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Caldari Prime now a DMZ

Author
Diana Kim
State Protectorate
Caldari State
#21 - 2013-04-03 04:23:33 UTC
Trensk Mikakka wrote:
Diana Kim wrote:
Lialus Raithe wrote:
Diana Kim wrote:
DMZ... this was a weak and indecent move, but still it is for better of our people.

Luckily, Gallente Prime and other gallentean territories are not DMZ. We must use it to retaliate them there. While gallenteans have weapons, none of DMZ declarations will provide safety to Home Planet.
Gallentes already show that they break treaties, and we must force them to never break it again.


Just this once, this one time do you think you could be silent and let a step forward be appreciated for what it is?

I will appreciate when gallentes will pay for their atrocity when they dropped our titan on Caldari Prime, killing millions of innocents.


One, we kinda asked for it when we put the damn Titan there, and two, MAYBE you could just shut up and let a fragging DMZ go. There's plenty of other systems to fight over. I fight for The State, but this is just insane.

One, this was OUR Titan in OUR territory. According to your words, I can come to your home and smash your nose, if I see through window that you placed your gun on your table. Probably I should do it to make you reconsider your words.

Two, MAYBE you will READ first what others write before displaying yourself as utter ignorant spitting some ridiculous nonsence? And maybe you stop behave ridiculously like I was trying to 'stop' or 'prevent' DMZ, and maybe you will decide to read again what I has written and realise, if you have something left to realise with, that I was suggesting to strike exactly, following your words, 'plenty of other systems'?

Honored are the dead, for their legacy guides us.

In memory of Tibus Heth, Caldari State Executor YC110-115, Hero and Patriot.

Anabella Rella
Gradient
Electus Matari
#22 - 2013-04-03 05:21:59 UTC
Maybe now that calm and moderate heads have prevailed we can consign the likes of Kim and Heth to the scrapheap of history. It's good to see that diplomacy still has a chance to succeed in our violent and sometimes arbitrary universe. It's sad that so many had to die before both sides in this conflict could come to the bargaining table.

This gives me a bit of hope that even the most seemingly intractable situations can be peacefully resolved.

When the world is running down, you make the best of what's still around.

Makoto Priano
Kirkinen-Arataka Transhuman Zenith Consulting Ltd.
Arataka Research Consortium
#23 - 2013-04-03 05:30:24 UTC
There is a great deal more that needs to be done before the Provists can safely be considered a non-issue.

Itsukame-Zainou Hyperspatial Inquiries: exploring the edge of the known, advancing the state of the art. Would you like to know more?

Pieter Tuulinen
Societas Imperialis Sceptri Coronaeque
Khimi Harar
#24 - 2013-04-03 05:47:20 UTC  |  Edited by: Pieter Tuulinen
James Syagrius wrote:
Pieter Tuulinen wrote:
Makoto Priano wrote:
So long as Caldari Prime is administered by the State, demilitarization seems an acceptable solution. I worry, however, that this deal will collapse if partisans begin reprisal strikes, whether Provist, Black Eagle, or unaffiliated forces.


Let's hope the Insurgency stands down now. If it doesn't, well it's a game that two can play.

If there is no occupation there is no need for an insurgency. If people have a voice in the government they won't have to resort to violence for redress. But if you would like to continue to trade terror for terror then so be it.


I intervened when the Caldari Navy was attacked, and after the battle delivered an Industrial full of aid supplies. I then rescued both Federal and State citizens from the ground of Home no more than three hours after Shiigeru's death. I've put my crew and my assets on the line fighting Heth's cronies and I've escorted eight Freighters worth of other people's goods.

Who are the REAL humanitarians here, Sygarius? What have YOU done?

Of course, as you say, I'm also the other side of that coin. I would be very disappointed if it should come back to trading terror for terror, but that option will always be in a drawer, waiting.

For the first time since I started the conversation, he looks me dead in the eye. In his gaze are steel jackhammers, quiet vengeance, a hundred thousand orbital bombs frozen in still life.

Xindi Kraid
Itsukame-Zainou Hyperspatial Inquiries Ltd.
Arataka Research Consortium
#25 - 2013-04-03 06:54:05 UTC
Now that I think about it more. I definitely wonder if the Federation could be convinced to make the entire Luminaire system a DMZ. While I am quite liberal in my views (I do hail from Ishukone after all), and am willing to trust A Gallente; given the history between our people, I am much more hesitant to trust THE Gallente. Is the Federation Navy is still able to operate in Luminaire, that does give them something over us; some parity would likely be much better for long term peace, and that means both navies or neither, and neither will lead to less tension and less debris falling on civilians.
Pieter Tuulinen
Societas Imperialis Sceptri Coronaeque
Khimi Harar
#26 - 2013-04-03 07:20:31 UTC
To be honest, I'm quite happy to allow the Gallente Navy to operate freely in Luminaire. Let's be honest, if it comes down to it and they find themselves in a position of needing to deploy fleet assets over Home, it means things have broken down so badly that they'll simply break any armistice.

