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[Odyssey] Faction Navy Cruisers

First post First post
Author
MisterNick
The Sagan Clan
#141 - 2013-03-28 01:23:14 UTC
Shocked Dat Navy Vexor.

Paper Ishtar for far less money? i'll take that trade.

"Human beings make life so interesting. Do you know that in a universe so full of wonders, they have managed to invent boredom."

Heribeck Weathers
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#142 - 2013-03-28 01:30:07 UTC
I like the speed increase on all of these, but i feel like the Scyth-FI and the Osprey-NI arnt going to be able to kill anything with such crummy DPS, I kinda imagine these ships being used in fleets rather than kiting around like crummy cynables solo, it would be nice if they reflected a fleet ship more, they are navy ships after all.

Also make the Ospry a blaster boat with shield HP per lvl, rather than a more kity carical, and the caricalNI be a more brawly carical.

Veshta Yoshida
PIE Inc.
Khimi Harar
#143 - 2013-03-28 01:33:24 UTC
Why the insane Nomen nerf, was it really that good because I sure as hell didn't get much mileage out of them before they died. A full 25% gun dps hit for the Nomen, do you think that 5 more light drones makes up for that?
It goes from having 8 turret equivalent to a mere 6 .. why the hell don't you just molest it like vanilla Omen/Prophecy, make it into some silly drone boat and be done with it.

Just let one of them, in this case I guess that is the Aug, be a gun boat.

PS: What is the utility high on Nomen supposed to be for considering the obvious kiting paradigm? And where do you expect it gets cap to do anything other than kill a frig before needing to safe up to recharge, mandatory capbooster? Mind giving it a 4th mid if that is the case?
PPS: Bricks are awesome! Love me some bricks .. oh wai ...

Nice potential for diversity in Gallente, Caldari and Minmatar revisions but both the Amarr hulls are rammed so far up the pigeon hole that the sun shall never reflect in their golden skins .. sadness.

PPPS: At least the Slicer came out relatively unscathed, fearing for what will happen to the big dogs though if this is what CCP's thinking comes down to with regards to Amarr hulls.

Scythe looks like pure fun though, options for that one are through the roof. About time the misunderstood weapon split was addressed and given a proper showcase .. will be whines about "oh noes, my skill points!" but can't be helped Smile
Bouh Revetoile wrote:
...- Navy Omen with destroyer speed and optimale bonused lasers...

Dessie mobility AND damage, exact same damage as the Coercer only with ~2x the Range or so, unbonused drones are a liability, always has been so wouldn't rely on them to do much of anything (distractions can be gold though).
Berluth Luthian
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#144 - 2013-03-28 01:54:53 UTC  |  Edited by: Berluth Luthian
So wouldn't the dual 10% bonuses and a BCU and a gyro net better dps than two separate 5% bonuses and 2 damage mods with a stacking penalty?

Plus you get to pick the damage type.
Jack Pharris
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#145 - 2013-03-28 02:17:09 UTC
It seems somewhat odd from a lore perspective for the navy issue versions of Logistics ships to be combat ships. although if you don't see room for them between T1 and T2 logistics cruisers that's understandable.
Aerandria
Cerebus Syndrome
#146 - 2013-03-28 02:17:39 UTC
Vrat Briner wrote:
Quote:
Exequror Navy Issue: Keeping the same role for this one, as a high damage blasterboat with the two damage bonuses. Adding an extra highslot and turret increases damage even further. It's fast and hard hitting but the lack of the Thorax's tracking bonus hurts.
Cruiser skill bonuses:
5% bonus to Medium Hybrid Turret damage
5% bonus to Medium Hybrid Turret rate of fire
Slot layout: 5 H(+1), 4 M(+1), 6 L(+1), 5(+1) turrets
Fittings: 830(+70) PWG, 340(+60) CPU
Defense (shields / armor / hull) : 1800(+428) / 1950(+474) / 2550(+863)
Shield Recharge Time: 1250s(-200)
Capacitor (amount / recharge rate / average cap per second): 1500(+125) / 490s(-1.25) / 3(+0.2)
Mobility (max velocity / agility / mass / align time): 255(+7) / 0.4 (-0.037) / 11280000(-260,000) / 6.25s(-0.74)
Drones (bandwidth / bay): 25(+5) / 25(+5)
Targeting (max targeting range / Scan Resolution / Max Locked targets): 47.5km / 325(+3) / 7(+1)
Sensor strength: 18(+3) Magnetometric
Signature radius: 110(+2)
Cargo capacity: 465 (+200)


+1 turret, +1 med, +1 low and +70 PG and +60 CPU? Seriously? At the moment you only can fit Ions if you're going to armour tank (or neutrons, if you're going shield tank it) and you do not have any free resources left at all, and you're adding ONE MORE turret and med slot with only 70 PG and 60 CPU??? Again, seriously? Are we supposed to fit electron blasters on it?


