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Crime & Punishment

 
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Collective front launched against the New Order, James315 and miner bumping.

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Jonah Gravenstein
Machiavellian Space Bastards
#1001 - 2013-03-21 18:48:53 UTC
Minerva Arbosa wrote:

Then you have some of your guys who ignore miners actively at their keyboards and decide to gank them anyways. My other bet is that even if you do buy this indulgence pass, the New Order Logistics will gank you anyways. Who is to say this pass doesn't mark you as target?


Actively playing the game does not exempt a miner from having a permit, if they have no permit then they are fair game. New Order pilots have access to a list of people that have purchased permits, miners on the list who are actively playing rarely get ganked by the New Order pilots, those that do get ganked generally get an apology for the mistake and fully reimbursed for their loss. AFK miners who do have a permit usually have it revoked, being AFK is a breach of the terms and conditions of their permit, resulting in them becoming fair game.

In the beginning there was nothing, which exploded.

New Player FAQ

Feyd's Survival Pack
Celly Smunt
Neutin Local LLC
#1002 - 2013-03-21 18:58:29 UTC  |  Edited by: Celly S
Minerva Arbosa wrote:
Also I think it follows on with the fact that they HAVE to charge 10mill otherwise it's just harassment.



I have to call BS on that, unless you're trying to say that hulkageddon and all those who have participated it in for the previous years it's been around have in fact been in violation of the EULA for harassment and should all be banned from the game forever?

let's face it, the 10m "permit fee", the "isks", that's what it's all about and anyone who believes differently is deluding themselves and anyone who tells you differently is pulling your leg even if they happen to believe it themselves.

the stated "interaction" is just a side effect; albeit a good one of the main goal of getting isks and having a seemingly valid excuse for padding a killboard...

LOL

o/
Celly


Edit: In fairness, I should add that while I vehemently disagree with some aspects of the New Order's actions, I do also wholeheartedly support some aspects of it too.

Don't mistake fact for arrogance, supposition for fact, or disagreement for dismissal. Perception is unique in that it can be shared or singular. Run with the pack if you wish, but think for yourself. A sandwich can be a great motivator.
Wescro2
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#1003 - 2013-03-21 20:35:53 UTC  |  Edited by: Wescro2
Celly Smunt wrote:
Minerva Arbosa wrote:
Also I think it follows on with the fact that they HAVE to charge 10mill otherwise it's just harassment.



I have to call BS on that, unless you're trying to say that hulkageddon and all those who have participated it in for the previous years it's been around have in fact been in violation of the EULA for harassment and should all be banned from the game forever?


Hulkageddon was about ganking miners, not bumping them. Unlike ganking, bumping is difficult to connect to a profit motive of any sort, which is why James 315 was taking heat for his bumping of miners.

Celly Smunt wrote:

let's face it, the 10m "permit fee", the "isks", that's what it's all about and anyone who believes differently is deluding themselves and anyone who tells you differently is pulling your leg even if they happen to believe it themselves.

the stated "interaction" is just a side effect; albeit a good one of the main goal of getting isks and having a seemingly valid excuse for padding a killboard...


If you've read James' Manifesto, he's been anti high sec miner for over a year now. For more than half that period, there was little role playing or extortion. He just went around defecating (forum rules cant help it) in miners cereal and gave good, non-roleplaying, non-profit reasons for killing miners.

Then this happened . Basically, he got told that he was breaking rules by bumping, since he didn't have a valid reason for doing so other than griefing. So he more or less invented a profit motive to continue his actions.

How many people do you know in EVE that can give enough good reasons and entertainment to convince people do give tham 60b+ ISK to do something they had already been doing for months for free? James 315 did.

Ironically, the things the miners most vehemently complain about, the roleplaying and the extortion, only came into existence because they first complained there was no reason and no profit-motive for what James was doing.
Katran Luftschreck
Royal Ammatar Engineering Corps
#1004 - 2013-03-21 22:06:51 UTC
Jonah Gravenstein wrote:
New Order pilots have access to a list of people that have purchased permits.


And sooner or later someone is going to take that list of yours and go after exactly those miners. What happens then, besides the hilarity in knowing that they wasted their money, you're "protection" service offers no real protection and that there is always another ganker out there anyway?

