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(Moderators, Please Lock Thread) To those miners and missioners who wish to be left alone.

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The Apostle
Doomheim
#21 - 2011-10-31 01:54:36 UTC
Henry Haphorn wrote:
The Apostle wrote:

So he says. Any player that is HAPPY to have fire rain down on their heads is either a masochist or flat-out lying.

I call "don't make my griefing too hard for me" troll post.



I can pull out my certificates if you want.

Oh, I never asked griefers to take it easy on me. Just ask those who ganked me (ask Guillaume LeConquerant for a reference).


It's the logic I'm confused on.

Quote:
We miners are hard working individuals that ensure that there is a constant stream of minerals needed for ship production. However, there are many miners like me who feel that destruction is so important to our bottom line that we even welcome griefers to try to attack us for whatever purpose they like


You get blown up, lose a 200m Hulk and that's good for business because you sell what, Hulks? Shocked


[i]Take an aspirin. If pain persists consult your local priest. WTB: An Austrian kangaroo![/i]
leviticus ander
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#22 - 2011-10-31 01:55:47 UTC
The Apostle wrote:

So he says. Any player that is HAPPY to have fire rain down on their heads is either a masochist or flat-out lying.

I call "don't make my griefing too hard for me" troll post.


or he's making a plea to the bitchy miners out there to stop being so bitchy.
Henry Haphorn
Killer Yankee
#23 - 2011-10-31 01:58:35 UTC  |  Edited by: Henry Haphorn
leviticus ander wrote:
The Apostle wrote:

So he says. Any player that is HAPPY to have fire rain down on their heads is either a masochist or flat-out lying.

I call "don't make my griefing too hard for me" troll post.


or he's making a plea to the bitchy miners out there to stop being so bitchy.


Quoted for accuracy.

To the miners.

Oh, and one more thing. Tank your god damn mining ships. The Goons are freakin everywhere killing miner and yet some miners still decide to fit for max yield at the expense of defenses. Who's really at fault here for losing their own mining ship?

Adapt or Die
Nova Fox
Novafox Shipyards
#24 - 2011-10-31 02:02:50 UTC
I like mining in my tanked damnation :P

Dust 514's CPM 1 Iron Wolf Saber Eve mail me about Dust 514 issues.
Handsome Hussein
#25 - 2011-10-31 02:03:25 UTC
Justin Credulent wrote:
Miners are hard working, industrial persons upon which all of EVE depends. People who make it a point to mess with Covetors in hi-sec "for the lulz" and then try to hide behind the (very thin) defense that "nowhere in EVE is safe" are cowardly carebears trying to push responsibility and blame for their own behavior onto a third party (CCP, "game mechanics", or the miners themselves.)

I can tell that you, good sir, have been the victim of ganking recently. Please share those tears with the rest of the class.

Leaves only the fresh scent of pine.
The Apostle
Doomheim
#26 - 2011-10-31 02:12:50 UTC
Henry Haphorn wrote:
leviticus ander wrote:
The Apostle wrote:

So he says. Any player that is HAPPY to have fire rain down on their heads is either a masochist or flat-out lying.

I call "don't make my griefing too hard for me" troll post.


or he's making a plea to the bitchy miners out there to stop being so bitchy.


Quoted for accuracy.

To the miners.

Oh, and one more thing. Tank your god damn mining ships. The Goons are freakin everywhere killing miner and yet some miners still decide to fit for max yield at the expense of defenses. Who's really at fault here for losing their own mining ship?

This has been discussed in some depth already. There are lots of experts on how to "tank" a Hulk. None have probably ever seen a 2 x BS alphastrike at work. May as well max for yield, grab what you can as fast as you can and gtfo.

I've also said that any miner that sets up his mining vessel for mining is obviously an absolute moron.

And bitchy miners all. Yes Sireee... A typical day in MineVille.