Consider this:

The current thorax has 5H, 4M, and 5L with 830PG and 330CPU.
The new Nexe has 5H, 4M, 6L with 830PG and 340CPU.

The thorax isn't hard to fit. The new Nexe will have an additional low and 10CPU. That's incredibly easy to fit.

It's also got dramatically more EHP across the board than the thorax, its slightly faster, way more agile, much smaller sig, stronger cap, better sensor, better shield recharge, and more dps. In exchange for all that awesome it downgrades from medium drones to small and lacks the awesome tracking of the thorax, but its got the mids for a web or two so this isn't in any way crippling as far as I can tell.

I dunno what you're looking I'm looking at a ship that appears to be better than the thorax at basically everything, and I personally really like the current thorax...
The VC's
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#147 - 2013-03-28 02:18:19 UTC  |  Edited by: The VC's
Nomen damage bonus and turret loss is nice. Less cap use and about 20-30 sec more overheat, roughly.

Less crystals to buy too.



Even better heat performance on the Augoror.
Akturous
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#148 - 2013-03-28 03:13:20 UTC  |  Edited by: Akturous
Two problems:

1. Why in gods name are you doing a split weapon system on the Scythe, when you said "we want to get rid of the split weapon bonuses" Are you senile?

2. You've increased the shield and decreased the armour on the SFI, this is the opposite of what you should do. It's also the opposite of what should happen should you increase the mass, SFI's aren't that uber awesome, they're just the only faction cruiser that worked, leave it the **** alone.

3. Heavy drones still won't be able to catch **** all even with the bonus on the NVex, that needs looking at, they're supposed to be frig-destroyer size things, so they should do 1500-2k m/s without the bonus.

Vote Item Heck One for CSM8

Akturous
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#149 - 2013-03-28 03:19:35 UTC
Zilero wrote:
In light of the earlier proposed TE changes, please provide the Stabber Fleet Issue with a bonus to falloff.

Thanks!


The SFI is not a kiting platform ffs, you have the stabber and the Vaga for that, you should be orbiting at 500-1k with the SFI out tracking people.

L2goddamn play.

Vote Item Heck One for CSM8

CCP Fozzie
C C P
C C P Alliance
#150 - 2013-03-28 03:36:18 UTC
Quick update, I made a copy error when making up this post. The Augoror Navy Issue should have 2550 hull hp. OP is updated.

Game Designer | Team Five-0

Twitter: @CCP_Fozzie
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Destoya
Habitual Euthanasia
Pandemic Legion
#151 - 2013-03-28 04:01:44 UTC
Akturous wrote:


1. Why in gods name are you doing a split weapon system on the Scythe, when you said "we want to get rid of the split weapon bonuses" Are you senile?

.


I have a feeling Fozzie just made it that way knowing it sucked just to appease the multitude of forum whiners from making the Hurricane/Cyclone single weapon ships. A kind of "look, this is how split weapons turn out, here you go, be happy" moment.

Of course there's a good amount of time so I wouldn't be surprised to see a buff in some way, as the new scythe FI seems worse than its counterparts from other factions. On the other hand, I could be wrong because that 5-5-5 slot layout does look really really sexy.

I also feel like the Stabber Fleet Issue doesnt need a nerf at all, it performs pretty well in it's current state, definitely looks to be competitive with the updated versions of the other navy cruisers.
Arronicus
State War Academy
Caldari State
#152 - 2013-03-28 04:11:46 UTC
Why in the world was the drone bay stripped off the Caracal Navy Issue?
Lenier Chenal
Offensive Upholder
#153 - 2013-03-28 04:17:40 UTC
The Myrm needs heavy/sentry 5 drones now, no reason it shouldn't. Now there are 2 cruisers with the ability to use 5 sentry/heavy drones.
MeBiatch
GRR GOONS
#154 - 2013-03-28 04:22:35 UTC
Arronicus wrote:
Why in the world was the drone bay stripped off the Caracal Navy Issue?


look at its role...

There are no stupid Questions... just stupid people... CCP Goliath wrote:

Ugh ti-di pooping makes me sad.

Rhnra Pahineh
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#155 - 2013-03-28 04:28:56 UTC
I don't understand why the navy version of the support cruisers are not support cruisers them self... Can anybody explain it to me?
Streya Jormagdnir
Alexylva Paradox
#156 - 2013-03-28 04:34:21 UTC
Zarnak Wulf wrote:
Why would I fly an Osprey over a missile Scythe. The Scythe gets:

The same number of launchers.
10% damage bonus on any damage type, not just kinetic.
Significantly more PG.
Bigger Drone bay.
Is faster.
Has a smaller sig radius.

You nee to rethink the Scythe. Shield boost and 5% damage per level would be my vote.


Keep your filthy, sour, unsatisfying shield boost bonuses away from my shield/armor-ambiguous Minmatar ships! P

I am also a human, straggling between the present world... and our future. I am a regulator, a coordinator, one who is meant to guide the way.