Be even funnier if it was someone/group claiming to be the bumptards. And how do you prove they aren't? Your own lack of central organization coming back to bite you in the arse.

http://youtu.be/t0q2F8NsYQ0
Lin Suizei
#1005 - 2013-03-22 00:34:06 UTC
Katran Luftschreck wrote:
And sooner or later someone is going to take that list of yours and go after exactly those miners. What happens then, besides the hilarity in knowing that they wasted their money, you're "protection" service offers no real protection and that there is always another ganker out there anyway?

Be even funnier if it was someone/group claiming to be the bumptards. And how do you prove they aren't? Your own lack of central organization coming back to bite you in the arse.


Why don't you make that 'someone' you, and find out? :)

Lol I can't delete my forum sig.
Lady Areola Fappington
#1006 - 2013-03-22 07:34:59 UTC
Lin Suizei wrote:

Why don't you make that 'someone' you, and find out? :)


Someone Else has to do it. Otherwise, they'd have to devote an alt to ganking, get access to the NO, get access to the list, run locators on the miners, get a gank squad in position.....ohh screw it lets just go chew ice. That other stuff is too much ~work~.

7.2 CAN I AVOID PVP COMPLETELY? No; there are no systems or locations in New Eden where PvP may be completely avoided. --Eve New Player Guide
TheGunslinger42
All Web Investigations
#1007 - 2013-03-22 10:15:36 UTC
Katran Luftschreck wrote:
Jonah Gravenstein wrote:
New Order pilots have access to a list of people that have purchased permits.


And sooner or later someone is going to take that list of yours and go after exactly those miners. What happens then, besides the hilarity in knowing that they wasted their money, you're "protection" service offers no real protection and that there is always another ganker out there anyway?

Be even funnier if it was someone/group claiming to be the bumptards. And how do you prove they aren't? Your own lack of central organization coming back to bite you in the arse.



I like the part where you said "someone". Yet another bot aspirant hoping that someone ELSE will do something, because heaven forbid you do anything yourself

Is there not a bingo square for promising that someone - but not the miner themselves - will do something?
Celly Smunt
Neutin Local LLC
#1008 - 2013-03-22 17:25:23 UTC  |  Edited by: Celly S
Wescro2 wrote:
Hulkageddon was about ganking miners, not bumping them. Unlike ganking, bumping is difficult to connect to a profit motive of any sort, which is why James 315 was taking heat for his bumping of miners.




That's just semantics though, hulkageddon was about ganking miners and industrialists for no reason other than they were there, bumping a miner's vessel is completely different than ganking them, yet those who do not buy a permit (whether they are there or not) by the very words of your Knights are subject to being "ganked", do get "ganked" and will be "ganked" at some point if they don't buy a permit, there is no real difference between the two aside from the aforementioned semantics.


bumping present participle of bump (Verb)
Verb

1. Knock or run into someone or something, typically with a jolt: "I almost bumped into him"; "she bumped the girl".
2. Meet by chance.

http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=ganking

Ganking

It is a word commonly used in online video games, usualy used in an MMORPG. Ganking is the process in which a group of charecters gang up on one or more players that do not have a chance to defend themselves, Or when one high level player does the same action to a player way below his or her own level
ROFL guys I was just Ganking these level 20 Horde players

To kill,steal,beat,grab and yank.
1. The words grab and yank mushed together to make ganking.
2.To repeatedly kill a virtual game character after they get resurrected aka spawn **** in WoW.
3. Group of thugs or gangsters beat and steal your money.


ambush in online games
Oh my God, they are ganking us! It's an ambush !


so as you can see, there's no difference between the two according to any common knowledge definition and you cannot change what it is you are doing by simply changing it's name or wrapping it in the veil of some supposedly relevant code.


o/
Celly

Don't mistake fact for arrogance, supposition for fact, or disagreement for dismissal. Perception is unique in that it can be shared or singular. Run with the pack if you wish, but think for yourself. A sandwich can be a great motivator.
Mike Adoulin
Happys Happy Hamster Hunting Club
#1009 - 2013-03-23 12:21:49 UTC
Katran Luftschreck wrote:
ragerabblerabblerabble



Jesus wept, will you people quit making promises and simply hire some actual mercs?

That way you can AFK mine and AFK fight at the same time.

Everything in EVE is a trap.

And if it isn't, it's your job to make it a trap...:)

You want to know what immorality in EVE Online looks like? Look no further than Ripard "Jester" Teg.

