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Finish WiS: Kickstarter or Paid Expansion

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Arduemont
Rotten Legion
#61 - 2013-03-24 22:43:59 UTC
Anything to get CCP to dedicate some resources to Avatar content.

"In the age of information, ignorance is a choice." www.stateofwar.co.nf
Danny John-Peter
The Congregation
RAPID HEAVY ROPERS
#62 - 2013-03-24 22:45:53 UTC
Emma Royd wrote:
Seriously? I thought "Load Station Environment" was the first checkbox to get unticked everytime people re-installed the game.

It adds nothing to the game as it is, and it's high time it was scrapped completely and save some server load.


Surely CCP could have a poll or something for judging how many people want WiS or not, and then decide if it's worth pursuing.

I'd love to see it but only at the end of a list of other important things in the game like pos revamp, corp roles revamp, total science and industry revamp, mining revamp, navy battlecruisers, forum auto whine-eraser.

Then maybe they could spend some time and isk developing something that people aren't really bothered about.

If I want to run around to do stuff I'll play WoW Lol


Its probably worth mentioning that nobody ticks that button, because it also prevents ship spinning.
KuroVolt
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#63 - 2013-03-24 22:52:40 UTC
Danny John-Peter wrote:
Emma Royd wrote:
Seriously? I thought "Load Station Environment" was the first checkbox to get unticked everytime people re-installed the game.

It adds nothing to the game as it is, and it's high time it was scrapped completely and save some server load.


Surely CCP could have a poll or something for judging how many people want WiS or not, and then decide if it's worth pursuing.

I'd love to see it but only at the end of a list of other important things in the game like pos revamp, corp roles revamp, total science and industry revamp, mining revamp, navy battlecruisers, forum auto whine-eraser.

Then maybe they could spend some time and isk developing something that people aren't really bothered about.

If I want to run around to do stuff I'll play WoW Lol


Its probably worth mentioning that nobody ticks that button, because it also prevents ship spinning.


Ship spinning is the most serious of bussinesses indeed.

I think the people saying WIS is a bad thing to add to the game make no sense, it wouldnt detract from the current game in any way and it would satisfy the people who are into it, which Im sure isnt a small minority.

BoBwins Law: As a discussion/war between two large nullsec entities grows longer, the probability of one comparing the other to BoB aproaches near certainty.
Goldiiee
Bureau of Astronomical Anomalies
#64 - 2013-03-24 22:55:13 UTC
No, dont take it away. I sit my avatar down in front of the big screen when I am waiting for a new incursion to spawn, watching the big screen, in my room, with my quafe, with my ship hologram... and I kinda like it, feels like home. :)

Things that keep me up at night;  Why do we use a voice communication device to send telegraphs? Moore's Law should state, Once you have paid off the last PC upgrade you will need another.
Tarpedo
Incursionista
#65 - 2013-03-25 00:24:46 UTC  |  Edited by: Tarpedo
I don't believe CCP is able to do anything interesting in less than 3-5 years of work. Won't invest in the idea upfront.

However I'll purchase WiS if it will cost as usual game expansion ($50) and will have at least common halls + chat bubbles + station windows. Though actual gameplay could be nice too (exploration, PvE a-la ME2 or Defiance, clothing craft and loot maybe)
Varesk
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#66 - 2013-03-25 02:30:14 UTC
Emma Royd wrote:
Seriously? I thought "Load Station Environment" was the first checkbox to get unticked everytime people re-installed the game.

It adds nothing to the game as it is, and it's high time it was scrapped completely and save some server load.


Surely CCP could have a poll or something for judging how many people want WiS or not, and then decide if it's worth pursuing.

I'd love to see it but only at the end of a list of other important things in the game like pos revamp, corp roles revamp, total science and industry revamp, mining revamp, navy battlecruisers, forum auto whine-eraser.

Then maybe they could spend some time and isk developing something that people aren't really bothered about.

