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We all want new ships dont we.... how about cloaky EAS (Electronic Attack Ships)

Author
Skippermonkey
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#1 - 2011-09-07 10:51:09 UTC  |  Edited by: Skippermonkey
4 new ships, cloaky EAS

they would compliment a cloaky bomber fleet

basically mini-recons

shouldnt take too much to implement

tell me you like this idea!!!!



tl;dr

following the naming convention of the recons of Combat (non-cloaky) and Force (cloaky), the current EAS ships be given the 'Combat' monicker and a new line of 'Force' EAS ships be created.

these new 'force EAS' ships will have less range and less tank than the 'combat EAS' ships, but get to use the cov ops cloak.

I envisage these ships integrating with current cloaky fleets without stepping on the toes of the current 'Force Recons', and combined with a rebalance and working of the current EAS ships stats, making these ships more popular.

COME AT ME BRO

I'LL JUST BE DOCKED IN THIS STATION

Rek Seven
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#2 - 2011-09-07 11:26:24 UTC
Why stop at EAS when we could have PDQ, RGB or maybe even SBZ?
Skippermonkey
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#3 - 2011-09-07 11:53:36 UTC
you are terrible, gtfo

COME AT ME BRO

I'LL JUST BE DOCKED IN THIS STATION

Ciar Meara
PIE Inc.
Khimi Harar
#4 - 2011-09-07 11:55:26 UTC
WTF?

- [img]http://go-dl1.eve-files.com/media/corp/janus/ceosig.jpg[/img] [yellow]English only please. Zymurgist[/yellow]

Skippermonkey
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#5 - 2011-09-07 11:57:24 UTC
ok.. mayeb 'EAS' ships are to terribly underused that i have to spell it out for you

ELECTRONIC ATTACK SHIPS

in other words, recons, but in frigate size

COME AT ME BRO

I'LL JUST BE DOCKED IN THIS STATION

Ciar Meara
PIE Inc.
Khimi Harar
#6 - 2011-09-07 11:58:51 UTC
oooh those ships yeah, never even flown one and I pretty much have flown every class.

Sounds good actually, make it so!

- [img]http://go-dl1.eve-files.com/media/corp/janus/ceosig.jpg[/img] [yellow]English only please. Zymurgist[/yellow]

Overs
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#7 - 2011-09-07 12:24:22 UTC
Recons are the combo you describe, thus the platform already exists.

I do think electronic attack ships need a targeting range boost. Skills that boost targeting range are classed under Electronics; modules that boost targeting range and resolution are classed under Electronics. I think it's odd that on a kitsune ewar can have an optimal range greater than it's targeting range.
Skippermonkey
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#8 - 2011-09-07 12:29:51 UTC
Overs wrote:
Recons are the combo you describe, thus the platform already exists.

I disagree, by your reasoning we should scrap the current EAS all together because the recons already do the same job?

There are EWAR bonused cloaky and non-cloaky ships for cruisers (Recons), and so frigates should get the same treatment

COME AT ME BRO

I'LL JUST BE DOCKED IN THIS STATION

Furb Killer
#9 - 2011-09-07 12:37:34 UTC
When in doubt, give it a cov ops cloak?


I must admit I am genuinely surprised I havent seen yet a proposal to boost dreads by giving them cov ops cloaks.
Overs
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#10 - 2011-09-09 13:07:50 UTC
Skippermonkey wrote:
Overs wrote:
Recons are the combo you describe, thus the platform already exists.

I disagree, by your reasoning we should scrap the current EAS all together because the recons already do the same job?

There are EWAR bonused cloaky and non-cloaky ships for cruisers (Recons), and so frigates should get the same treatment


No. By my reasoning there is a frigate platform for stealth and a frigate platform for ewar; to mix the two platforms together requires a larger platform known as a cruiser.
Nova Fox
Novafox Shipyards
#11 - 2011-09-09 15:11:20 UTC
Fix the EAS ships first!

Dust 514's CPM 1 Iron Wolf Saber Eve mail me about Dust 514 issues.

Skippermonkey
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#12 - 2011-09-12 09:52:10 UTC
Overs wrote:
Skippermonkey wrote:
Overs wrote:
Recons are the combo you describe, thus the platform already exists.

I disagree, by your reasoning we should scrap the current EAS all together because the recons already do the same job?

There are EWAR bonused cloaky and non-cloaky ships for cruisers (Recons), and so frigates should get the same treatment


No. By my reasoning there is a frigate platform for stealth and a frigate platform for ewar; to mix the two platforms together requires a larger platform known as a cruiser.

nope, still wrong.

its so simple to understand

the relation in frigates>cruisers>battleships has pretty much been that there are ship types of equal use in each tier.

recons are cruisers, EAS are frigates, (and Black Ops are Battleships - my argument with EAS applies equally with them as well)

recons have an established 2 ship mix, cloaky and non-cloaky. The cloaky ship often exchanges range of ewar effect for the ability to cloak

so, with the already established 2 ship mix of long range non-cloaky and short range cloaky, we can apply this to the EAS ships, (and Black Ops)

In my mind, there isnt an argument over whether these ships should or shouldnt exist, because they should, but on how we balance them into the game.