Chribba is the Chuck Norris of EVE.
Amyclas Amatin
SUNDERING
Goonswarm Federation
#1010 - 2013-03-23 20:03:32 UTC
Mike Adoulin wrote:
Katran Luftschreck wrote:
ragerabblerabblerabble



Jesus wept, will you people quit making promises and simply hire some actual mercs?

That way you can AFK mine and AFK fight at the same time.



Maybe they're saving money to replace those mackinaws they keep losing... Hiring mercs might also be an admission that aggression takes place in high-sec, something which they are still in denial over.

For more information on the New Order of High-Sec, please visit: http://www.minerbumping.com/

Remember that whenever you have a bad day in EVE, the correct reponse is "Thank you CCP, may I please have another?"
Primary Me
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#1011 - 2013-03-23 22:32:30 UTC
Celly Smunt wrote:
...there's no difference between the two according to any common knowledge definition and you cannot change what it is you are doing by simply changing it's name or wrapping it in the veil of some supposedly relevant code.

Fortunately there is a difference according to CCP's definition, and in Eve Online that's the only definition that matters.
Fractal Muse
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#1012 - 2013-03-25 04:21:15 UTC
Celly Smunt wrote:

http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=ganking

Ganking

It is a word commonly used in online video games, usualy used in an MMORPG. Ganking is the process in which a group of charecters gang up on one or more players that do not have a chance to defend themselves, Or when one high level player does the same action to a player way below his or her own level
ROFL guys I was just Ganking these level 20 Horde players

To kill,steal,beat,grab and yank.
1. The words grab and yank mushed together to make ganking.
2.To repeatedly kill a virtual game character after they get resurrected aka spawn **** in WoW.
3. Group of thugs or gangsters beat and steal your money.


ambush in online games
Oh my God, they are ganking us! It's an ambush !


so as you can see, there's no difference between the two according to any common knowledge definition and you cannot change what it is you are doing by simply changing it's name or wrapping it in the veil of some supposedly relevant code.


o/
Celly

Happily the EVE online community has its own lexicon and definitions of these terms that don't involve orcs, WoW, or really, anything to do with the urban dictionary's definition.

Bumping is clear as to what it is within the context of EVE online. To attempt to define within a context that is not EVE online is silly.

The same goes for ganking in EVE.

So, as you can see, it doesn't matter if there is no difference between the two according to people who don't play EVE Online because how they understand the term and how the EVE community understands the term are different.
Estella Osoka
Cranky Bitches Who PMS
#1013 - 2013-03-26 00:00:33 UTC
So, why did James drop out of the CSM race?
Celly Smunt
Neutin Local LLC
#1014 - 2013-03-26 01:50:17 UTC
Primary Me wrote:
Celly Smunt wrote:
...there's no difference between the two according to any common knowledge definition and you cannot change what it is you are doing by simply changing it's name or wrapping it in the veil of some supposedly relevant code.

Fortunately there is a difference according to CCP's definition, and in Eve Online that's the only definition that matters.

Actually bumping something and shooting something are two different things, even in CCP's vision, so while I appreciate the effort you put in the response, as you stated, "CCP"'s definition is the only one that matters and if the two were the same thing as you are attempting to have us believe, then neither would bring a concord response, or both would, therefore since only one does, my statement still stands correct.

o/
Celly

Don't mistake fact for arrogance, supposition for fact, or disagreement for dismissal. Perception is unique in that it can be shared or singular. Run with the pack if you wish, but think for yourself. A sandwich can be a great motivator.
Celly Smunt
Neutin Local LLC
#1015 - 2013-03-26 02:03:50 UTC
Fractal Muse wrote:
Happily the EVE online community has its own lexicon and definitions of these terms that don't involve orcs, WoW, or really, anything to do with the urban dictionary's definition.

Bumping is clear as to what it is within the context of EVE online. To attempt to define within a context that is not EVE online is silly.

The same goes for ganking in EVE.

So, as you can see, it doesn't matter if there is no difference between the two according to people who don't play EVE Online because how they understand the term and how the EVE community understands the term are different.


Oh? not even close friend...

"In EVE" (for those of you who lack the cognitive abilities to make the connection otherwise and need to have it esplain'd to you Lucy...)