Mr. Miner> Hey Mr. Ganker, did you know that I am only here so you can play Eve the way you want?
Mr. Ganker> Thank you Mr. Miner, did you know I am only here to make sure you can't?

[i]Take an aspirin. If pain persists consult your local priest. WTB: An Austrian kangaroo![/i]
David Grogan
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#27 - 2011-10-31 02:24:57 UTC
Henry Haphorn wrote:

Nowhere in New Eden is 100% safe.

Do not fly around in what you cannot afford to lose or protect.

.


stop preaching regurgitated sh|te

Everytime you buy something that says "made in china" you are helping the rising unemployment in your own country unless you are from china, Buy locally produced goods and help create more jobs.
Sara XIII
The Carnifex Corp
#28 - 2011-10-31 02:27:35 UTC
David Grogan wrote:
Henry Haphorn wrote:

Nowhere in New Eden is 100% safe.

Do not fly around in what you cannot afford to lose or protect.

.


stop preaching regurgitated sh|te


well said
Between Ignorance and Wisdom
Ladie Harlot
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#29 - 2011-10-31 02:30:13 UTC
The Apostle wrote:
Mr. Miner> Hey Mr. Ganker, did you know that I am only here so you can play Eve the way you want?
Mr. Ganker> Thank you Mr. Miner, did you know I am only here to make sure you can't?

I thought you were better than this.

The artist formerly known as Ladie Scarlet.
The Apostle
Doomheim
#30 - 2011-10-31 02:31:48 UTC
Ladie Harlot wrote:
The Apostle wrote:
Mr. Miner> Hey Mr. Ganker, did you know that I am only here so you can play Eve the way you want?
Mr. Ganker> Thank you Mr. Miner, did you know I am only here to make sure you can't?

I thought you were better than this.

I am. It was a crack at the OP.

[i]Take an aspirin. If pain persists consult your local priest. WTB: An Austrian kangaroo![/i]
Elyssa MacLeod
Doomheim
#31 - 2011-10-31 02:35:19 UTC
Henry Haphorn wrote:
This is to all the players out there who think that just because they are mining or missioning, that they are entitled to some kind of immunity from the griefers who gank them.

play another game.


There you go :D

GM Homonoia: Suicide ganks are a valid and viable tactic in EVE.

Where is your God now carebear?
The Apostle
Doomheim
#32 - 2011-10-31 02:38:13 UTC
Elyssa MacLeod wrote:
Henry Haphorn wrote:
This is to all the players out there who think that just because they are mining or missioning, that they are entitled to some kind of immunity from the griefers who gank them.

play another game.


There you go :D

And I truly wonder what would happen if they did.

[i]Take an aspirin. If pain persists consult your local priest. WTB: An Austrian kangaroo![/i]
Justin Credulent
Luv You Long Time
#33 - 2011-10-31 02:46:05 UTC
Quote:
Who's really at fault here for losing their own mining ship?


Well let's see: Would the mining ship have been blown up where it not for the criminal actions of the ganker?
Hm: Nope!

Well gee, that sort of suggest that the criminal is responsible, doesn't it? Whether a miner tanks his Hulk or not is irrelevant; a vulnerable target does not abrogate criminal responsibility. Technically the criminals are the ones who are responsible - not their victims - since, logically, the issue of "tanking your Hulk" would not even exist where it not for said criminals.

it is not a "chicken and egg" problem. It completely and 100% starts with the criminal, and fault rests upon their shoulders.

I mean, this is basic logic. I'm surprised so many EVE players have such a hard time with it... since EVE players spend a good deal of their time bragging about how smart they are for playing EVE....

Now, this isn't to say that someone shouldn't pay attention to their surroundings and protect themselves. However, at the end of the day, the argument that "it's your fault that someone broke into your house and stole your belongings because, after all, you own a house with valuable items inside" is ridiculous and would never pass in any court system. You don't like a rapist go unpunished simply because his victim "should have been paying better attention." Such ideas are ludicrous.

