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Intergalactic Summit

 
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Call to nations to unite against Federation villany
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Andreus Ixiris
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#101 - 2013-03-27 09:48:31 UTC
Diana Kim wrote:
1. "you keep braying about"
2. "you can never point"
3. "you're jealous"
4. "you're jealous that i have friends"
5. "that i have friends" - well, not a lie, actually, but can not be confirmed
6. "if you had a shred of decenty"
7. "if you had a shred of honour"
8. "if you had a shred of intellectual honesty"
9. "you might make some friends too" - in terms implying i had none
10. "then you wouldn't be so miserable"
11. "then you wouldn't be so angry all the time"

11 lies for such a small passage, that's sick.

You haven't actually proved how any of these are lies. You haven't provided any evidence as to the fact that any of these are false - just like you haven't provided any evidence as to the fact that any of your assertions about the Federation or the State are true, because you always hide behind the shield of "I don't have to justify myself to you."

Like I said, Diana - keep talking. Every time you do, you make yourself look worse to literally everyone. Notice how when you spew drivel in other threads fewer and fewer people pay attention to your nonsense each time?

Andreus Ixiris > A Civire without a chin is barely a Civire at all.

Pieter Tuulinen > He'd be Civirely disadvantaged, Andreus.

Andreus Ixiris > ...

Andreus Ixiris > This is why we're at war.
Diana Kim
State Protectorate
Caldari State
#102 - 2013-03-27 09:59:37 UTC
Andreus Ixiris wrote:

You haven't actually proved how any of these are lies.

I am not intended to provide any proofs against your ravings, since it will be simply stupid.

As I have told you before, if you want me to prove something, go ahead and ask properly, if you can. Ha. Ha. Ha.

Honored are the dead, for their legacy guides us.

In memory of Tibus Heth, Caldari State Executor YC110-115, Hero and Patriot.
Andreus Ixiris
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#103 - 2013-03-27 10:11:08 UTC
Diana Kim wrote:
I am not intended to provide any proofs against your ravings, since it will be simply stupid.

One is forced to assume since some of the things I've said are relatively self-evident that you are simply acknowledging their truth.

Diana Kim wrote:
As I have told you before, if you want me to prove something, go ahead and ask properly, if you can. Ha. Ha. Ha.

What you're doing in this instance is known, in terms of formal debate, as responding to tone, which is, incidentally, the second highest tier on the pyramid of debate you've reached so far. If the core conceit of an argument is valid, it does not become less valid because it is communicated in an ascerbic or otherwise disagreeable manner. Even if the recipient is greivously offended by the manner in which it is communicated, it doesn't in any way invalidate the argument itself.

This means that demands for arguments to be put across in a manner pleasing to you are a smokescreen - a red herring, an appeal to emotion. You are - or at least, from complete lack of evidence to the contrary, seem to be - attempting to compensate for insufficiencies in your counterargument by focusing on the manner in which the assertions are being made. Unfortunately (for you) attacking the tone of an argument does not serve to refute it in any manner, and my points stand.

Andreus Ixiris > A Civire without a chin is barely a Civire at all.

Pieter Tuulinen > He'd be Civirely disadvantaged, Andreus.

Andreus Ixiris > ...

Andreus Ixiris > This is why we're at war.
Diana Kim
State Protectorate
Caldari State
#104 - 2013-03-27 10:21:31 UTC
Andreus Ixiris wrote:

What you're doing in this instance is known, in terms of formal debate, as responding to tone

Oh, I am afraid you didn't understand even this easy part.
Silly gallentean kid :) I am not critisizing your tone.
I am criticizing YOU as being unable to use proper tone (but I am not sure I should call it just "tone", because it's about just 90% of your "content"). Whatever. You got the idea. Or not. Then it's just your loss.

Honored are the dead, for their legacy guides us.

In memory of Tibus Heth, Caldari State Executor YC110-115, Hero and Patriot.
Andreus Ixiris
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#105 - 2013-03-27 10:25:18 UTC
Diana Kim wrote:
Oh, I am afraid you didn't understand even this easy part.
Silly gallentean kid :) I am not critisizing your tone.
I am criticizing YOU as being unable to use proper tone (but I am not sure I should call it just "tone", because it's about just 90% of your "content").

Which actually means you're actually slipping lower on the heirarchy of debate into ad hominem, which is, as stated by the above diagram, "attacking the characteristics or authority of the writer without addressing the substance of the argument," which is an even less valid tactic of debate.

Congratulations. With all the bullets you're pouring into them, it's amazing you still have feet left to stand on.

Andreus Ixiris > A Civire without a chin is barely a Civire at all.

Pieter Tuulinen > He'd be Civirely disadvantaged, Andreus.

