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New player perspective on NPC vs Player corps

Author
Atroken Ahashion
Doomheim
#1 - 2013-03-27 20:07:43 UTC
Hello all,

Great game. Have studied hard and am doing very well i think as a new player.
Am in high sec as a solo "carebear" and i'll tell u several reasons why.

Analysing corps for joining and taking into account all of the alts this game has, it is hard to trust certain criteria corps. You join a corp, then their alts take u out in that corp, corp loses members and the cycle begins again.
Even though i'm new, it didnt take long for a pattern to emerge.
Wardec histories and alliance statistics give certain red flags for me.
One point for NPC corps.

When i did find great newer/younger corps to join that really wanted to make a go of it, they are being wardecced at every opportunity.
Again another point for npc corps.

End result for new players, when in high sec can mine, do missions, epics, and have a great npc crew to talk to without the hassle of wardecs. They can actually get things done and build without having to "rebuild" on a weekly basis.
There are public mining fleets with orcas, where we all work together, we help each other in missions and other matters, just like a player corp.
The willingness and determination is out there amongst new players/corps in eve.
Another point for npc corps.

My suggestion, have high sec (1.0,0.9) areas free of wardecs on corps. Conditions apply for corps to move out of that sector for re-establishment and integration into eve; once having reached said amount of members or timeframe.
These conditions will motivate the corps to hire, train and succeed to move on. Plus ur getting good operational new corps into eve environment.

Why, well once established and new players/corps get some knowledge, then wardecs would be appropriate, and at that time bigger corps can add them as an alliance.
This would enhance better stability for new players, as the learning curve is steep enough in eve.

AND, for you pvpr's the wardecs would be more juicy looking corps, and wont make u look so bad going after eve players who know nothing, lol. Seriously, anyone proud of a defenseless miner kill record is a waste of human skin, lol.

Again, am new, and just relaying what my observations are so far.
Your points and views would be appreciated.


Thank you kindly
Captain Tardbar
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#2 - 2013-03-27 20:10:50 UTC
A great idea. Would read again.

Looking to talk on VOIP with other EVE players? Are you new and need help with EVE (welfare) or looking for advice? Looking for adversarial debate with angry people?

Captain Tardbar's Voice Discord Server

Noriko Mai
#3 - 2013-03-27 20:15:22 UTC  |  Edited by: Noriko Mai
Atroken Ahashion wrote:
[...]human skin[...]


mhhhh human skin and interesting idea

"Meh.." - Albert Einstein

Cannibal Kane
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#4 - 2013-03-27 20:18:49 UTC  |  Edited by: Cannibal Kane
Atroken Ahashion wrote:
Hello all,

Great game. Have studied hard and am doing very well i think as a new player.
Am in high sec as a solo "carebear" and i'll tell u several reasons why.

Analysing corps for joining and taking into account all of the alts this game has, it is hard to trust certain criteria corps. You join a corp, then their alts take u out in that corp, corp loses members and the cycle begins again.
Even though i'm new, it didnt take long for a pattern to emerge.
Wardec histories and alliance statistics give certain red flags for me.
One point for NPC corps.

When i did find great newer/younger corps to join that really wanted to make a go of it, they are being wardecced at every opportunity.
Again another point for npc corps.

End result for new players, when in high sec can mine, do missions, epics, and have a great npc crew to talk to without the hassle of wardecs. They can actually get things done and build without having to "rebuild" on a weekly basis.
There are public mining fleets with orcas, where we all work together, we help each other in missions and other matters, just like a player corp.
The willingness and determination is out there amongst new players/corps in eve.
Another point for npc corps.

My suggestion, have high sec (1.0,0.9) areas free of wardecs on corps. Conditions apply for corps to move out of that sector for re-establishment and integration into eve; once having reached said amount of members or timeframe.
These conditions will motivate the corps to hire, train and succeed to move on. Plus ur getting good operational new corps into eve environment.

Why, well once established and new players/corps get some knowledge, then wardecs would be appropriate, and at that time bigger corps can add them as an alliance.
This would enhance better stability for new players, as the learning curve is steep enough in eve.

AND, for you pvpr's the wardecs would be more juicy looking corps, and wont make u look so bad going after eve players who know nothing, lol. Seriously, anyone proud of a defenseless miner kill record is a waste of human skin, lol.

Again, am new, and just relaying what my observations are so far.
Your points and views would be appreciated.