"Why is that?" you ask? Simple: In the real world, which EVE is nothing like by the way, people can only be held accountable for their own actions.

True, EVE is just a game. However, EVE is no longer filling a "niche" - EVE is now in the mainstream, and like it or not, the type of people who are being drawn to EVE are not the same sort of players who got into the game 3, 4, 8 years ago. CCP is going to either have to adapt to these new players (and secure more capital in the process), or it'll unnecessarily restrict itself to a very small player market, which will eventually exhaust itself.

*shrug*

Null-Sec needs to HTFU and stop crying to CCP. If null-sec wants PvP, they need to stop being carebears and start fighting eachother - after years of bot-mining, they have the ships!
Vricrolatious
HIgh Sec Care Bears
Brothers of Tangra
#34 - 2011-10-31 02:50:27 UTC  |  Edited by: Vricrolatious
Justin Credulent wrote:
Quote:
Who's really at fault here for losing their own mining ship?


Well let's see: Would the mining ship have been blown up where it not for the criminal actions of the ganker?
Hm: Nope!

Well gee, that sort of suggest that the criminal is responsible, doesn't it? Whether a miner tanks his Hulk or not is irrelevant; a vulnerable target does not abrogate criminal responsibility. Technically the criminals are the ones who are responsible - not their victims - since, logically, the issue of "tanking your Hulk" would not even exist where it not for said criminals.


But an untanked Hulk (or barge in general) is just ASKING to be "graped in the mouth!"

WIDot, Best Dot, Even Sans Dot! -Vric
Justin Credulent
Luv You Long Time
#35 - 2011-10-31 02:50:58 UTC
The Apostle wrote:
Elyssa MacLeod wrote:
Henry Haphorn wrote:
This is to all the players out there who think that just because they are mining or missioning, that they are entitled to some kind of immunity from the griefers who gank them.

play another game.


There you go :D

And I truly wonder what would happen if they did.


Either:

-EVE would collapse and die
-Ships, modules, and ammo would be purchased in NPC shops instead of on the player market
-More realistic: The botting in Drone Regions would accelerate to fill the void.

Or, most unrealistically:

-CCP would develop a better business plan.

Null-Sec needs to HTFU and stop crying to CCP. If null-sec wants PvP, they need to stop being carebears and start fighting eachother - after years of bot-mining, they have the ships!
Henry Haphorn
Killer Yankee
#36 - 2011-10-31 02:52:03 UTC  |  Edited by: Henry Haphorn
Justin Credulent wrote:
Quote:
Who's really at fault here for losing their own mining ship?

...stuff said...


Under normal situations, yes. It's the criminal's fault. But having an entire alliance such as Goonswarm running around ganking miners (while paying others to do the same and announcing it ahead of time) is not a normal situation. Neither was Hulkageddon. Yet players decided to not properly tank their ships during these events. My argument still stands.

Edited for grammar.

Adapt or Die
The Apostle
Doomheim
#37 - 2011-10-31 02:53:54 UTC
Justin Credulent wrote:
Quote:
Who's really at fault here for losing their own mining ship?


Well let's see: Would the mining ship have been blown up where it not for the criminal actions of the ganker?
Hm: Nope!

Well gee, that sort of suggest that the criminal is responsible, doesn't it? Whether a miner tanks his Hulk or not is irrelevant; a vulnerable target does not abrogate criminal responsibility. Technically the criminals are the ones who are responsible - not their victims - since, logically, the issue of "tanking your Hulk" would not even exist where it not for said criminals.

it is not a "chicken and egg" problem. It completely and 100% starts with the criminal, and fault rests upon their shoulders.

I mean, this is basic logic. I'm surprised so many EVE players have such a hard time with it... since EVE players spend a good deal of their time bragging about how smart they are for playing EVE....

