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GEEKS NEEDED! - Titan Falling From the Sky

Author
Ivy Romanova
State Protectorate
Caldari State
#1 - 2013-03-24 09:22:07 UTC  |  Edited by: Ivy Romanova
OK , let put on our nerdy classes and see what will actually happens when the titan CRASHES

Lets see what would the impact be like if the titan crashed down to earth assuming from 0 at 200km above Caldari Prime.

As Caldari Prime can sustain life and people aren't Oompas Lumpas . Lets say it has a similar makeup as Earth.Well.. similar gravity to say the least .

FIRST , let see the gravity gradient.

Arline Kley wrote:
Ok, I started working out the kinetic energy of 1/3rd of the Titan falling out of the sky:

Taking rough estimates of the height and width of the levi (4.5km and 3km) gives me a total of 81km³

Mass: 810,000,000,000kg - one third the value on the info sheet for the titan. Screw trying to figure out exactitudes here.

11.2km/s is for an Earth-Type body - Caldari Prime is 38.6km/s.


That gives a Kinetic Energy of : 603,433,800,000,000,000J: 603 QUADRILLION Joules.




I'm.. i'm not going any further. Caldari Prime would crack under the impact. Not destroy; that would require something far more massive and going faster - crack. As in, "Oh hi, this is the Mantle."



Ivy Romanpva wrote:

I just redid my maths .
I think this should be alright
AH-HA!
I FOUND IT!
COMPLETE caldari prime geological and gravitational data :
Well.. not really complete , but its a NICE start.

Attributes
Planet Type Planet (Temperate)
Density 1467990 kg/m³
Eccentricity 0.014
Escape Velocity 12.248 km/s
Mass Dust 6.445e+24 kg
Mass Gas 8.734e+24 kg
Orbit Period 3785.4 days
Orbit Radius 5.181 AU
Pressure 21.12 kPa
Radius 13,503 km
Surface Gravity 7.618 m/s²
Temperature 297.00 K


Alright then, the planet mass would then by approximately (Neglecting the Equatorial bulge since I am in a state of Apple CIder induced "cannot be arsed"), but here , if you feel like it . Do it
mω2rsinφ=−mg(1/r)(dr/dφ)

r(0)−r(π/2)≈[(ω^2)(r¯^2)]/g¯

Kudos to Kepler

planet mass (M) = 2.0816437768816E+25 kilogram
GEO orbit radius from surface = 13504.618km
If some of ya love integration , you would get a MUCH more accurate result than mine . The following would be slighly overestimating the effects , but meh.

The titan would impact earth at 14343.88176192205 ms-1 (14.3kms^-1)
Considering it was a vertical drop , the sphere of debris would be well within that of a small country , so lets say
The KE of the impact would be around 249982536960Megajoules = 59.747260267686 megaton of TNT .
Well then .. it ain't so bad.


HOWEVER , thats not what the asteroid impact tool said about impacts of such magnitude.


Major Global Changes:
The Earth is not strongly disturbed by the impact and loses negligible mass.
The impact does not make a noticeable change in the tilt of Earth's axis (< 5 hundreths of a degree).
The impact does not shift the Earth's orbit noticeably.

Crater Dimensions:
Transient Crater Diameter: 64.5 km ( = 40.1 miles )
Transient Crater Depth: 22.8 km ( = 14.2 miles )
Final Crater Diameter: 112 km ( = 69.3 miles )
Final Crater Depth: 1.22 km ( = 0.76 miles )
The crater formed is a complex crater.

Seismic Effects:
The major seismic shaking will arrive approximately 40 seconds after impact.
Richter Scale Magnitude: 9.5 (This is greater than any earthquake in recorded history)
Mercalli Scale Intensity at a distance of 200 km:

IX. General panic. Damage considerable in specially designed structures;
well-designed frame structures thrown out of plumb.
Damage great in substantial buildings, with partial collapse.
Buildings shifted off foundations.
Serious damage to reservoirs.
Underground pipes broken.
Conspicuous cracks in ground.
In alluviated areas sand and mud ejected, earthquake fountains, sand craters.

X. Most masonry and frame structures destroyed with their foundations.
Some well-built wooden structures and bridges destroyed.
Serious damage to dams, dikes, embankments.
Large landslides.
Water thrown on banks of canals, rivers, lakes, etc. Sand and mud shifted horizontally on beaches and flat land. Rails bent slightly.

