns and long range sentries at once without sacrifice
(anyway, with just the sentries and three DDA's you're still pushing 700 ish DPS at 45k from napkin calculations with Gardes IIS, 550 ish at over 100km with Warden IIs).

Yun Kuai
Garoun Investment Bank
Gallente Federation
#1104 - 2013-04-10 10:13:09 UTC
CCP Rise:

Question for you. A lot of people are considering the new Domi to be a sentry boat due to the optimal and tracking bonus, but my question deals with heavy drones. You can take the hybrid bonus away, but you can't take the need to brawl at "no escape levels possible" away Twisted

All heavy drones have the same optimal and falloff ranges, with just their tracking (and damage types/speed) varying. Is there any chance Heavy drones could have thier optimal/falloff boosted to bring them out of Large smartbomb range when coupled with the Domi's new ship bonus to optimal range? It might be OP, but it would be something worth considering to give the domi a true advantage over the geddon.

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Gilbaron
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#1105 - 2013-04-10 10:14:29 UTC
Wacktopia wrote:
CCP Rise wrote:
One last thing to mention: Personally, I really think sentry drones should move some, even if its only to return to bay. We need to talk some more about this internally and look at ways it can actually be implemented, but a change to this effect could have a very positive impact on the Dominix and I don't think its a very unrealistic goal.


Making sentries move to return really makes a lot of sense, even if it is at 1km/s or something like that.

Having to be stationary, come back to pick up drones or abandon them completely when you can often only carry two sets (Ishtar/Domi/Gila) is a really massive drawback for no real gain vs the alternative weapons systems. They don't do more damage, they have very low tracking, and they can be blown up. Why use them over guns? No ammo... meh.

There is simply not enough reason to use sentries in PvP outside of some fairly edge cases at present..

1) Slowcats - they just dont really move anyway and can carry 1000's of spares.
2) Anti-Falcon - sentries dropped seem to work p. well to clear of falcons if you can get them agressed quickly.
3) POS bashing - so you don't need ammo.

There are at present not enough PvP options for sentries below slowcats because of the limitation you highlight.


we are using myrms, gilas end even prophecys to great effect for brawls
baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#1106 - 2013-04-10 10:14:47 UTC
Dez Affinity wrote:
then you get rid of utility high (and yes people do USE them, who doesn't use it?!?!) and another 110ish DPS from drones.



All I ever put into that high was a cyno or a neut and the cyno saw more action than the neut and was more usefull to have, things tend to run out of hull before they run out of cap. An extra low is going to be far more usefull.
Rubi Jackson
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#1107 - 2013-04-10 10:15:54 UTC
I thought I would post here to congratulate CCP on the openness with which these updates are taking place. Please keep this up, even if occasionally you have to sift through a thousand nerdy-whine posts - it's an excellent way of doing things.

I eagerly await all of the tiericide changes; even if some i'm not so keen on, the majority are simply excellent!

New Mega and Hype versions seem pretty good; better than the first iteration posted. Please consider giving the Domi a tiny bit of extra powergrid. :)
Dez Affinity
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#1108 - 2013-04-10 10:16:17 UTC
Yun Kuai wrote:


All heavy drones have the same optimal and falloff ranges, with just their tracking (and damage types/speed) varying. Is there any chance Heavy drones could have thier optimal/falloff boosted to bring them out of Large smartbomb range when coupled with the Domi's new ship bonus to optimal range? It might be OP, but it would be something worth considering to give the domi a true advantage over the geddon.



Drones orbit at the same distance depending on their size. So increasing their optimal doesn't really help because they will still orbit at the same distance it just means when they're mwding in they will hit earlier.

It would be overpowered for drones to have a 6km optimal and orbit at 6km though. You're right.
Rukhsana Uxor
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#1109 - 2013-04-10 10:18:04 UTC
baltec1 wrote:
Dez Affinity wrote:
then you get rid of utility high (and yes people do USE them, who doesn't use it?!?!) and another 110ish DPS from drones.



All I ever put into that high was a cyno or a neut and the cyno saw more action than the neut and was more usefull to have, things tend to run out of hull before they run out of cap. An extra low is going to be far more usefull.


Now you will be able to use hyper for that. Because he has one free high slot.

It make sense - Mega fleet attack BS, and hyper... For solo\small-scale with utility slot, 5 med and 5 heavy\sentry AND 175 drone bay :D
Josef Djugashvilis
#1110 - 2013-04-10 10:22:54 UTC
Moretic wrote:
also, I wanna know what changes they are making to the navy dom :P


ssssh ! CCP might hear you.