Andreus Ixiris > ...

Andreus Ixiris > This is why we're at war.
Halete
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#106 - 2013-03-27 10:27:43 UTC
And you're making the mistake of attacking the presentation of her argument, which doesn't necessarily affect the validity of her stance.

Spirits, Andreus. I would like to see one damn debate you're in where you don't scream 'that's an Ad Hominem!' like a little girl.

"To know the true path, but yet, to never follow it. That is possibly the gravest sin" - The Scriptures, Book of Missions 13:21
Andreus Ixiris
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#107 - 2013-03-27 10:39:15 UTC  |  Edited by: Andreus Ixiris
Halete wrote:
And you're making the mistake of attacking the presentation of her argument, which doesn't necessarily affect the validity of her stance.

Spirits, Andreus. I would like to see one damn debate you're in where you don't scream 'that's an Ad Hominem!' like a little girl.

But the subject of the debate in this instance is the presentation of her argument, and if she is using it as an excuse to avoid discussing relevant issues (such as, you know, her entire stance on the Gallente-Caldari conflict) it is entirely relevant to call her out on it.

Andreus Ixiris > A Civire without a chin is barely a Civire at all.

Pieter Tuulinen > He'd be Civirely disadvantaged, Andreus.

Andreus Ixiris > ...

Andreus Ixiris > This is why we're at war.
Diana Kim
State Protectorate
Caldari State
#108 - 2013-03-27 10:42:25 UTC
Andreus Ixiris wrote:

Which actually means you're actually slipping lower on the heirarchy of debate into ad hominem, which is, as stated by the above diagram, "attacking the characteristics or authority of the writer without addressing the substance of the argument," which is an even less valid tactic of debate.

You have almost perfectly described what you are doing. Actually, I am thinking about some sort of standard answer that will cover all your possible ravings, so I will stop wasting my precious time on something like you.

Honored are the dead, for their legacy guides us.

In memory of Tibus Heth, Caldari State Executor YC110-115, Hero and Patriot.
Diana Kim
State Protectorate
Caldari State
#109 - 2013-03-27 10:44:33 UTC
Halete wrote:

Spirits, Andreus. I would like to see one damn debate you're in where you don't scream 'that's an Ad Hominem!' like a little girl.

The main problem is not that he screams it, but what he just runs in, starts this ad hominem thing and then dares to blame others. And the secondary problem, is that he doesn't bring real content with him, which is a bit sad.

Honored are the dead, for their legacy guides us.

In memory of Tibus Heth, Caldari State Executor YC110-115, Hero and Patriot.
Andreus Ixiris
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#110 - 2013-03-27 10:45:45 UTC  |  Edited by: Andreus Ixiris
Diana Kim wrote:
You have almost perfectly described what you are doing. Actually, I am thinking about some sort of standard answer that will cover all your possible ravings, so I will stop wasting my precious time on something like you.

Actually, I've just specifically explained why your arguments about the content of my posts are not valid responses to my questions about the validity of your stance on the Gallente-Caldari conflict. What you're doing is attempting to redirect conversation away from your stance and onto the way in which the discussion of your stance is being held.

In short, one can easily conclude that you have ulterior motives for questioning the tone of the argument or the behaviour of the arguer, and that your claim of disrespect is misdirection.

Your arguments have no validity because all they are are impassioned and deeply racist statements with no supporting evidence to back them up. When you are called to account for their baseless nature, you respond not by providing substance to your statements, but by attacking the person questioning them. Over time, this builds up a buffer memory of disrespect and contempt in the people who talk to you, which prevents them from interfacing with you on the level of a reasonable adult.

Andreus Ixiris > A Civire without a chin is barely a Civire at all.

Pieter Tuulinen > He'd be Civirely disadvantaged, Andreus.

Andreus Ixiris > ...

Andreus Ixiris > This is why we're at war.
Diana Kim
State Protectorate
Caldari State
#111 - 2013-03-27 10:49:00 UTC  |  Edited by: Diana Kim
While you dare to say things like
Andreus Ixiris wrote:

What you're doing is attempting to...
Your arguments have no validity
That you have ulterior motives
That your claim of disrespect is misdirection

instead of explaining what you are doing, you are simply not allowed to receive proper answers from me.

Honored are the dead, for their legacy guides us.

In memory of Tibus Heth, Caldari State Executor YC110-115, Hero and Patriot.
Andreus Ixiris
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#112 - 2013-03-27 10:49:59 UTC
Diana Kim wrote:
instead of explaining what you are doing, you are simply not allowed to receive proper answers from me.

No, you're simply unwilling to give them.

A valid counterargument is not contingent of the behaviour of the debater whose argument it is a counter to.

