Player Features and Ideas Discussion

Not sweet at all. My attack bc is the only thing I have left that still works as it should after the winter of nerfs. All you whiners have successfully nagged the dev into nerfing them. If you find eve too hot to handle then play something else I am sick to death of nerfs.

I don't think the battlecruisers rebalancing was all that successful apart from the changes to the prophecy and a few buffs here and there for ships like the ferox. It feels rushed and half finished to me when you consider the class as a whole. That's why I do not want to see any changes to attack bcs. They are fine as they are fozzie has even said that they were working as intended and were properly balanced. A lot of the bc changes have been driven by whiners lobbying ccp via threads like this to make the game easier for them instead of learning to counter the supposedly op ship/module/pilot.

If we carry on going down this road you may as well remove skills from the game completely and just assign everyone the same hulls with the same guns that hit for 1 dps each, because that would be fair.

I am not seeing the increased fitting diversity we were promised after the last bc pass, indeed the cyclone only really has one fit nowadays just like the drake, and as for the gallente bcs, well need I say more...

I must say, I don't see the point with ewar BS.
Why would someone fly an (expensive) (less EHP) (SP requirements) (the DPS isnt that different, only the application) (not insurable) rook over a scorpion ?

Hi CCP Rise!

It's good to see that the balance team just got bigger.

I want to post here my opinion with some suggestions about tier 3 BC and tier 1 BS.

Overall I think that attack battlecruisers are fine. They are very effective and interesing ships and I think that there should be more of such ships. Probably they are sometimes too effective but nerfs shouldn't be too severe.
I personally would be happy to see missile Naga, but it won't do any good without complete rebalance of Large Missiles. Oracle could be made sniper attack BC then.

Tier 1 BS IMHO are in a need of rework. Not just little stat adjustment, but the role change.

1. Megathron.
I think that this ship in general is fine. With a number adjustment it will be excatly in line Thorax - Brutix - Megathron. However I think it should get more midslots. Many of Gallente ships are sometimes fitted for shield tank for solo and small-scale PvP engagement. Some sqare-minded people might dislike this approach but it actully fits very well in a sandbox game.
2. Scorpion.
Scorpion is an interesting ship with well-defined role. While I like shield-tanked gallente ships armor-tanked scorpions is a different matter. Shield-tanked scorpions should be viable since there are no other Caldari ships are ever used with armor tank. Gallente ships that are often fitted for shield are viable with armor. Scorpion, however, is not.
3. Armageddon.
Amarr battleships are boring. We have 3 slow armor tanked laser DPS ships with no variety. Apocalypse has slightly more range and Abaddon is tougher but that's it. I think that this have to be changed. I see 3 approaches here:
a) Make Armageddon significaly faster but with less tank.
b) Give Armageddon a bonus for energy neutralizers.
c) Rework Armageddon to drone-ship. It will be in line with Prophecy and overall will fit new Amarr doctrine.
4. Typhoon.
It's going to be missile ship I guess.

keep your hands off armageddon,rework abaddon to ground.

Whatever you do: Do not mess with existing Amarr BS's weapon platforms. If you want to give an Amarr BS missiles, it needs a new hull!

Edit:

Scratch this. If the Minmatar get a good BS with higher Alpha than a Abbadon can achieve with 1400 Arties due to Minnies being rebalanced also, then the Abbadon might actually loose it's distiction (for me) anyway and thus is a good candidate for a Torpedo brawler with drone support. But then please make sure it can field a full flight of Sentry Drones and still has enough space for a flight of small drones.

Apocalypse should sustain it's rangebonus.

Armageddon could make good use of tracking Bonus.

I was commenting on the part that I put in bold. I couldn't care less what happens with the rest of the battlecruisers

Wow, eleven pages of bad ideas.

Why do some people, want to put neut bonuses on the Geddon? That is the stupidest idea ever. I do however, like the idea of turning it into a jumbo Arbitrator/Prophecy. The Raven just needs to have Cruise/Torps not suck, which coincidentally will make the Scorpion a little bit better too. Hyperion, armor tanking it makes it grid bound, shield tanking makes it run out of CPU, and no mater how you tank it you won't be able to put Neutrons on it. It's as slow as molasses on a glacier near Reykjavik in January.

That being said, here is my take on rebalancing the attack battlecruisers:

• They have way to much alpha. This overshadows most of the BS line, as only the top end BS's can match them. Drop 1 turret / high slot.
• They are to speedy. When most cruisers have a hard time keeping up with them, something is a little off. 10%-15% reduction in speed to keep them from overshadowing cruisers.
• Agility is fine. It actualy plays into their hit and run style quite well. If they are ever pinned down, they are dead, because they have sacrificed survivability to put the bigest guns and bigest engines into the smallest hull possible.

My two cents...

Role-specific ships are generally fine for BCs and lower, but, as the top sub-cap class, at least one of the BS in each race should emphasize flexibility over role.

Basically, I'd like to see each race get a BS like the Domi. The Domi may not put down the most DPS and may not be popular in large fleets, but it is probably the most difficult to predict the fit, when they do pop up. I've fit my Domi with blasters, rails, neuts, ACs, arties, even pulse lasers for grins, and with nothing but drones. Shield tanked, armor tanked, and even hull tanked (again, for grins). I've even used it as a logi. It is just a fun boat to fly.

And, always remember... not everyone flies in fleets.

Attack BCs leave very little room in space for Attack HACs. Part of this is because the natural speed, agility, dps, and sig of Attack BCs is about on-par or superior to Attack HACs. Part of this is because Tracking Enhancers provide such a huge boost to engagement range and tracking that the velocity&sig of cruisers relative to the tracking of Attack BCs does not provide a noticeable advantage in damage taken by the cruisers. Because the falloff of Attack BC weaponry is larger than that of HAC/cruiser weaponry, Attack BCs get much more benefit from the bonus to falloff that Tracking Enhancers give.

Battleships naturally have a longer sniper range than Attack BCs, but this is not useful with current scan mechanics.

Battleships can fit large remote repairers/boosters, but the value of these has diminished due to a swing towards triage and logistics. Part of this swing can be attributed to the fact that the UI makes it difficult to manage hostile and friendly targets simultaneously.