I do not want them to 'improve' my favourite ship.

This is not a signature.

Gypsio III
Questionable Ethics.
Ministry of Inappropriate Footwork
#1111 - 2013-04-10 10:23:50 UTC  |  Edited by: Gypsio III
The new Hyperion looks very sensible. It's strong on the small scale, it has the cap boosters to run a solid active tank and its guns don't suck too much cap, while retaining the option of a full-gank shield fit. It'll probably see some good use on the fleet scale despite the active bonus but that's fine, with nine turrets it'll have a small close-range damage/alpha advantage over the Rokh, at the cost of range and tank. I don't think it'll be overpowered, but it should be fairly easy to tone mobility, cap and/or fittings down if it is.

New Megathron looks good too. It's a bit odd that the race with the eight-lowslot BS is Gallente though, but I don't think it's a showstopper. Actually I think a perfectly viable Mega could be achieved without moving the highslot to a lowslot, but there you go.
Kagura Nikon
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#1112 - 2013-04-10 10:26:26 UTC  |  Edited by: Kagura Nikon
Much more impressive this time CCP RISE, although I am a bit fearful as well that you might have stepped over that while line of overpower :P

Lets see.. But this is much more gallente now. Minmatar are a bit more minmatarish as well. We just need to test and ensure all ships are balanced among themselves.

Example of my worries (just because I have focused on number crunshing thsoe 2 firsT). Hyperion is as agile and a bit lighter than temepst and only 5 km less fast. But has way more firepower and a POWERFUL tank bonus and a superior slot layout....

I know the tempest is attack BS Now, and I am grateful, but should be the combat hyperion be so powerful compared to other battleships?


Example in numbers :

Battleship Skill Bonuses:
+5% bonus to Large Projectile Turret rate of fire / rep bonus.... feels almsot like an extra bonus on this comare
+5% bonus to Large Projectile Turret damage /10% damage hybrids superior to hyperion

Slot layout: 8H, 5M, 6L; 6 turrets agains 7/5/7 superior layut to hyperion (why not mvoe one of tempests higghs to low or mid)

Defense (shields / armor / hull) : they are ok between themselves and respectign racial flavor

Mobility (max velocity / agility / mass / align time): 120 (agaisn 115 SLIGht tempest advantage) / .12 (agaisnt .11( hyperion advantage) / 101050000(-2250000) / 16.81s(-.37s)
Drones (bandwidth / bay): 75 / 75 / FAR FAR greater hyperion advantage

Signature radius: 360(+20) // ok here remaisn the temepst real advantage.

"If brute force does not solve your problem....  then you are  surely not using enough!"

Suicide Smith
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#1113 - 2013-04-10 10:26:55 UTC
I really, Really, like the changes to the Hyperion. I don't use the Mega enough to really comment, but from the stats it looks good too. But for the Hype, losing a Gun, gaining some Hybrid Bonus, and gaining a full flight of Heavys is a trade I'll gladly make.

Good Job CCP Rise and the Balance Team!

In not only coming up with a great balance, but in taking the feedback :)
Omnathious Deninard
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#1114 - 2013-04-10 10:29:48 UTC
GallowsCalibrator wrote:
Omnathious Deninard wrote:

Why is 1k extra power grid needed when you take a gun off to put a DLA on?


I'd love to see this fit in your head where you're going with long range guns and long range sentries at once without sacrifice
(anyway, with just the sentries and three DDA's you're still pushing 700 ish DPS at 45k from napkin calculations with Gardes IIS, 550 ish at over 100km with Warden IIs).


Curator II 1 DLA
Bouncer II 2 DLAs
Warden II 3 DLAs

That is quite a bit of sacrifice, being as to do this you have to use long range Railgun charges, which penalize tracking and do considerably less damage.

If you don't follow the rules, neither will I.

IceDe4d
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#1115 - 2013-04-10 10:30:09 UTC
hmm i would like it more if the mega would keep 8 high and gets 7 lows because i feel 8 lowslots for the basic mega is just too much and you still have the navy mega and vindi and they would need changes too if you give the mega 8 lows.
It looks like i will fly more hyper in the future if this are the final changes but i have to say the aktiv rep bonus is not that usefull anymore at least for my pvp in low sec.
CCP Rise
C C P
C C P Alliance
#1116 - 2013-04-10 10:36:21 UTC
Just updated the Megathron CPU slightly, it had picked up a large increase for the last iteration that I forgot to remove from the new stats.