If I want to run around to do stuff I'll play WoW Lol


actually its the second after clicking the "only show launcher if there is an update" box.
Xindi Kraid
Itsukame-Zainou Hyperspatial Inquiries Ltd.
Arataka Research Consortium
#67 - 2013-03-25 06:35:45 UTC
I can't see a kickstarter like that getting off the ground.

Besides, if CCP can afford to produce a second game, they can afford to come through on their promises with the money they have now.
Flamespar
WarRavens
#68 - 2013-03-25 06:46:33 UTC
Xindi Kraid wrote:
I can't see a kickstarter like that getting off the ground.

Besides, if CCP can afford to produce a second game, they can afford to come through on their promises with the money they have now.


This guy gets it.
Indahmawar Fazmarai
#69 - 2013-03-25 07:51:43 UTC  |  Edited by: Indahmawar Fazmarai
Tarpedo wrote:
I don't believe CCP is able to do anything interesting in less than 3-5 years of work. Won't invest in the idea upfront.

However I'll purchase WiS if it will cost as usual game expansion ($50) and will have at least common halls + chat bubbles + station windows. Though actual gameplay could be nice too (exploration, PvE a-la ME2 or Defiance, clothing craft and loot maybe)


Do you know why EVE expansions are free?

Case 1: because CCP is a loving, caring company who doesn't minds spending a helluvah time, money and resources just to give them up for your average buck

Case 2: because having a single server to handle multiple versions of the client at once would incur into development and compatibility issues that would escalate with each further expansion

Case 3: because EVE was released as a barely finished product and it needed continous expansions to get full functionality, and that started a consumer habit of getting content for free which CCP couldn't revert without suffering a serious loss of customers

Two of the above are right, the other isn't, and anyway those are the reasons why paid expansions are not likely to come in the foreseable future. Even a standalone spinoff WiS game is more likely to happen, maybe after WoD was released and got up to speed.
Tobey Darkness
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#70 - 2013-03-25 08:17:36 UTC
My vision for WiS is as follows:
You click the door. You select the player you want to visit from a list.
The other player who is in his CQ right now recieves a popup message.
The other player clicks "accept" and you're spawned in his CQ.

Next step: Create a hall.
You click the door. You select the hall. You're spawned next to a door in the hall.

Next step: Create bars and clubs.
You click the door. you select the bar or the club. You're spawned next to a door in the bar or the club.

Too many players in one room? Make it instanced. Limit the player amount. It's not like there is only one hall or club in a station.

This can't be really that hard to make...

Do you know what's really dumbing down eve? Graphics! If you really want a hardcoregame with a learning curve that even beats eve: Try bay12games.com/dwarves
Tiberius StarGazer
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#71 - 2013-03-25 08:36:59 UTC
Johnny Bloomington wrote:
It's a shame that EVE has such small minded people when it comes to WIS. "It didn't work the first time so blah!" Whatever...


+1 from me on that, sometimes the level of cynicism on this forum for new ideas is somewhat shocking.

WIS for me would provide a level of player-player interaction that spaceships in space could ever provide and help cement the universe as something more than just stations and ships.

Indahmawar Fazmarai wrote:
There's more awe in this single SC concept art:

Moscow 30th century concept art

Than in the whole Incarna in its good times before release.


That does look awesome :D
Xindi Kraid
Itsukame-Zainou Hyperspatial Inquiries Ltd.
Arataka Research Consortium
#72 - 2013-03-25 08:39:44 UTC  |  Edited by: Xindi Kraid
Tobey Darkness wrote:
My vision for WiS is as follows:
You click the door. You select the player you want to visit from a list.
The other player who is in his CQ right now recieves a popup message.
The other player clicks "accept" and you're spawned in his CQ.

Next step: Create a hall.
You click the door. You select the hall. You're spawned next to a door in the hall.

Next step: Create bars and clubs.
You click the door. you select the bar or the club. You're spawned next to a door in the bar or the club.