Ejecta:
The ejecta will arrive approximately 3.43 minutes after the impact.
At your position there is a fine dusting of ejecta with occasional larger fragments
Average Ejecta Thickness: 19.3 meters ( = 63.4 feet )
Mean Fragment Diameter: 12.1 cm ( = 4.75 inches )

Air Blast:
The air blast will arrive approximately 10.1 minutes after impact.
Peak Overpressure: 1.56e+06 Pa = 15.6 bars = 221 psi
Max wind velocity: 969 m/s = 2170 mph
Sound Intensity: 124 dB (Dangerously Loud)
Damage Description:

Multistory wall-bearing buildings will collapse.

Wood frame buildings will almost completely collapse.

Multistory steel-framed office-type buildings will suffer extreme frame distortion, incipient collapse.

Highway truss bridges will collapse.

Highway girder bridges will collapse.

Glass windows will shatter.

Cars and trucks will be largely displaced and grossly distorted and will require rebuilding before use.

Up to 90 percent of trees blown down; remainder stripped of branches and leaves.



OopsApparently this is VERY rough and layman in terms of technical accuracy .
If you are one of IMMENSE intellect and expertise in the field .
PLEASE , do a reply of what you think would have happened realistically speakingOops


AHA_HA!!!
The VOID HAS BEEN FILLED!!!

▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬ஜ۩۞۩ஜ▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬ DAMN THIS    SIGNATURE    IS FANCY ▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬ஜ۩۞۩ஜ▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬

Xearal
Dead's Prostitutes
The Initiative.
#2 - 2013-03-24 09:42:57 UTC
So basicly all the dinosaurs on Caldari Prime will die. Shocked

Does railgun ammunition come in Hollow Point?

Ivy Romanova
State Protectorate
Caldari State
#3 - 2013-03-24 09:45:57 UTC  |  Edited by: Ivy Romanova
Arline Kley wrote:
Ok, I started working out the kinetic energy of 1/3rd of the Titan falling out of the sky:

Taking rough estimates of the height and width of the levi (4.5km and 3km) gives me a total of 81km³

Mass: 810,000,000,000kg - one third the value on the info sheet for the titan. Screw trying to figure out exactitudes here.

11.2km/s is for an Earth-Type body - Caldari Prime is 38.6km/s.


That gives a Kinetic Energy of : 603,433,800,000,000,000J: 603 QUADRILLION Joules.




I'm.. i'm not going any further. Caldari Prime would crack under the impact. Not destroy; that would require something far more massive and going faster - crack. As in, "Oh hi, this is the Mantle."



Nova Fox wrote:
Cough* Caldari Prime is very unlike Earth Cough*

Caldari Prime

290 K Temperature
3.5e+25kg Mass
2907.7 g/cm3 Density
10,3 m/s^2 Surface Gravity
38.6 km/s Escape Velocity
646.36 kPA
30,217 km radius

vs

Earth

287K Temeprature
5.972e +24kg Mass
5.52 g/mc3 Density
9.78 m/s^2 Surface Gravity
11.2 km/s Escape Velocity
101.325 kPA
6,371 km radius

Also as someone else pointed out the entire leviathan is like 0.7% the density of iron. Also if anyone would like to count the amount of shots the leviathan took while getting blasted in armor and subtract that mass as those where likely antimatter shots. Then we need to figure out how large where the reactors on a Caldari titan and how much mass is required to to be destroyed to collapse the black holes Caladari uses for power sources (though I suspect its more of an explosion and not implosion based, that the containment is to make sure there is sufficient gravity and without containment the artifical gravity cannot contain the artifical mass expansion.)

There is also the question how much of the ship was floating towards the surface? What if the front end broke off and burnt completely? from the ground most of the rear end did not make it either and its very odd, because the leviathan is pointing nose up. Not nose in the dirt and with Leviathans normally being front end heavy well it would seem she probably snapped in half somewhere on the way down.

I do believe the air-pressure on caldari prime would have likely lead to much more of the titan burning up, after all in order to get more air pressure you need a FAR thicker atmosphere. Also while alloyed tritanium may not explode in atmo-sphere we don't know exactly at what heat energy is needed to break the bonds in the alloys to separate the molten hot tritanium into exploding with all the hydrogen, oxygen and nitrogen in the air.