Thank you kindly


Far being it for me to chastise a NPC corp characters (who has not been in a corp) perspective on people in corps unable to defend themselves.

I would agree with your statement for no wars in system 1.0 and 0.9 if people who are in corps are not allowed in there, and the only available missions are tutorials and a very small belts for mining few and far between.

On the same note.. I will be waiting for you to join a corp.

"Kane is the End Boss of Highsec." -Psychotic Monk

Krixtal Icefluxor
INLAND EMPIRE Galactic
#5 - 2013-03-27 20:20:43 UTC  |  Edited by: Krixtal Icefluxor
Atroken Ahashion wrote:


My suggestion, have high sec (1.0,0.9) areas free of wardecs on corps.



THIS will l never, ever happen.

Would one's Corp have to be based there ? Only operate there ? Useless then as a POS cannot be anchored in systems that high.

Plus it's a situation of not enough of the better ores to mine, or high quality Exploration sites.

My income would = nerf.

No thanks. Sorry.

"He has mounted his hind-legs, and blown crass vapidities through the bowel of his neck."  - Ambrose Bierce on Oscar Wilde's Lecture in San Francisco 1882

Takseen
Federal Defense Union
Gallente Federation
#6 - 2013-03-27 20:37:04 UTC
But if as you say people are already forming casual social groups while in NPC corps, what problem is there to be fixed?
Atroken Ahashion
Doomheim
#7 - 2013-03-27 20:58:47 UTC
Ladies and Gents,

Let me re-iterate my previous suggestion.

Would we all not want everyone to move out of highsec into low sec and beyond to enjoy the rest of eve?

I certainly would not like to be in an npc corp permanently while my stay here, there is too much to explore do and learn about this great game from seasoned player corps.

Is there not a general consensus about too many new corps?

My idea would be as stated, u have 3 months and min 40-50 max membership to get ur corp trained and prepared to move into eve environment. No building of pos's etc or establish ur self permanently, those are the rules.
Your corp can move out if u feel ur ready before time frame.
This will inject good sized corps into eve with a basic set of skills and objectives/contacts etc for alliances.
If none of the criteria is met, the corp starts over or joins another to move into eve environment.

No more 1 man corps, no more zillions of little ones, no more looking through tax shelters as a newb, good basic skilled player corps coming out of newb space is what i'm proposing.

And no, its not crying as a newb, and nothing has to be fixed, it is only a suggestion to alleviate the concerns of vet corps, newbs and pvpr's alike, that i have listened to since i started.

Again, inputs are most welcome

Thank you kindly
ErrorRon
Turbo-Encabulator LLC
#8 - 2013-03-27 21:02:37 UTC
Atroken Ahashion wrote:
Hello all,

Great game. Have studied hard and am doing very well i think as a new player.
Am in high sec as a solo "carebear" and i'll tell u several reasons why.

Analysing corps for joining and taking into account all of the alts this game has, it is hard to trust certain criteria corps. You join a corp, then their alts take u out in that corp, corp loses members and the cycle begins again.
Even though i'm new, it didnt take long for a pattern to emerge.
Wardec histories and alliance statistics give certain red flags for me.
One point for NPC corps.

When i did find great newer/younger corps to join that really wanted to make a go of it, they are being wardecced at every opportunity.
Again another point for npc corps.

End result for new players, when in high sec can mine, do missions, epics, and have a great npc crew to talk to without the hassle of wardecs. They can actually get things done and build without having to "rebuild" on a weekly basis.
There are public mining fleets with orcas, where we all work together, we help each other in missions and other matters, just like a player corp.
The willingness and determination is out there amongst new players/corps in eve.
Another point for npc corps.

My suggestion, have high sec (1.0,0.9) areas free of wardecs on corps. Conditions apply for corps to move out of that sector for re-establishment and integration into eve; once having reached said amount of members or timeframe.
These conditions will motivate the corps to hire, train and succeed to move on. Plus ur getting good operational new corps into eve environment.

Why, well once established and new players/corps get some knowledge, then wardecs would be appropriate, and at that time bigger corps can add them as an alliance.
This would enhance better stability for new players, as the learning curve is steep enough in eve.

AND, for you pvpr's the wardecs would be more juicy looking corps, and wont make u look so bad going after eve players who know nothing, lol. Seriously, anyone proud of a defenseless miner kill record is a waste of human skin, lol.