Now, this isn't to say that someone shouldn't pay attention to their surroundings and protect themselves. However, at the end of the day, the argument that "it's your fault that someone broke into your house and stole your belongings because, after all, you own a house with valuable items inside" is ridiculous and would never pass in any court system. You don't like a rapist go unpunished simply because his victim "should have been paying better attention." Such ideas are ludicrous.

"Why is that?" you ask? Simple: In the real world, which EVE is nothing like by the way, people can only be held accountable for their own actions.

True, EVE is just a game. However, EVE is no longer filling a "niche" - EVE is now in the mainstream, and like it or not, the type of people who are being drawn to EVE are not the same sort of players who got into the game 3, 4, 8 years ago. CCP is going to either have to adapt to these new players (and secure more capital in the process), or it'll unnecessarily restrict itself to a very small player market, which will eventually exhaust itself.

*shrug*


This man get's it.

There ARE new players coming in all the time. How many LEAVE because they have next to no chance at getting a decent start. The bittervets have AMPLE opportunity to play Eve - elsewhere. They PREFER to sit in highsec killing noobs (or supporting it) and then justify it with "This is Eve" bullshit. Pure and simple.

If we keep catering only for the bandy-kneed old men of Eve it will become "Bittervets Retirement Home version 4".

[i]Take an aspirin. If pain persists consult your local priest. WTB: An Austrian kangaroo![/i]
Justin Credulent
Luv You Long Time
#38 - 2011-10-31 02:55:01 UTC
Vricrolatious wrote:
Justin Credulent wrote:
Quote:
Who's really at fault here for losing their own mining ship?


Well let's see: Would the mining ship have been blown up where it not for the criminal actions of the ganker?
Hm: Nope!

Well gee, that sort of suggest that the criminal is responsible, doesn't it? Whether a miner tanks his Hulk or not is irrelevant; a vulnerable target does not abrogate criminal responsibility. Technically the criminals are the ones who are responsible - not their victims - since, logically, the issue of "tanking your Hulk" would not even exist where it not for said criminals.


But an untanked Hulk (or barge in general) is JUST asking to be "graped in the mouth!"


Irrelevant.

A house could have it's doors wide open and no car in the parking lot... but you and you alone would still be held criminally responsible were you to enter the house and take something from it.

Someone could leave their car running and the door wide open... but you and you alone would still be held criminally responsible were you to drive off in it.

And before anyone wants to whine about how "but that's real life, EVE is just a game", my response is: Isn't EVE suppose to be "just like real life"? :-)

Null-Sec needs to HTFU and stop crying to CCP. If null-sec wants PvP, they need to stop being carebears and start fighting eachother - after years of bot-mining, they have the ships!
Handsome Hussein
#39 - 2011-10-31 02:56:03 UTC
Justin Credulent wrote:
"Why is that?" you ask? Simple: In the real world, which EVE is nothing like by the way, people can only be held accountable for their own actions.

But there you are at fault. A player in EVE can be held accountable for their actions. It's just the most miners and missioners who get ganked don't bother to apply said consequences.

Tippia has a really nice quote in his/her sig around here. I suggest you read and learn it.

Leaves only the fresh scent of pine.
Henry Haphorn
Killer Yankee
#40 - 2011-10-31 02:57:07 UTC  |  Edited by: Henry Haphorn
The Apostle wrote:

This man get's it.

There ARE new players coming in all the time. How many LEAVE because they have next to no chance at getting a decent start. The bittervets have AMPLE opportunity to play Eve - elsewhere. They PREFER to sit in highsec killing noobs (or supporting it) and then justify it with "This is Eve" bullshit. Pure and simple.

If we keep catering only for the bandy-kneed old men of Eve it will become "Bittervets Retirement Home version 4".



I have a friend who likes to play Eve Online. However, I make it abundantly clear to him that he should expect griefers when mining. He hardly looked discouraged from what I told him. I told him about the good, the bad, the ugly, and the very ugly of Eve.

Adapt or Die