When we warp to a fleet member, or our pos, or even sometimes to 0 and/or when we approach an object, we bump into that object, we do not shoot it or blow it up by bumping into it, so if you're going to troll with irrelevancies, please don't waste the time of those trying to have an honest debate with replies that are disingenuous to the conversation or discussion at hand

Also:
Please see my response to "Primary Me".
What I said and showed in my post is correct, bottom line, end of story... now, if you wish to continue to have an honest discussion about the issue, then you must concede that fact, otherwise, you are simply trying to troll and will be viewed as such going forward in the discussion.

o/
Celly

Don't mistake fact for arrogance, supposition for fact, or disagreement for dismissal. Perception is unique in that it can be shared or singular. Run with the pack if you wish, but think for yourself. A sandwich can be a great motivator.
Primary Me
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#1016 - 2013-03-26 20:18:51 UTC
Celly Smunt wrote:
Primary Me wrote:
Celly Smunt wrote:
...there's no difference between the two according to any common knowledge definition and you cannot change what it is you are doing by simply changing it's name or wrapping it in the veil of some supposedly relevant code.

Fortunately there is a difference according to CCP's definition, and in Eve Online that's the only definition that matters.

Actually bumping something and shooting something are two different things, even in CCP's vision, so while I appreciate the effort you put in the response, as you stated, "CCP"'s definition is the only one that matters and if the two were the same thing as you are attempting to have us believe, then neither would bring a concord response, or both would, therefore since only one does, my statement still stands correct.

o/
Celly

My apologies, I've since re-read your torturous post and have realised that I didn't have my nonsense filter turned on and shouldn't have replied in the first place.

Interestingly at the beginning of your post you state:

Celly Smunt wrote:
bumping a miner's vessel is completely different than ganking them

and then at then finish up with:

Celly Smunt wrote:
so as you can see, there's no difference between the two
after some meaningless out-of-game definitions.

So, yes, you are correct, your statement stands correct. It's just difficult to work out which one.
Celly Smunt
Neutin Local LLC
#1017 - 2013-03-27 00:19:23 UTC
Primary Me wrote:
]
My apologies, I've since re-read your torturous post and have realised that I didn't have my nonsense filter turned on and shouldn't have replied in the first place.

Interestingly at the beginning of your post you state:

Celly Smunt wrote:
bumping a miner's vessel is completely different than ganking them

and then at then finish up with:

Celly Smunt wrote:
so as you can see, there's no difference between the two
after some meaningless out-of-game definitions.

So, yes, you are correct, your statement stands correct. It's just difficult to work out which one.



Funny, you seemed to have missed or purposely ignored the hulkageddon part of the discussion which was the comparison being made in that response...
and the only thing torturous in this entire issue is how wide a girth people are willing to take to link bumping with ganking in order to justify their stance. LOL


o/
Celly

Don't mistake fact for arrogance, supposition for fact, or disagreement for dismissal. Perception is unique in that it can be shared or singular. Run with the pack if you wish, but think for yourself. A sandwich can be a great motivator.
Celly Smunt
Neutin Local LLC
#1018 - 2013-03-27 00:22:25 UTC
on a different note, I see that the CSM candidate list was released today and that Jimmy isn't on it..

my condolences..

o/
Celly

Don't mistake fact for arrogance, supposition for fact, or disagreement for dismissal. Perception is unique in that it can be shared or singular. Run with the pack if you wish, but think for yourself. A sandwich can be a great motivator.
Mallak Azaria
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#1019 - 2013-03-27 00:41:01 UTC
Celly Smunt wrote:
on a different note, I see that the CSM candidate list was released today and that Jimmy isn't on it..

my condolences..

o/
Celly



Old news.

This post was lovingly crafted by a member of the Goonwaffe Posting Cabal, proud member of the popular gay hookup site somethingawful.com, Spelling Bee, Grammar Gestapo & #1 Official Gevlon Goblin Fanclub member.
Celly Smunt
Neutin Local LLC
#1020 - 2013-03-27 00:57:05 UTC
Mallak Azaria wrote:
Old news.



be that as it may, I still am not enemies with anyone here, or at least, "I" don't consider myself to be regardless of my difference of opinion with some and I also know that some of them were rooting for him to be there, so I offered my condolences...

it should be noted that common courtesy to and from folks shouldn't be so easily dismissed as to simply get a "old news" reply just because one person already knows of it when others may not.

in any case, "old news" or not, I still offer my condolences to those who were hoping to see him there...
it would have certainly kept the debates from both sides active if he were.

o/
Celly

Don't mistake fact for arrogance, supposition for fact, or disagreement for dismissal. Perception is unique in that it can be shared or singular. Run with the pack if you wish, but think for yourself. A sandwich can be a great motivator.