Again, am new, and just relaying what my observations are so far.
Your points and views would be appreciated.


Thank you kindly


Stopped reading when you said you are a 'solo carebear'.
why play a massive multiplayer game solo?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UtItWL6GfSM CCP Gargant -  Dev of my heart.

Psychotic Monk
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#9 - 2013-03-27 21:16:32 UTC
I'm sorry that you join corps that are unwilling to defend themselves. Would you also argue that smaller corps in nullsec should be immune to being shot at my larger and better organized corps? In what other ways should we be nerfing ability?
Fractal Muse
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#10 - 2013-03-27 21:17:19 UTC
Atroken Ahashion wrote:

Is there not a general consensus about too many new corps?

Not amongst the EVE players that I play with.

I don't know who you've been listening to.


Holgrak Blacksmith
Prophets of Motav
#11 - 2013-03-27 21:28:14 UTC  |  Edited by: Holgrak Blacksmith
I'm not attacking your logic here, just offering some really good advice. Your reasons for staying in an npc corp in high are the exact reasons why high sec is so bad.

Go to null. You will have a far, far better social situation in most null corps than you will ever get in an npc corp. There will also be people there who really know what they're doing and will be able to offer you invaluable advice as a newbro. Wardecs are, for the most part, far less of a problem in null than they are in high because you have a whole alliance of people who actually give a **** to back you up. Finally, you WILL get bored of your 'solo carebearing' , get out of high sec ASAP and you will enjoy the game a whole lot more.

As a side note, it's not nearly as hard to find a friendly, decent null corp as many posters here will try and tell you. And yes, they will accept people with less than 10^17 skill points.
ShahFluffers
Ice Fire Warriors
#12 - 2013-03-27 21:34:48 UTC  |  Edited by: ShahFluffers
OP...

The problem with your idea is that every part of the game competes and affects with every other area of the game. Miners who ply their trade in high-sec indirectly affect the economy in deep null-sec.

If you create a "safe zone" (which is what your idea will more or less lead to if we follow the "slippery slope" to its eventual conclusion) then you are basically making an area of the game where you are allowed to affect everyone else without being adversely affected yourself.
At this point you are no longer playing a "sandbox" game.


And those veterans you briefly talked about in your OP? The ones using alts in corps to kill you and other new players? What will stop them from creating new alts/accounts to conduct their business in these "safe zones" themselves? They will effectively be "safe" to fund and provide logistical support to their people in the rest of the game without being in much danger themselves.

"Starter systems" already have exceptional "unofficial" rules and they do exactly what they need to and nothing more. No need to expand this.
Alt Obviously
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#13 - 2013-03-27 21:44:20 UTC
ErrorRon wrote:
Atroken Ahashion wrote:



Thank you kindly


Stopped reading when you said you are a 'solo carebear'.
why play a massive multiplayer game solo?



It's a bit off topic, but I never understand these kinds of remarks. How about the human competition in an MMO? Or how about interacting with others (chat, messages, etc.) without wanting to be part of a tribe straight away. And how about just letting people choose their own way of enjoying the game?

Back to the OP: it's definitely an issue that deserves some attention, so thanks for starting this thread (in such a constructive way).
Zircon Dasher
#14 - 2013-03-27 21:44:52 UTC
I love CSM election season.

The best 'hai I am just a newb, but I have this great idea......" threads spring up like so many daffodils. It really does bring a nice touch of color to the doldrums of winter forums.

Totally agree with the idea though. Gotta pack the alliances to the gills if CCP really wants to make bottom-up income viable long-term.

Nerfing High-sec is never the answer. It is the question. The answer is 'YES'.

Montevius Williams
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#15 - 2013-03-27 21:48:57 UTC
ShahFluffers wrote:
OP...

The problem with your idea is that every part of the game competes and affects with every other area of the game. Miners who ply their trade in high-sec indirectly affect the economy in deep null-sec.

If you create a "safe zone" (which is what your idea will eventually lead to if we follow the "slippery slope" to its eventual conclusion) then you are basically making an area of the game where you are allowed to affect everyone else without being adversely affected yourself.
At this point you are no longer playing a "sandbox" game.


And those veterans you briefly talked about in your OP? The ones using alts in corps to kill you and other new players? What will stop them from creating new alts/accounts to conduct their business in these "safe zones" themselves? They will effectively be "safe" to fund and provide logistical support to their people in the rest of the game without being in much danger themselves.