Finally lets not forget all eve ships do have a gravity core for navigation. while the phsyics of it are a bit wonky it does allow for the submarine phsyics that both star trek and eve online seem to like to enjoy.

Anyways I suggest by figuring out the closer density/mass to the leviathan by getting all the minerals together then all capital parts. Then whatever is left fill with air. Always pick the most massive/dense state of the materials though to hopefully not get the plank bubble numbers of an uncompressed universe.

▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬ஜ۩۞۩ஜ▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬ DAMN THIS    SIGNATURE    IS FANCY ▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬ஜ۩۞۩ஜ▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬

Apocryphal Noise
The Harpooner's Rest
#4 - 2013-03-24 09:50:16 UTC
whatever dude, terraforming


checkmate
Feledain
Elmsfeuer
#5 - 2013-03-24 09:59:58 UTC
Quote:
fall down to the Earth surface at a velocity of 7130.05424943 km/h.


Quote:
Impact Velocity: 11.00 km per second


I didnt recalculate any numbers... but are 7130km/h not 1.98km/s?
Katran Luftschreck
Royal Ammatar Engineering Corps
#6 - 2013-03-24 10:04:42 UTC
And I thought that my numbers were screwy...

Where did you get 11km/sec from, anyway? Shocked

http://youtu.be/t0q2F8NsYQ0

Indahmawar Fazmarai
#7 - 2013-03-24 10:33:03 UTC
Ivy, you should check the actual data both for Caldari Prime gravity and the Titan's mass. With that and an estimate of altitude for the Titan, we could calculate its potential gravitational energy in ergs, then transform ergs to our lovely kiloton/megaton scale and check what would be the maximum damage the Titan fall could inflict on the planet.

How that energy was spent would be quite a different issue and would depend on how the Titan was over there, either in a true orbit or hovering at suborbital speed with an active pull up.

As we are told that the titan fell after destruction, then we may assume it was hovering at suborbital speed (either it would just deorbit at a pace that would depend on altitude, but likely it would take several days at least and the wreck would fragment and spread a lot of mayhem and debris along its orbital path).

Determining the actual altitude, or distance from surface, would be another question that would depend on what was the Titan doing there as a military tool.

*Indahmawar Fazmarai checks Leviathan's data from EVEmon*

Here it is, a mass of 2,430,000,000 kg... huh? Only? The Empire State Building alone weights 365,000,000 kg! That's ludicrous...

Jill Xelitras
Xeltec services
#8 - 2013-03-24 10:35:35 UTC
I do believe in some kind of emergency aerodynamical systems. Airbrakes maybe ?

Science.

Don't anger the forum gods.

ISD Buldath:

> I Saw, I came, I Frowned, I locked, I posted, and I left.

Indahmawar Fazmarai
#9 - 2013-03-24 10:36:17 UTC
Katran Luftschreck wrote:
And I thought that my numbers were screwy...

Where did you get 11km/sec from, anyway? Shocked


Forget it, the stats are bullsh*t. The Leviathan's ingame mass is just like 7x that of the Empire State building. My guess is that the "mass" tab in the data base can't handle numbers longer than 10 digits. Question
Alara IonStorm
#10 - 2013-03-24 10:37:01 UTC
Ivy Romanova wrote:

I have no idea why would the gallante attempt that battle ...
ITS MAD

You would think the ships in Orbit would have Tractor Beams or Surface Installations or something.

I am as surprised that it crashed as the lack of Dmg it did.
Whitehound
#11 - 2013-03-24 10:43:55 UTC
A theory is only good as long as it matches reality. You need to work more on your formulas.

Loss is meaningful. Therefore is the loss of meaning likewise meaningful. It is the source of all trolling.

Ivy Romanova
State Protectorate
Caldari State
#12 - 2013-03-24 10:53:46 UTC  |  Edited by: Ivy Romanova
Katran Luftschreck wrote:
And I thought that my numbers were screwy...

Where did you get 11km/sec from, anyway? Shocked


11kms-1 was the lowest number I got get off my friend's automatic calculator lol
you can reconfigure yours if you want .