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Maximus Andendare
Stimulus
Rote Kapelle
#157 - 2013-03-28 04:38:18 UTC
Lenier Chenal wrote:
The Myrm needs heavy/sentry 5 drones now, no reason it shouldn't. Now there are 2 cruisers with the ability to use 5 sentry/heavy drones.
No, it'd compete far too much with upcoming Eos if it did, and the damage would be out of balance with its five turrets and large tank. In fact, the Myrm's tank is the advantage over the Navy Vexor. The Navy Vexor, while being a dps powerhouse, and probably a little more survivable due to the ability to dps from range with the drones, it's still going to be a glass cannon, and all that dps means nothing when the ship is dead.

Now, of course we can debate whether the Gallente active tanking role was really needed on both rebalanced BCs, since the Myrm or Brutix should have received something that makes it more fleet-friendly. But as it stands now, the Myrm is going to have the tank/soloing advantage over the Navy Vexor easily.

Besides, not all ships need to have the same in order to be competitive. You gotta realize that CCP doesn't make "one sausage" in different lengths. Each ship represents a different flavor of sausage altogether, and that gives choices, and choices for games are what make the game interesting, fun and unique.

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Lenier Chenal
Offensive Upholder
#158 - 2013-03-28 04:47:05 UTC
Maximus Andendare wrote:
Lenier Chenal wrote:
The Myrm needs heavy/sentry 5 drones now, no reason it shouldn't. Now there are 2 cruisers with the ability to use 5 sentry/heavy drones.
No, it'd compete far too much with upcoming Eos if it did, and the damage would be out of balance with its five turrets and large tank. In fact, the Myrm's tank is the advantage over the Navy Vexor. The Navy Vexor, while being a dps powerhouse, and probably a little more survivable due to the ability to dps from range with the drones, it's still going to be a glass cannon, and all that dps means nothing when the ship is dead.

Now, of course we can debate whether the Gallente active tanking role was really needed on both rebalanced BCs, since the Myrm or Brutix should have received something that makes it more fleet-friendly. But as it stands now, the Myrm is going to have the tank/soloing advantage over the Navy Vexor easily.

Besides, not all ships need to have the same in order to be competitive. You gotta realize that CCP doesn't make "one sausage" in different lengths. Each ship represents a different flavor of sausage altogether, and that gives choices, and choices for games are what make the game interesting, fun and unique.


It just doesn't make sense. Make the Gila and the NV have 4 drones, but let the larger ship have 5. Even it out DPS/role wise, but at least let it make sense.
Deerin
East Trading Co Ltd
#159 - 2013-03-28 05:48:39 UTC
Michael Harari wrote:
Bouh Revetoile wrote:

- Navy Scythe with insane damage, whatever the weapon it choose, and frigate speed and agility.


Wat. Its got 6 launchers or 6 guns. Max of 6+1.5 or 1.5+6. Thats not insane damage at all. Its the same dps as the current stabber. Less actually


No

Again:

It gets a %10 RATE OF FIRE bonus.

That means the duration is multiplied with 0.5 at Minmatar cruiser level 5.

Thats 8 effective turrets for you.

The ship goes 2400 with a single MWD and its guns outdps a cyna.

Scythe has effectively 4 damage bonuses, split in 2 for each weapon type.
Prometheus Exenthal
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#160 - 2013-03-28 05:50:50 UTC
Looks good to me!

The big winners (imo) are Navy Exeq (a proper Thorax), Fleet Scythe (Like NExeq, only faster and more versatile), and Amarr.

The NOsprey I think is a bit overrated atm, and will probably be link-bait and some lame ewar platform.
The Navy Caracal has been doing the same job for a while now, and it just got better.

The Navy Vexor *improved*, but I still wish it had more turrets (and a bonus) over the extra drone.
When I fight Vexor hulls, first thing I do is kill the heavies, so relying on them sucks. On the plus side, it's super agile now with utility highs.
The Navy Exeq is now a hero Thorax. It's as close to a T1 Deimos as you can get without flying a Vigilant. DPS is great, speed is great, cap is great, tank is workable. Will fly (and die).

The Fleet Stabber hasn't changed, still a solid ship.
The Fleet Scythe is now like.. pretty cool. It's not the highest damage dealing or tanking, but it does a whole lot pretty good. 600+dps is easily achievable, and it's tiny. It tanks equally well with armor or shields, whereas armor means you have so many mids for something like dual-prop (tiny hull) AND a couple webs etc etc. It's damn quick/agile too!

The Navy Omen is now the proper T1 version of what the Zealot will hopefully become. Fast + range, with frig defenses.
The Navy Augoror is just an all around decent ship now. Utility highs + good damage + good speed/agility + good tank. Will fly (and die). Kinda makes sense (lore-wise) to pair Amarr (with fast+ranged ships) to counter Minmatar ships like the Vagabond.

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DO YOUR JOBS, CCP DEVS. FIX THE GAME INSTEAD OF FKING IT