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Why your CSM8 vote doesn't matter...

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Malcanis
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
#241 - 2013-04-08 18:02:58 UTC
Ace Uoweme wrote:
Malcanis wrote:
Or you could handwave the opportunity away with an attempt to deflect your responsibility by making some barely relevent one-liner


Not like budding CSMs have a busy work load, right? Pirate


Not like you walked right into the same wall again there.

"Just remember later that I warned against any change to jump ranges or fatigue. You earned whats coming."

Grath Telkin, 11.10.2016
Aracimia Wolfe
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#242 - 2013-04-08 18:11:33 UTC


I hear persistent rumours that a Vote For Malcanis, may or indeed, may not, be a vote for bacon.

I suggest everyone should try it and find out.

Kill it with Fire!

Eternum Praetorian
Doomheim
#243 - 2013-04-08 18:19:38 UTC
Artctura wrote:

I am simply postulating that while you believe the former is true which is hopeless, I believe it's the latter and it can be fixed.



I do not think the former is true. You are just another person with reading comprehension problems. If the end result is the same, then to the individuals effected... the cause matters very little. No one gives a **** whether or not CSM's are willfully out to screw over certain forms of gameplay, or if they are just supporting their own agendas at the cost of other forms of gameplay.


No one cares.
The result is the same. Clear enough?

[center]The EVE Gateway Blog[/center] [center]One Of EVE Online's Ultimate Resources[/center]
Snow Axe
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#244 - 2013-04-08 18:52:20 UTC
Eternum Praetorian wrote:
You can't prove that subs are not at an all time high via the growing trend of multiple accounts either. Now can you? I however have years of subjective experience, being that I have personally recruited at least 2,000 pilots into various corporations and alliances. I have dealt with individuals on forums that you have never even heard of and have been in contact with more then my share of pilots on a personal level for somewhere around 5 years.


Hey. Hey. Hey. Hey. Dumb guy. Hey.

If you make a claim, it's on you to prove that it's true.

Just FYI.

"Look any reason why you need to talk like that? I have now reported you. I dont need to listen to your bad tone. If you cant have a grown up conversation then leave the thread["
DarthNefarius
Minmatar Heavy Industries
#245 - 2013-04-08 18:57:49 UTC  |  Edited by: DarthNefarius
Snow Axe wrote:
Eternum Praetorian wrote:
You can't prove that subs are not at an all time high via the growing trend of multiple accounts either. Now can you? I however have years of subjective experience, being that I have personally recruited at least 2,000 pilots into various corporations and alliances. I have dealt with individuals on forums that you have never even heard of and have been in contact with more then my share of pilots on a personal level for somewhere around 5 years.


Hey. Hey. Hey. Hey. Dumb guy. Hey.

If you make a claim, it's on you to prove that it's true.

Just FYI.


I'll prove its true the day after CCP releases the numbers of how many subscribers have multiple accounts over the years
An' then Chicken@little.com, he come scramblin outta the    Terminal room screaming "The system's crashing! The system's    crashing!" -Uncle RAMus, 'Tales for Cyberpsychotic Children'
Dave Stark
#246 - 2013-04-08 18:59:01 UTC
DarthNefarius wrote:
Snow Axe wrote:
Eternum Praetorian wrote:
You can't prove that subs are not at an all time high via the growing trend of multiple accounts either. Now can you? I however have years of subjective experience, being that I have personally recruited at least 2,000 pilots into various corporations and alliances. I have dealt with individuals on forums that you have never even heard of and have been in contact with more then my share of pilots on a personal level for somewhere around 5 years.


Hey. Hey. Hey. Hey. Dumb guy. Hey.

If you make a claim, it's on you to prove that it's true.

Just FYI.


I'll prove its true the day after CCP releases the numbers of how many subscribers have multiple accounts


that would imply CCP knows how many people have multiple accounts.
DarthNefarius
Minmatar Heavy Industries
#247 - 2013-04-08 19:03:20 UTC
Dave Stark wrote:

that would imply CCP knows how many people have multiple accounts.


I'm implying they'd be stupid not to have a good close/idea
An' then Chicken@little.com, he come scramblin outta the    Terminal room screaming "The system's crashing! The system's    crashing!" -Uncle RAMus, 'Tales for Cyberpsychotic Children'
Dave Stark
#248 - 2013-04-08 19:06:09 UTC
DarthNefarius wrote:
Dave Stark wrote:

that would imply CCP knows how many people have multiple accounts.


I'm implying they'd be stupid not to have a good close/idea


i remember hearing they think players have an average of 2-3 accounts, but i have no idea if they've ever said what proportion of players have >1 accounts. that would be an interesting figure to know, though.
Artctura
SUNDERING
Goonswarm Federation
#249 - 2013-04-08 19:12:48 UTC
Eternum Praetorian wrote:
Artctura wrote:

I am simply postulating that while you believe the former is true which is hopeless, I believe it's the latter and it can be fixed.