I don't want him to redo his ENTIRE formula

If there is any real HARD bolts out there , please feel free to redo the numbers Smile

▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬ஜ۩۞۩ஜ▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬ DAMN THIS    SIGNATURE    IS FANCY ▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬ஜ۩۞۩ஜ▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬

Felicity Love
Doomheim
#13 - 2013-03-24 11:07:22 UTC
So what you're really saying is that that "meteor" over Russia a few weeks ago was a CCP Titan gone "rogue" ?

Kewwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwl. Blink

"EVE is dying." -- The Four Forum Trolls of the Apocalypse.   ( Pick four, any four. They all smell.  )

Uppsy Daisy
State War Academy
Caldari State
#14 - 2013-03-24 11:27:53 UTC
Projectile Density: 9000 kg/m3

A big high.

A modern metal ship floats, and therefore has an overall density less than 1050kg/m3
Winters Chill
Unitas Incorporated
#15 - 2013-03-24 11:31:02 UTC
I prefer kerbal space program to have my science muscle massaged.

I come to Eve for ultra captitalist dystopian future with lazors and clones and stuff.

Smile
HVAC Repairman
Hedion University
Amarr Empire
#16 - 2013-03-24 11:41:00 UTC
the wreckage was planted

i am eager to watch the conspiracy video "loose change: an amarrian coup"
Tiberius StarGazer
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#17 - 2013-03-24 11:44:18 UTC
Indahmawar Fazmarai wrote:
Forget it, the stats are bullsh*t. The Leviathan's ingame mass is just like 7x that of the Empire State building. My guess is that the "mass" tab in the data base can't handle numbers longer than 10 digits. Question



Nanofit Titan... clearly.... erm...
Arline Kley
PIE Inc.
Khimi Harar
#18 - 2013-03-24 11:51:43 UTC  |  Edited by: Arline Kley
And what Ivy's numbers (sorta) indicate is that the entire titan fell onto Caldari Prime in one large unbroken segment - what evidence we have seen (and heard) is that it broke up upon re-entry: some large sections survived, but the impact would be spread over a wider area rather than in a single concentrated location - after all, a few metres difference in space can mean kilometres when matched against the surface of a planet. Just look at how widespread a wrecked ship (e.g. the Titanic) can be when going though an ocean.

When I get back from shopping I'll crunch some numbers, and show the actual ecological impact damage, equating for the mass of the impact of the apparent frontal 1/3rd..


Also, the 200km assumption is far far too low for a ship of that size and mass to survive - it would have be MINIMUM 1000km's to resist getting dragged back down by the atmosphere. For reference, the ISS is around the 250-290km's height

"For it was said they had become like those peculiar demons, which dwell in matter but in whom no light may be found." - Father Grigori, Ravens 3:57

Ivy Romanova
State Protectorate
Caldari State
#19 - 2013-03-24 12:35:15 UTC
Arline Kley wrote:
And what Ivy's numbers (sorta) indicate is that the entire titan fell onto Caldari Prime in one large unbroken segment - what evidence we have seen (and heard) is that it broke up upon re-entry: some large sections survived, but the impact would be spread over a wider area rather than in a single concentrated location - after all, a few metres difference in space can mean kilometres when matched against the surface of a planet. Just look at how widespread a wrecked ship (e.g. the Titanic) can be when going though an ocean.

When I get back from shopping I'll crunch some numbers, and show the actual ecological impact damage, equating for the mass of the impact of the apparent frontal 1/3rd..


Also, the 200km assumption is far far too low for a ship of that size and mass to survive - it would have be MINIMUM 1000km's to resist getting dragged back down by the atmosphere. For reference, the ISS is around the 250-290km's height


AH!
But what you are ignoring is that the Titan is NOT orbiting Caldari Prime , instead , its just hovering above the planet powered by space magic .

But yes , I need a friendly physicists for this lol .

▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬ஜ۩۞۩ஜ▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬ DAMN THIS    SIGNATURE    IS FANCY ▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬ஜ۩۞۩ஜ▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬

Zenos Ebeth
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#20 - 2013-03-24 12:48:44 UTC
let's not forget that the damn thing is made largely of tritanium , which is said in the lore to explode when exposed to pressure.

Titan nuke anyone ? P

Bad posts are not welcome on these forums.  -CCP Falcon

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