@ccp_rise

Roime
Mea Culpa.
Shadow Cartel
#1117 - 2013-04-10 10:36:45 UTC
New version of Mega with 6 slot armor tank, 2 magstabs and both dmg rigs takes it to peak 1340 with Void on overheat (1498 with HH IIs).

Alternatively:

[Megathron, Odyssey]
Magnetic Field Stabilizer II
Overdrive Injector System II
Large Ancillary Armor Repairer, Nanite Repair Paste
1600mm Reinforced Rolled Tungsten Plates I
Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II
Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II
Damage Control II

100MN Microwarpdrive II
Heavy Capacitor Booster II, Navy Cap Booster 800
Warp Scrambler II
Stasis Webifier II

Neutron Blaster Cannon II, Void L
Neutron Blaster Cannon II, Void L
Neutron Blaster Cannon II, Void L
Neutron Blaster Cannon II, Void L
Neutron Blaster Cannon II, Void L
Neutron Blaster Cannon II, Void L
Neutron Blaster Cannon II, Void L

Large Auxiliary Nano Pump I
Large Nanobot Accelerator I
Large Hybrid Burst Aerator I


Hammerhead II x5
Vespa EC-600 x5
Warrior II x5

1253 peak dps, 838 dps w/Null no drones
75.6K EHP, 616 hp/s heated nanite reps (115.4K theory EHP after 8 cycles)
1775 m/s when you floor it

is not bad



.

GallowsCalibrator
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#1118 - 2013-04-10 10:37:54 UTC
Omnathious Deninard wrote:
GallowsCalibrator wrote:
Omnathious Deninard wrote:

Why is 1k extra power grid needed when you take a gun off to put a DLA on?


I'd love to see this fit in your head where you're going with long range guns and long range sentries at once without sacrifice
(anyway, with just the sentries and three DDA's you're still pushing 700 ish DPS at 45k from napkin calculations with Gardes IIS, 550 ish at over 100km with Warden IIs).


Curator II 1 DLA
Bouncer II 2 DLAs
Warden II 3 DLAs

That is quite a bit of sacrifice, being as to do this you have to use long range Railgun charges, which penalize tracking and do considerably less damage.


Not sounding particularly bad to hit 550 @ 100 for 3 highs and drones (Although admittedly, Bouncers seem to be more of a sweet spot.) You've still got 3 - 4 utility highs, which is enough for a potent cap chain with buddies and remote reps, as an example - something other long range battleships simply do not get the option of.

Or, you fill the highs with your favourite weapon system, bring a selection of heavies, use your ample mids for tackle, web MWD, MJD , Cap Injector; And enough lows for a reasonable armour tank + damage mods.

Or go full neut Killdozer.

Etc.

Etc.

The choice is yours!
culo duro
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#1119 - 2013-04-10 10:39:30 UTC
CCP Rise wrote:
New versions of Hyperion and Megathron posted in the OP - let me know what you guys think.


still think that Active bonus on the Hyperion gotta go, i just can't see it being viable for anything more than teeeeny tiny gangs.

I've starting blogging http://www.epvpc.blogspot.comĀ 

Dez Affinity
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#1120 - 2013-04-10 10:39:34 UTC
Roime wrote:
New version of Mega with 6 slot armor tank, 2 magstabs and both dmg rigs takes it to peak 1340 with Void on overheat (1498 with HH IIs).

Alternatively:

[Megathron, Odyssey]
Magnetic Field Stabilizer II
Overdrive Injector System II
Large Ancillary Armor Repairer, Nanite Repair Paste
1600mm Reinforced Rolled Tungsten Plates I
Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II
Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II
Damage Control II

100MN Microwarpdrive II
Heavy Capacitor Booster II, Navy Cap Booster 800
Warp Scrambler II
Stasis Webifier II

Neutron Blaster Cannon II, Void L
Neutron Blaster Cannon II, Void L
Neutron Blaster Cannon II, Void L
Neutron Blaster Cannon II, Void L
Neutron Blaster Cannon II, Void L
Neutron Blaster Cannon II, Void L
Neutron Blaster Cannon II, Void L

Large Auxiliary Nano Pump I
Large Nanobot Accelerator I
Large Hybrid Burst Aerator I


Hammerhead II x5
Vespa EC-600 x5
Warrior II x5

1253 peak dps, 838 dps w/Null no drones
75.6K EHP, 616 hp/s heated nanite reps (115.4K theory EHP after 8 cycles)
1775 m/s when you floor it

is not bad





um wtf