Too many players in one room? Make it instanced. Limit the player amount. It's not like there is only one hall or club in a station.

This can't be really that hard to make...


I do believe the plan was originally to do something like that: Start with avatars in Inferno and then add quarters in Incarna (or was it the other way around; It's hard to keep track of what expansion added what sometimes), and then they planned to add more in station stuff later and then maybe ship interiors.

What happened was people got pissed that they couldn't leave to door and that no developments were made to adding new ships and space mechanics and the backlash caused CCP to overreact and effectively halt WiS production (as I understand it, there's a few devs working on related projects, but time hasn't been devoted in earnest so we aren't going to see much in the short term from those efforts).

We don't need a kickstarter, we just need to convince the devs to balance their focuses on WiS and FiS (flying in space), and now DUST integration rather than focusing on one aspect alone.
Satsuki Izumi
Japan Expo Hydra
#73 - 2013-03-25 09:27:19 UTC
I hope they will improve WIS feature in a near future, it's great for immersion, and EVE have the best avatar of all mmo.
Castor Narcissus
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#74 - 2013-03-25 09:41:06 UTC
I'm sure if their new engine was easy to code with they would already have released something with the small team that was tasked to it.

But it they had to disband it, it means it's too much work just to make little things work properly without major game breaking bugs/glitchs. So what we can expect is that the WoD team improves the engine and makes it easier for WiS to move forward to eve.

Don't get me wrong, I really want a proper WiS in eve, but I want industry, pos and sov mechanics revamp/re-balance to have priority.
Xindi Kraid
Itsukame-Zainou Hyperspatial Inquiries Ltd.
Arataka Research Consortium
#75 - 2013-03-25 09:43:40 UTC
I'm not sure how much is coding and how much amounts to what is essentially level design
Arduemont
Rotten Legion
#76 - 2013-03-25 10:36:29 UTC  |  Edited by: Arduemont
Danny John-Peter wrote:
Its probably worth mentioning that nobody ticks that button, because it also prevents ship spinning.


There was actually a casual poll in GD that implicated half of Eve has CQ on, and the other half doesn't. Of the half that doesn't, they said they only didn't have it on for resource reasons. So if CCP put some time into resource management for the engine (plus the fact people are progressively upgrading hardware) then 3/4s of Eve would have it on. If you actually gave a purpose to the Avatar content stuff then you might even get some of the remaining quarter.

WiS (if it ever happens) could be used to drive CCP into a semi free to play model. If you payed per month for skill training and your pilots licence, then people who aren't playing could do in station stuff, and have to be shipped around by people who actually have their pilots licences. Imagine the grief from suicide ganking a space coach full of "freeby lovers" who can't pilot a ship themsevles.

"In the age of information, ignorance is a choice." www.stateofwar.co.nf
Irya Boone
The Scope
#77 - 2013-03-25 10:44:28 UTC
Or .. or Why not the team who develop DUST just bring some Code to the matrix to open the door and make capsuleers Go on planets or Aboard Structures In space like scouting in Sleepers structures or abandonned structures , etc etc
And make a Big HALL ( cantina ) per systems ( on the Temperate planet ) Roll

And why NOT one day on a temperate planet DUST Vs EVE in a FPS style

CCP it's time to remove Off Grid Boost and Put Them on Killmail too, add Logi on killmails .... Open that damn door !!

you shall all bow and pray BoB
Solstice Project
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#78 - 2013-03-25 10:57:43 UTC  |  Edited by: Solstice Project
Arduemont wrote:
There was actually a casual poll in GD that implicated half of Eve has CQ on, and the other half doesn't. Of the half that doesn't, they said they only didn't have it on for resource reasons. So if CCP put some time into resource management for the engine (plus the fact people are progressively upgrading hardware) then 3/4s of Eve would have it on. If you actually gave a purpose to the Avatar content stuff then you might even get some of the remaining quarter.
Wow, now that poll surely is representative!