"Starter systems" already have exceptional "unofficial" rules and they do exactly what they need to and nothing more. No need to expand this.



You bring up good points, but there are ways around that. I think the OP does bring up some valid issues and concerns. I dont agree with everything he's states, but I understand the general context of what he's trying to convey.

"The American Government indoctrination system known as public education has been relentlessly churning out socialists for over 20 years". - TravisWB

Montevius Williams
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#16 - 2013-03-27 21:50:46 UTC
ErrorRon wrote:
Atroken Ahashion wrote:
Hello all,

Great game. Have studied hard and am doing very well i think as a new player.
Am in high sec as a solo "carebear" and i'll tell u several reasons why.

Analysing corps for joining and taking into account all of the alts this game has, it is hard to trust certain criteria corps. You join a corp, then their alts take u out in that corp, corp loses members and the cycle begins again.
Even though i'm new, it didnt take long for a pattern to emerge.
Wardec histories and alliance statistics give certain red flags for me.
One point for NPC corps.

When i did find great newer/younger corps to join that really wanted to make a go of it, they are being wardecced at every opportunity.
Again another point for npc corps.

End result for new players, when in high sec can mine, do missions, epics, and have a great npc crew to talk to without the hassle of wardecs. They can actually get things done and build without having to "rebuild" on a weekly basis.
There are public mining fleets with orcas, where we all work together, we help each other in missions and other matters, just like a player corp.
The willingness and determination is out there amongst new players/corps in eve.
Another point for npc corps.

My suggestion, have high sec (1.0,0.9) areas free of wardecs on corps. Conditions apply for corps to move out of that sector for re-establishment and integration into eve; once having reached said amount of members or timeframe.
These conditions will motivate the corps to hire, train and succeed to move on. Plus ur getting good operational new corps into eve environment.

Why, well once established and new players/corps get some knowledge, then wardecs would be appropriate, and at that time bigger corps can add them as an alliance.
This would enhance better stability for new players, as the learning curve is steep enough in eve.

AND, for you pvpr's the wardecs would be more juicy looking corps, and wont make u look so bad going after eve players who know nothing, lol. Seriously, anyone proud of a defenseless miner kill record is a waste of human skin, lol.

Again, am new, and just relaying what my observations are so far.
Your points and views would be appreciated.


Thank you kindly


Stopped reading when you said you are a 'solo carebear'.
why play a massive multiplayer game solo?


Probably becasue most all modern MMO's have solo content. Including EVE Online.

"The American Government indoctrination system known as public education has been relentlessly churning out socialists for over 20 years". - TravisWB

Krixtal Icefluxor
INLAND EMPIRE Galactic
#17 - 2013-03-27 21:51:12 UTC
Atroken Ahashion wrote:


Would we all not want everyone to move out of highsec into low sec and beyond to enjoy the rest of eve?



I thought this would a a 'stealth something' thread.

Indeed I was right.

Boy, are you gonna love reading what I have to say about my finally one month of playing in Low Sec.....NOT !


Next...........

"He has mounted his hind-legs, and blown crass vapidities through the bowel of his neck."  - Ambrose Bierce on Oscar Wilde's Lecture in San Francisco 1882

Krixtal Icefluxor
INLAND EMPIRE Galactic
#18 - 2013-03-27 21:52:56 UTC
ErrorRon wrote:


Stopped reading when you said you are a 'solo carebear'.
why play a massive multiplayer game solo?



Ancient, tired argument.

Even 'solo' has to interact in the Market, and pay attention to others to avoid being ganked.

Next.

"He has mounted his hind-legs, and blown crass vapidities through the bowel of his neck."  - Ambrose Bierce on Oscar Wilde's Lecture in San Francisco 1882

Atroken Ahashion
Doomheim
#19 - 2013-03-27 21:58:08 UTC
bump,



Hey all, ty so much for the input, definitely good points to ponder over.

Pros and cons, and how I affect eve in my own little world, GOOD POINT.


Will adjust mindset and remap, LOL.
Unsuccessful At Everything
The Troll Bridge
#20 - 2013-03-27 22:08:49 UTC
NPC Corp member trying to talk authoritatively about player run corps.

Since the cessation of their usefulness is imminent, may I appropriate your belongings?

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