When have we ever fought for any other part of the Luminaire system? This gives us Home and it does so in a way that is actually in the Gallente interest to maintain.

For the first time since I started the conversation, he looks me dead in the eye. In his gaze are steel jackhammers, quiet vengeance, a hundred thousand orbital bombs frozen in still life.

Anja Suorsa
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#27 - 2013-04-03 08:36:57 UTC
Whilst this appears to be good news, I remain skeptical as to what the Federation truly gains from this agreement. I'll refrain from personal comment until the full agreement is available for perusal.
Korsavius
Revenent Defence Corperation
#28 - 2013-04-03 08:43:35 UTC
Hopefully this is a sign of better things to come. With Caldari Prime recognized as belonging to the Caldari State, perhaps we can look inwards and resolve creeping issues that continue to perpetually hold us down...

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Xindi Kraid
Itsukame-Zainou Hyperspatial Inquiries Ltd.
Arataka Research Consortium
#29 - 2013-04-03 08:52:44 UTC
There seems to have been something of a schism between the CPD and CEP, so things may be coming to a head soon regarding internal matters.
Aelisha
Societas Imperialis Sceptri Coronaeque
Khimi Harar
#30 - 2013-04-03 09:41:48 UTC
Anja Suorsa wrote:
Whilst this appears to be good news, I remain skeptical as to what the Federation truly gains from this agreement. I'll refrain from personal comment until the full agreement is available for perusal.


The Federation comes out looking more or less clean, give or take a few decades of retrospect and revisionist history. But this is as good an outcome that we could have expected with the loss of orbital control.

It may be to the Federation's advantage that we are now forced to look inwards, but it may be to ours that we do so swiftly and decisively. As much as I am loathe to give advantage to an enemy of the State, the current state of affairs cannot be allowed to continue.

The less infighting we as capsuleers engage in, the swifter we may resolve any further CPD overstepping. Our part in this is small but significant, and we must present a united front in support of the CEP at large. Sukuuvestaa and Ishukone have shown their hands with their current dealings with the Federation in spite of Heth's clear opposition. It's time for the other four who voted in favour of the DMZ resolution to come forwards in act as well as politics.

We are a corporate State, not a military State. We follow our merited peers in the hierarchy presented by such a structure, not generals or issue-driven agendas. One State for merit, profit, pride and the people. Six of our representative Mega Corporations remember this, two of whom have gone to great pains to action their support of the current crisis resolution. It is time the Executor took his leave, while he still has goodwill with some of our kind and his countrymen. There's still good in what he has done, but it is best to retire in dignity, than continue into decrepitude.

CEO of the Achura-Waschi Exchange

Intaki Reborn

Independent Capsuleer

Anja Suorsa
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#31 - 2013-04-03 10:33:58 UTC  |  Edited by: Anja Suorsa
Aelisha wrote:
Anja Suorsa wrote:
Whilst this appears to be good news, I remain skeptical as to what the Federation truly gains from this agreement. I'll refrain from personal comment until the full agreement is available for perusal.


The Federation comes out looking more or less clean, give or take a few decades of retrospect and revisionist history. But this is as good an outcome that we could have expected with the loss of orbital control.

It may be to the Federation's advantage that we are now forced to look inwards, but it may be to ours that we do so swiftly and decisively. As much as I am loathe to give advantage to an enemy of the State, the current state of affairs cannot be allowed to continue.

The less infighting we as capsuleers engage in, the swifter we may resolve any further CPD overstepping. Our part in this is small but significant, and we must present a united front in support of the CEP at large. Sukuuvestaa and Ishukone have shown their hands with their current dealings with the Federation in spite of Heth's clear opposition. It's time for the other four who voted in favour of the DMZ resolution to come forwards in act as well as politics.

We are a corporate State, not a military State. We follow our merited peers in the hierarchy presented by such a structure, not generals or issue-driven agendas. One State for merit, profit, pride and the people. Six of our representative Mega Corporations remember this, two of whom have gone to great pains to action their support of the current crisis resolution. It is time the Executor took his leave, while he still has goodwill with some of our kind and his countrymen. There's still good in what he has done, but it is best to retire in dignity, than continue into decrepitude.


I appreciate your candor, Montenagre-haani. For me however, the election promises of Roden are still fresh in the mind. I understand the Federal voters are fickle creatures but I cannot believe they would allow him to forget his pledge to 'recover Caldari Prime' so swiftly, especially when they have emerged in such a strong position following their victory in orbit over Home. Why the sudden benevolence?

If it is indeed a genuine agreement and the Federation come out looking clean, as you said. Then my skepticism is misplaced and I will be pleasantly surprised. I'm not prepared to concede this just yet though. The devil is, after-all, in the detail.

With regards the Executor. I would very much like to see him go with a semblance of dignity, as you would. He has, at least in the past done good things for the State and it would be a shame to see his achievements muddied further. I have reservations that his pride will allow him to do so however.
Lialus Raithe
Doomheim
#32 - 2013-04-03 10:34:10 UTC
Anja Suorsa wrote:
Whilst this appears to be good news, I remain skeptical as to what the Federation truly gains from this agreement. I'll refrain from personal comment until the full agreement is available for perusal.