COME AT ME BRO

I'LL JUST BE DOCKED IN THIS STATION

Rek Seven
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#13 - 2011-09-12 11:23:19 UTC
Xearal
Dead's Prostitutes
The Initiative.
#14 - 2011-09-12 12:41:30 UTC
Supported.. and while at it.. lets add Black-Ops with capital torpedo launchers, a BS sized stealth bomber as mentined in other threads. Something that can suddenly pounce on an unsuspecting capital ship and pew pew it to shreds.

Does railgun ammunition come in Hollow Point?

Duchess Starbuckington
Doomheim
#15 - 2011-09-12 15:43:20 UTC
Xearal wrote:
Supported.. and while at it.. lets add Black-Ops with capital torpedo launchers, a BS sized stealth bomber as mentined in other threads. Something that can suddenly pounce on an unsuspecting capital ship and pew pew it to shreds.


Yes, because pewpewing a lone capital (which is screwed anyway, if the pilot is that dim) with a 600mil isk battleship is totally a desperately needed niché. Idiot.

Regarding the OP: oh god no. Why do we need more cloaky ships? There are plenty of ways to make EAFs more viable without giving yet another class the covops cloak.
Nicolo da'Vicenza
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#16 - 2011-09-12 16:04:53 UTC
more consentual pvp ships please
shadowace00007
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#17 - 2011-09-12 16:57:24 UTC
I think they are proper where they are. I do think they need a range boost for the most part but other then that They work great. People just underestimate them so they don't fly them. Example being people grab a Huginn or rapier insted of a Hyena. but for the price they work the way they should.

If you give them a cov cloak then Black ops drops will get ridiculously strong. As you can bring more frigs using less Black-ops ships due to less fuel and get the same effect.

Born Amarrian Raised Minmatar.

Zarnak Wulf
Amarrian Vengeance
#18 - 2011-09-12 18:20:43 UTC
shadowace00007 wrote:
I think they are proper where they are. I do think they need a range boost for the most part but other then that They work great. People just underestimate them so they don't fly them. Example being people grab a Huginn or rapier insted of a Hyena. but for the price they work the way they should.

If you give them a cov cloak then Black ops drops will get ridiculously strong. As you can bring more frigs using less Black-ops ships due to less fuel and get the same effect.



Let's talk about the Hyena. It, like the other EAS, has a smaller lock range then it's T1 counterpart. You acknowledge this. Blink It also has a signature radius that's too large for it to survive. I've tried armor tanking the thing. I've tried shield tanking it. It quite simply is too fat of a target to survive very long in combat. Someone looks at it and the hyena will die. The ship also skipped over the fun 5% velocity bonus that the Vigil gets.

As for it's bonuses: Web range - check. Target painter - sigh, check. Signature reduction bonus? Okay, for those that don't remember this bonus is a lesser version of the one that interceptors USED to get before the speed nerf. After the speed nerf it was clear that the bonus wasn't cutting it - it got changed to the current one of reducing the MWD sig bloom penalty. The Hyena, however, got overlooked. A lesser version today would be 10% reduction to the MWD sig bloom penalty per level.

The last bonus is a reduction to the cap penalty of using a MWD. I view this differently from the other bonuses because when you start to look at all of the EAF, you notice they have some kind of version of this cap bonus. The sentinel gets a 25% cap recharge bonus at lvl 5. The kitsune gets one in ADDITION to the reduced ECM cap need bonus. The Keres and Hyena get a reduced cap use bonus. This aspcect of the class is screaming out for a capacitor role bonus of some sort.

TL;DR

Sensible Hyena:
38m sig radius

Frigate Bonus:
5% velocity per level and 7.5% Target Painter effectiveness per level. (Similar to Vigil save for the better TP bonus)
EAS Bonus:
10% reduction in MWD signature radius penalty and 20% web range bonus per level

Role Bonus:
25% faster capacitor recharge.
Duchess Starbuckington
Doomheim
#19 - 2011-09-13 09:48:33 UTC
Zarnak Wulf wrote:
[quote=shadowace00007]
Sensible Hyena:
38m sig radius

Frigate Bonus:
5% velocity per level and 7.5% Target Painter effectiveness per level. (Similar to Vigil save for the better TP bonus)
EAS Bonus:
10% reduction in MWD signature radius penalty and 20% web range bonus per level

Role Bonus:
25% faster capacitor recharge.


Oh look, a sensible boost that doesn't involve yet another covops cloak ship.
Skippermonkey
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#20 - 2011-09-13 09:51:09 UTC
i know that the current EAS ships need a boost as well, i just thought that we could use an extra ship type

So, you dont like the idea, give a reasonable reply about WHY

COME AT ME BRO

I'LL JUST BE DOCKED IN THIS STATION

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