I do not think the former is true. You are just another person with reading comprehension problems. If the end result is the same, then to the individuals effected... the cause matters very little. No one gives a **** whether or not CSM's are willfully out to screw over certain forms of gameplay, or if they are just supporting their own agendas at the cost of other forms of gameplay.


No one cares.
The result is the same. Clear enough?


If you don't think the former is true, then the issue is simple one of communication and accessibility of the appropriate players to the CSM and the willingness of the CSM to seek them out. It's a communication issue. It's fixable. And since we both agree that it doesn't have anything to do with the particular CSM's ideals as much as it does with their willingness to engage, maybe you'd be willing to push on CSM 8 to make sure the communication does happen.

Whether or not it gets fixed is a different story, and that depends on the CSM and the players working together instead of pissing on each other. Simply bitching about a problem instead of working to solve it does nothing except further degrade the process and make those willing to listen even less willing to do so.

Artctura for CSM 2013
Snow Axe
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#250 - 2013-04-08 19:14:45 UTC
DarthNefarius wrote:
I'll prove its true the day after CCP releases the numbers of how many subscribers have multiple accounts over the years


Right, that would be an essential piece of information one would need before a claim like this could be made. Pretty stupid to make such a claim without it, no?

"Look any reason why you need to talk like that? I have now reported you. I dont need to listen to your bad tone. If you cant have a grown up conversation then leave the thread["
Malcanis
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
#251 - 2013-04-08 19:46:28 UTC
Aracimia Wolfe wrote:


I hear persistent rumours that a Vote For Malcanis, may or indeed, may not, be a vote for bacon.

I suggest everyone should try it and find out.



Confirming that I am PRO BACON

"Just remember later that I warned against any change to jump ranges or fatigue. You earned whats coming."

Grath Telkin, 11.10.2016
Eternum Praetorian
Doomheim
#252 - 2013-04-08 19:55:19 UTC
Artctura wrote:


If you don't think the former is true, then the issue is simple one of communication and accessibility of the appropriate players to the CSM and the willingness of the CSM to seek them out. It's a communication issue. It's fixable. And since we both agree that it doesn't have anything to do with the particular CSM's ideals as much as it does with their willingness to engage, maybe you'd be willing to push on CSM 8 to make sure the communication does happen.

Whether or not it gets fixed is a different story, and that depends on the CSM and the players working together instead of pissing on each other. Simply bitching about a problem instead of working to solve it does nothing except further degrade the process and make those willing to listen even less willing to do so.



Nothing gets fixed because the CSM reps that get in as a result of gaming the system cannot be bothered to "better their communication" with the common folk who love forms of game play not their own. Also, it is not the job of the player base to not **** on the CSM's, it is however the CSM's job as representatives to not **** on the players back. So the fault is still theirs in both cases.

[center]The EVE Gateway Blog[/center] [center]One Of EVE Online's Ultimate Resources[/center]
Eternum Praetorian
Doomheim
#253 - 2013-04-08 20:00:32 UTC  |  Edited by: Eternum Praetorian
Snow Axe wrote:
Eternum Praetorian wrote:
You can't prove that subs are not at an all time high via the growing trend of multiple accounts either. Now can you? I however have years of subjective experience, being that I have personally recruited at least 2,000 pilots into various corporations and alliances. I have dealt with individuals on forums that you have never even heard of and have been in contact with more then my share of pilots on a personal level for somewhere around 5 years.


Hey. Hey. Hey. Hey. Dumb guy. Hey.

If you make a claim, it's on you to prove that it's true.

Just FYI.


People who hide behind that argument always fail to mention one thing. You made a claim too. All you can prove is that the information does not exist via a quick google search. That does not instantly make the notion a non- realistic-possibility. Since were are arguing cliche's ill hit you with another one.


"The absence of evidence is not instant proof that something is not a fact, it is merely the absence of evidence. "



Evidence mind you that has been deliberately not released to the public by a multi-million-dollar corporation. I'd love to verify my subjective experiences in game (over several years) with hard data supplied by ccp, but the men holding said information won't let me.

[center]The EVE Gateway Blog[/center] [center]One Of EVE Online's Ultimate Resources[/center]
Dave Stark
#254 - 2013-04-08 20:02:26 UTC
Malcanis wrote:
Aracimia Wolfe wrote:


I hear persistent rumours that a Vote For Malcanis, may or indeed, may not, be a vote for bacon.

I suggest everyone should try it and find out.



Confirming that I am PRO BACON


why did you not put this in your sig? you'd have been top of my ballot.

damnit malcanis!
Sofia Wolf
Ubuntu Inc.
The Fourth District
#255 - 2013-04-08 20:05:49 UTC
DarthNefarius wrote:
Because you didn't vote.
Now go vote &make it matter P
...No Votes Nerf Boats... so vote in the CSM electionsAttentionLol
http://community.eveonline.com/community/csm/vote/


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xIraCchPDhk#t=2m3s

Twisted

Jessica Danikov > EVE is your real life. the rest is fantasy. caught in a corporation. no escape from banality. open up yours eyes, peer through pod good and seeeeeee. I'm just a poor pilot, I need no sympathy. because I'm easy scam, easy go, little isk, little know. anyway the solar wind blows...
Malcanis
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
#256 - 2013-04-08 20:20:22 UTC
Eternum Praetorian wrote:
Also, it is not the job of the player base to not **** on the CSM's, it is however the CSM's job as representatives to not **** on the players back. So the fault is still theirs in both cases.