Andreus Ixiris > A Civire without a chin is barely a Civire at all.

Pieter Tuulinen > He'd be Civirely disadvantaged, Andreus.

Andreus Ixiris > ...

Andreus Ixiris > This is why we're at war.
Diana Kim
State Protectorate
Caldari State
#113 - 2013-03-27 10:52:45 UTC
Andreus Ixiris wrote:

No, you're simply unwilling to give them.

Exactly!
I do not want to cast pearls before swine.

Honored are the dead, for their legacy guides us.

In memory of Tibus Heth, Caldari State Executor YC110-115, Hero and Patriot.
Andreus Ixiris
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#114 - 2013-03-27 11:06:08 UTC
Diana Kim wrote:
Exactly!
I do not want to cast pearls before swine.

And now you've fallen to the lowest tier of the debate pyramid, name-calling. Here's what's going on, Kim: you're claiming to have counterarguments but continually shifting the goalposts as to what is neccessary for people to actually see the counterarguments, but you show no evidence to anyone that these counterarguments actually exist. In the absence of any evidence to the contrary we are forced to assume that these counterarguments don't exist, and that you are simply contriving excuses for their absence.

Andreus Ixiris > A Civire without a chin is barely a Civire at all.

Pieter Tuulinen > He'd be Civirely disadvantaged, Andreus.

Andreus Ixiris > ...

Andreus Ixiris > This is why we're at war.
Diana Kim
State Protectorate
Caldari State
#115 - 2013-03-27 11:59:06 UTC
Blaming others in what you are doing, is it normal for you, yes?
How many pages ago I suggested you to try to actually discuss the problem. And you still fail to do this. Of course I have counterarguments, you just can't ask for them properly.

It is in your and only your hands only will you get them or not. And it depends on your ability to understand what you have to do. If you can't, then... just deal with it, it's your loss. Or ask for some help. Professional help.

Honored are the dead, for their legacy guides us.

In memory of Tibus Heth, Caldari State Executor YC110-115, Hero and Patriot.
Toluijin Chagangan
Doomheim
#116 - 2013-03-27 12:16:48 UTC
Kim, if you have valid counter arguments, then state them clearly for the record.
the petty arguments you are indulging in at the moment are in no way helping your argument.
In fact, if you think they are even painting the state in a favourable light, you are very much mistaken.

Personally I wonder what you are going to do when your personal messiah Heth, and the state you claim to revere are no longer one and the same.
That will be an interesting day.

Seven Tribes.
One Matari People.
Diana Kim
State Protectorate
Caldari State
#117 - 2013-03-27 12:34:34 UTC
Toluijin Chagangan wrote:
Kim, if you have valid counter arguments, then state them clearly for the record.
the petty arguments you are indulging in at the moment are in no way helping your argument.
In fact, if you think they are even painting the state in a favourable light, you are very much mistaken.

The problem is, to state valid counter arguments, I need valid arguments first. And so far I haven't been provided with them.

Toluijin Chagangan wrote:

Personally I wonder what you are going to do when your personal messiah Heth, and the state you claim to revere are no longer one and the same.
That will be an interesting day.

I am a soldier, sir, and despite that I, indeed, have some personal reasons to stay on Heth's side, I will do what the duty will require me to do.

Honored are the dead, for their legacy guides us.

In memory of Tibus Heth, Caldari State Executor YC110-115, Hero and Patriot.
Anabella Rella
Gradient
Electus Matari
#118 - 2013-03-27 15:00:59 UTC
Trolls, do not feed them.

When the world is running down, you make the best of what's still around.
Anja Suorsa
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#119 - 2013-03-27 15:04:51 UTC
Get a room and work out your frustrations there, in private.
Andreus Ixiris
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#120 - 2013-03-27 15:42:16 UTC
Diana Kim wrote:
Blaming others in what you are doing, is it normal for you, yes?

No, it's normal for you.

Diana Kim wrote:
How many pages ago I suggested you to try to actually discuss the problem. And you still fail to do this. Of course I have counterarguments, you just can't ask for them properly.

I'm sorry, but as much as you imagine yourself far more important than you are, you don't get to dictate how other people act, nor how other people ask for your counterarguments. If you can't deliver counterarguments despite the behaviour of other people, you're never going to get the respect you demand.

You think that I'm lying when I say no-one else on the IGS respects you, but it's pretty much self-evident. Either give your counterarguments or stop talking - these are really the only two choices you have if you want to earn back the respect you've lost.

Andreus Ixiris > A Civire without a chin is barely a Civire at all.

Pieter Tuulinen > He'd be Civirely disadvantaged, Andreus.

Andreus Ixiris > ...

Andreus Ixiris > This is why we're at war.