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What kind of CIWS do capital ships have?
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Kirjava
Lothian Enterprises
#1 - 2013-03-31 05:48:41 UTC
Now from the perspective of the game balance, it makes perfect sense that say a Dreadnought does not have the capacity to kill a frigate, for from a lore perspective it does not. Modern Carriers and Warships have Close in Weapons Systems, (CIWS) which are from the Goalkeeper automated radar turrets to intercept incoming missiles to Anti Missile Missile Systems (AMMS).

So... taking cues from Battlestar Galactica, surely the Titans at least have defensive grids of flak cannons to take down those pesky small ships and missiles? 18km long and only a Doomsday and Citadel launchers, but no rapid fire flak turrets and light missile launchers? Same with Dreadnaughts really, larger the ship the faster they would lock in real life on smaller targets, so a Titan should lock a Frigate faster than a Frigate could. (more sensors, redundant sensors and just having sensor clusters further away from each other for triangulation.

[center]Haruhiists - Overloading Out of Pod discussions since 2007. /人◕‿‿◕人\ Unban Saede![/center]
Arline Kley
PIE Inc.
Khimi Harar
#2 - 2013-03-31 07:23:42 UTC
While from a IRL sense, this would be the case - my brother once caught a fast boat going between North Africa and southern Spain on an Aircraft Carrier's radar - from a game balance view-point it wouldn't.

Capital Ships are designed to be heavily guarded as they are almost an "all your eggs in one basket" deal. Giving them the ability to counter any threat made against them solo would ruin the game - Why bother with the rest of the fleet if the Titan has the ability to kill everything anyway?

From the sensor side, think of it that the computers are designed not for direct combat, but for fleet management, therefore while you might have an ungodly amount of sensors on the thing, most of them are there to tell you that your arse end of the ship isn't about to smack into another ship, rather than helping you target the enemy faster.

"For it was said they had become like those peculiar demons, which dwell in matter but in whom no light may be found." - Father Grigori, Ravens 3:57
Malcanis
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
#3 - 2013-03-31 20:15:00 UTC
Kirjava wrote:
Now from the perspective of the game balance, it makes perfect sense that say a Dreadnought does not have the capacity to kill a frigate, for from a lore perspective it does not. Modern Carriers and Warships have Close in Weapons Systems, (CIWS) which are from the Goalkeeper automated radar turrets to intercept incoming missiles to Anti Missile Missile Systems (AMMS).

So... taking cues from Battlestar Galactica, surely the Titans at least have defensive grids of flak cannons to take down those pesky small ships and missiles? 18km long and only a Doomsday and Citadel launchers, but no rapid fire flak turrets and light missile launchers? Same with Dreadnaughts really, larger the ship the faster they would lock in real life on smaller targets, so a Titan should lock a Frigate faster than a Frigate could. (more sensors, redundant sensors and just having sensor clusters further away from each other for triangulation.


In practical terms, this role is filled by smartbombs.

"Just remember later that I warned against any change to jump ranges or fatigue. You earned whats coming."

Grath Telkin, 11.10.2016
YuuKnow
The Scope
#4 - 2013-04-05 23:14:52 UTC
Point defense systems on a large ship? ... THATS BRILLIANT!!!

seriously though, I remember when Homeworld2 came out the lack of Point Defense was the driving point of a Mod (Point Defense System) which became the most popular mod of the franchise. Still one of the funnest FIS games+mods I've ever played. However, it doesn't do much for gameplay balance for Eve.

yk
Eli Green
The Arrow Project
#5 - 2013-04-07 01:44:31 UTC
Malcanis wrote:
Kirjava wrote:
Now from the perspective of the game balance, it makes perfect sense that say a Dreadnought does not have the capacity to kill a frigate, for from a lore perspective it does not. Modern Carriers and Warships have Close in Weapons Systems, (CIWS) which are from the Goalkeeper automated radar turrets to intercept incoming missiles to Anti Missile Missile Systems (AMMS).

So... taking cues from Battlestar Galactica, surely the Titans at least have defensive grids of flak cannons to take down those pesky small ships and missiles? 18km long and only a Doomsday and Citadel launchers, but no rapid fire flak turrets and light missile launchers? Same with Dreadnaughts really, larger the ship the faster they would lock in real life on smaller targets, so a Titan should lock a Frigate faster than a Frigate could. (more sensors, redundant sensors and just having sensor clusters further away from each other for triangulation.


In practical terms, this role is filled by smartbombs.


This 100% There was a time when dreads and titans had drone bays to perform exactly this task but they were removed a year or so ago for balance.

wumbo
Fredfredbug4
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#6 - 2013-04-07 02:55:50 UTC
We all know that the reason is for balance, but what could be the reason for why there are no point defense systems in the lore?

Perhaps capital ships are expected to never be without a decently sized support fleet. The support fleet will take the job of stopping smaller ships from getting under the capital ships defenses.

Watch_ Fred Fred Frederation_ and stop [u]cryptozoologist[/u]! Fight against the brutal genocide of fictional creatures across New Eden! Is that a metaphor? Probably not, but the fru-fru- people will sure love it!
YuuKnow
The Scope
#7 - 2013-04-08 20:45:48 UTC  |  Edited by: YuuKnow
Fredfredbug4 wrote:
We all know that the reason is for balance, but what could be the reason for why there are no point defense systems in the lore?

Perhaps capital ships are expected to never be without a decently sized support fleet. The support fleet will take the job of stopping smaller ships from getting under the capital ships defenses.



Yes and also fleet strategy is that ships by choice decide to equip maximal guns. Think about it. You could easily choose to fit 4 large, and 4 medium guns on your Bship. However, you've decided that its more important for you to break the dps bank than small targets.

So the option is out there to fit "point defense" in the form of small mounts on larger ships, but you willingly don't. Thats why ships don't have any point defense.

If CCP wanted to be less restrictive on the ship fitting they could always change the ship bonuses to incompass all gun sizes (for example, change the Brutix bonus to include all hybrid guns, not just medium hybrid guns).

yk