Wrong in both cases. The forum TOS show you wrong on the first point; and I challenge you to point to the part of the white paper that says CSMs aren't allowed to answer back.

"Just remember later that I warned against any change to jump ranges or fatigue. You earned whats coming."

Grath Telkin, 11.10.2016
Malcanis
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
#257 - 2013-04-08 20:23:59 UTC
Dave Stark wrote:
Malcanis wrote:
Aracimia Wolfe wrote:


I hear persistent rumours that a Vote For Malcanis, may or indeed, may not, be a vote for bacon.

I suggest everyone should try it and find out.



Confirming that I am PRO BACON


why did you not put this in your sig? you'd have been top of my ballot.

damnit malcanis!



I thought you knew.

"Just remember later that I warned against any change to jump ranges or fatigue. You earned whats coming."

Grath Telkin, 11.10.2016
Eternum Praetorian
Doomheim
#258 - 2013-04-08 20:52:10 UTC  |  Edited by: Eternum Praetorian
Malcanis wrote:
Eternum Praetorian wrote:
Also, it is not the job of the player base to not **** on the CSM's, it is however the CSM's job as representatives to not **** on the players back. So the fault is still theirs in both cases.



Wrong in both cases. The forum TOS show you wrong on the first point; and I challenge you to point to the part of the white paper that says CSMs aren't allowed to answer back.



Um... the word in "*******'****************************" is a short four letter word for urination . lol Their job is not to urinate on the players back. So not only am I not wrong in both cases, and not only have you failed to even comprehend what I typed, you, mr CSM candidate, have proven yourself to be even stupider then I imagined you to be. Excellent.


And I guess this is why your CSM8 votes won't count, CSM reading comprehension is to low to understand what the players are typing.

[center]The EVE Gateway Blog[/center] [center]One Of EVE Online's Ultimate Resources[/center]
Mag's
Azn Empire
#259 - 2013-04-08 21:07:56 UTC
Eternum Praetorian wrote:
Mag's wrote:
Ace Uoweme wrote:
Mag's wrote:
You have no evidence to show that, either way. But it's irrelevant to the point and his point still stands. Account numbers are at an all time high. Blink


Nice try, but the high numbers = more alt accounts.

Allowing ISBox to multibox 20+ accounts ensures it.
Nice try at what exactly? I'm merely pointing out the fact you have no evidence and the fact it makes no difference to the fact, that subscription figures are at an all time high. Blink


You can't prove that subs are not at an all time high via the growing trend of multiple accounts either. Now can you? I however have years of subjective experience, being that I have personally recruited at least 2,000 pilots into various corporations and alliances. I have dealt with individuals on forums that you have never even heard of and have been in contact with more then my share of pilots on a personal level for somewhere around 5 years.


I have worked on supercarrier production operations. I have been asked to be a guest speaker at certain notable eve schools. I have dealt with mission runners and -10 pilots, rookies and 100m sp tycoons. And through it all, permeating all manner of professions in EVE, the change over the past couple of years has been very noticeable. Everyone and everybody are all getting that second account, at least. It is just "in style" now more then it used to be. Many of my old friends now have 3,4 and 5 accounts. Some have more.



So when you say "find me a website that proves it"
I say...

Maybe log in and go talk to some people. You know... engage them a little. Then you too can benefit from eve's social medium.




The number of alt accounts making up EVE sub's will never be something CCP will allow to go public. It makes for bad publicity. To learn that a sizable % of your player base is a supporting toon and not a real person would be bad advertising. This is information you have to acquire in game, over years of above average sociable interactions. If you do not have such interactions... then you sir have no room to speak.

To simply say "it is not so because it is not on the internet" is the new age stupidity of wiki- warriors.
That's a lot of words to show you only have anecdotal evidence, regarding a point that means nothing to the fact that subs are at an all time high. Also it proves nothing regarding alt accounts, but thanks for posting. Big smile

Destination SkillQueue:- It's like assuming the Lions will ignore you in the Savannah, if you're small, fat and look helpless.
Malcanis
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
#260 - 2013-04-08 21:11:36 UTC
Eternum Praetorian wrote:
Malcanis wrote:
Eternum Praetorian wrote:
They must be concocting strange ideas out of no where.


Like the idea that alt accounts are more prevelant than they were a year or two ago?



Here is another well mannered CSM (want-to-be) being constructive, and giving the player base well informed information in a respectful and dignified manner.





Well I've asked you to cite your source and instead you just duck and evade and throw out passive aggressive insults, and whine when you get called on them.

If you din't simply make this "fact" up, then tell us where you got it from so we can analyse & comment on it.

"Just remember later that I warned against any change to jump ranges or fatigue. You earned whats coming."

Grath Telkin, 11.10.2016