In your mind, according to that post:

100% who did that poll represent 100% of GD,
which represents 100% of the forums,
which represents 100% of the playerbase.

Of 100%, 50% say yes and 50% say no.
Of the 50% who say no, all say "x".

As 50% say "x", we only need to fix "x" and we reach a 100% agreement !

EPIC FACEPALM !


You can't seriously be taking this seriously. PLEASE have someone read out loud your
own words for you, so you hopefully realize the nonsense you have written.

I really can't believe the lack of brains you display here !


(edit: the reason why i don't use CQ is because it's pointless having it. I'd love to have actual stations
to walk through, play games with others or annoy them to hell, but the CQ alone adds no gameplay)
Kagura Nikon
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#79 - 2013-03-25 10:58:55 UTC
Mr Kidd wrote:
Ok time to break out some maths.

500K sub base. Assuming average alt count is 4 equals 125K actual players. Assuming 3% of the playerbase cares about WiS enough to donate equals 3750 players. Assuming 0.1% of those are capable and willing to donate meaningful amounts equals about 4 people. Lets see, you'll need a dev team of about 5 people minimum if you want this in the next decade and assuming $62,000 USD per dev for their salary plus inter-corp support costs & entrepreneurial costs means it would cost about $620,000 per year to fund meaning you, as an individual, would have to donate $155,000 per year for WiS to work.

And then there's the whole topic of whether or not WiS could actually work beyond one avatar and a closet. Going by the beta test CCP forced upon it's playerbase I doubt most of them would be willing or able to purchase their own supercomputer to render hundreds of avatars in expansive environments.



The last tiem we had nubmers, the average alt acoutn was a bit over 2. Not even close to 4. So around 200k to 250k players.

"If brute force does not solve your problem....  then you are  surely not using enough!"
Arduemont
Rotten Legion
#80 - 2013-03-25 11:20:53 UTC  |  Edited by: Arduemont
Solstice Project wrote:
Arduemont wrote:
There was actually a casual poll in GD that implicated half of Eve has CQ on, and the other half doesn't. Of the half that doesn't, they said they only didn't have it on for resource reasons. So if CCP put some time into resource management for the engine (plus the fact people are progressively upgrading hardware) then 3/4s of Eve would have it on. If you actually gave a purpose to the Avatar content stuff then you might even get some of the remaining quarter.
Wow, now that poll surely is representative!

In your mind, according to that post:

100% who did that poll represent 100% of GD,
which represents 100% of the forums,
which represents 100% of the playerbase.

Of 100%, 50% say yes and 50% say no.
Of the 50% who say no, all say "x".

As 50% say "x", we only need to fix "x" and we reach a 100% agreement !

EPIC FACEPALM !


You can't seriously be taking this seriously. PLEASE have someone read out loud your
own words for you, so you hopefully realize the nonsense you have written.

I really can't believe the lack of brains you display here !


(edit: the reason why i don't use CQ is because it's pointless having it. I'd love to have actual stations
to walk through, play games with others or annoy them to hell, but the CQ alone adds no gameplay)


Hahaha. Listen, I know a terrible poll isn't a great indication of the truth. However, it is an indication. As it stands you have nothing to counter with. There's no need to be a **** about it. Go find some evidence to the contrary and come back, instead of just flapping your stupid virtual mouth.

Everyone knows that a poll is only truly representative of the people taking said poll. Duh. In the same way the Frammingham Heart disease study which has examined multiple thousands of people and their risk factors are only representative of the people who put themselves forward to do the study. That study however, is the most important study on Heart disease ever conducted. Any evidence no matter how good suffers a degree of the same problem. A internet poll suffers it more than others, sure... but you can still generalise to a certain degree. If you couldn't, people wouldn't take polls.

"In the age of information, ignorance is a choice." www.stateofwar.co.nf