If nothing else, the Federation gains a level of security and reduces the chances of a similar situation occurring again. While I am quite certain the final arrangements will have a less subtle benefit to the Federation included somewhere, for now I will continue to hope it remains reasonable enough that both sides can agree openly and willingly to it.
Andreus Ixiris
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#33 - 2013-04-03 10:47:16 UTC
We've stepped back from total war with the State instead of towards it? The Caldari megacorporations and the CEP are standing up to Heth? Roden is talking about forging peace instead of warships? I... I never thought I'd see the day. I'm... I'm not really sure what I can actually... say about this.

I'm happy, though. I'm really, really happy.

I don't think it's really possible for any of you to imagine just how happy I am.

Andreus Ixiris > A Civire without a chin is barely a Civire at all.

Pieter Tuulinen > He'd be Civirely disadvantaged, Andreus.

Andreus Ixiris > ...

Andreus Ixiris > This is why we're at war.

Diana Kim
State Protectorate
Caldari State
#34 - 2013-04-03 10:58:02 UTC
Pieter Tuulinen wrote:
To be honest, I'm quite happy to allow the Gallente Navy to operate freely in Luminaire. Let's be honest, if it comes down to it and they find themselves in a position of needing to deploy fleet assets over Home, it means things have broken down so badly that they'll simply break any armistice.

When have we ever fought for any other part of the Luminaire system? This gives us Home and it does so in a way that is actually in the Gallente interest to maintain.

Last time they 'operated freely', huge remains of capital ships rained on our Home planet killing millions of innocents.

Yes, the planet is ours now. But while gallentes are allowed to roam 'freely' with guns drawn, it cannot be safe. Gallentes must be stopped and disarmed, only this can bring the peace.

Honored are the dead, for their legacy guides us.

In memory of Tibus Heth, Caldari State Executor YC110-115, Hero and Patriot.

Andreus Ixiris
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#35 - 2013-04-03 11:02:26 UTC
Diana Kim wrote:
Last time they 'operated freely', huge remains of capital ships rained on our Home planet killing millions of innocents.

Yes, the planet is ours now. But while gallentes are allowed to roam 'freely' with guns drawn, it cannot be safe. Gallentes must be stopped and disarmed, only this can bring the peace.

You're proposing to disarm us, in our own home system? How do you imagine this will be accomplished?

Andreus Ixiris > A Civire without a chin is barely a Civire at all.

Pieter Tuulinen > He'd be Civirely disadvantaged, Andreus.

Andreus Ixiris > ...

Andreus Ixiris > This is why we're at war.

Anja Suorsa
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#36 - 2013-04-03 11:07:04 UTC
Andreus Ixiris wrote:
Diana Kim wrote:
Last time they 'operated freely', huge remains of capital ships rained on our Home planet killing millions of innocents.

Yes, the planet is ours now. But while gallentes are allowed to roam 'freely' with guns drawn, it cannot be safe. Gallentes must be stopped and disarmed, only this can bring the peace.

You're proposing to disarm us, in our own home system? How do you imagine this will be accomplished?


Don't go there, we all know where this will lead.
Lialus Raithe
Doomheim
#37 - 2013-04-03 11:28:08 UTC
Andreus Ixiris wrote:

You're proposing to disarm us, in our own home system? How do you imagine this will be accomplished?


Monsieur Ixiris,

Returning to you your own wise advice once offered to me:

Don't waste your time trying to reason with her.

I'm pretty convinced she's the illegitimate daughter of Tibus Heth by this point.
Andreus Ixiris
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#38 - 2013-04-03 11:29:09 UTC
Lialus Raithe wrote:
I'm pretty convinced she's the illegitimate daughter of Tibus Heth by this point.

It would explain (some of) what's wrong with her face.

Andreus Ixiris > A Civire without a chin is barely a Civire at all.

Pieter Tuulinen > He'd be Civirely disadvantaged, Andreus.

Andreus Ixiris > ...

Andreus Ixiris > This is why we're at war.

Andreus Ixiris
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#39 - 2013-04-03 11:36:24 UTC
So apparently, Mordu's Legion will be responsible for enforcing the DMZ. I can't say I'm entirely happy with that decision, but on reflection I don't think there's very many organisations out there that would be more suited to such a task.

Andreus Ixiris > A Civire without a chin is barely a Civire at all.

Pieter Tuulinen > He'd be Civirely disadvantaged, Andreus.

Andreus Ixiris > ...

Andreus Ixiris > This is why we're at war.

Grideris
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#40 - 2013-04-03 11:45:16 UTC
Andreus Ixiris wrote:
So apparently, Mordu's Legion will be responsible for enforcing the DMZ. I can't say I'm entirely happy with that decision, but on reflection I don't think there's very many organisations out there that would be more suited to such a task.


I think you might be right. Not many other groups out there that would have enough resources to keep the peace there that could be trusted. Some might say that CONCORD should enforce the DMZ, but I think it's a little out of their mandate.

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