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margin trading when does it take isk that I owe away
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iamdata en Bauldry
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#1 - 2013-03-20 00:32:47 UTC
After I margin buy. And then sell my item that i bought off margin, how long till it collects isk from me.
Mu-Shi Ai
Hosono House
#2 - 2013-03-20 00:34:51 UTC
iamdata en Bauldry wrote:
After I margin buy. And then sell my item that i bought off margin, how long till it collects isk from me.


I believe it eats up the escrow on that particular order first, and then starts taking ISK out of your wallet to cover the rest.
iamdata en Bauldry
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#3 - 2013-03-20 00:52:14 UTC
So is there n e ways to make a profit off margin trading?
Elizabeth Norn
Nornir Research
Nornir Empire
#4 - 2013-03-20 02:52:26 UTC
It allows you to greater spread your wings and place buy orders you might not necessarily have the ISK to cover right at that instant, but expect to have once sell orders are done.

Free 3rd party services

Buddy link w/ bonus 250k SP, you keep the whole PLEX upon subscribing
Alex Grison
Grison Universal
#5 - 2013-03-20 03:06:04 UTC
The broker never lends you isk in eve

yes
Mu-Shi Ai
Hosono House
#6 - 2013-03-20 03:14:09 UTC  |  Edited by: Mu-Shi Ai
iamdata en Bauldry wrote:
So is there n e ways to make a profit off margin trading?


Yes, by extending the amount of ISK you can put out at once beyond the mere contents of your wallet. You just have to make sure that your trading system takes into account the speed at which you're able to acquire goods through buy orders. If you buy faster than you can sell, your wallet will soon be empty and/or your buy orders will auto-cancel. Margin Trading is excellent for people who know their buy orders won't fill faster than their sell orders get bought out.

If you're asking whether there's any way to use the mechanic to scam money from the broker or something like that, then no, there isn't.
iamdata en Bauldry
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#7 - 2013-03-20 07:14:43 UTC
Thanks for the replies, was just trying to find if there is a way to make good isk trading, i now understand little better on now to use margin trading.
Salpad
Carebears with Attitude
#8 - 2013-03-21 11:14:06 UTC
Mu-Shi Ai wrote:
iamdata en Bauldry wrote:
After I margin buy. And then sell my item that i bought off margin, how long till it collects isk from me.


I believe it eats up the escrow on that particular order first, and then starts taking ISK out of your wallet to cover the rest.


That is correct. Escrow is kept track of for each separate Buy Order.
Quinzel Nikulainen
Kokako Acquisitions
#9 - 2013-03-21 15:24:07 UTC
I ignored Margin Trading for a long time despite being aware of how it worked. I guess it's because I started off trading with more liquid than I had the motivation to utilize efficiently, so filling my order slots was never an issue. But recently in the midst of moving some assets I took a break and whoops; one of my accounts lapses with the majority of my trade assets. That isn't an issue for me... at first I figure I'll just pop a PLEX and continue as I was doing but instead, I decided to make a game out of it and attempt trading from the ground up from close to no ISK.

When I was in 'maximum slobbery' mode I'd set a few dozen slow-filling buy orders on items that I know I can pop sells for well within 24H.

I quickly decided to explore Margin Trading to increase the effectiveness of my paltry starting capitol for this experiment.

Using the same basic concept after training Margin Trading, I feel like I'm ******* hacking the game. My rough reaction being 'Well this is slightly preposterous' - it's a ludicrously good force-multiplier, increasing your buying power immensely provided that your Buys are ticking slower than your Sells.

It's so effective with just an anemic amount of ISK that I don't even want to think about how disgustingly gluttonous this is going to be with a respectable wallet.

I know that most people on MD are well aware of how margin trading works, but I found it a fun anecdote to write and OP asked, so.

Ex-Kaalakiota citizen. Ex-Hyasyoda citizen. CEO of KŌKAK, a Nugoeihuvi affiliate corporation.
flakeys
Doomheim
#10 - 2013-03-21 21:43:25 UTC
iamdata en Bauldry wrote:
So is there n e ways to make a profit off margin trading?



Being able to set out orders worth 50 B while you only have 30 B .... i'd say that's having enough chances to turn the skill into a highly profitable one.

We are all born ignorant, but one must work hard to remain stupid.
Marsan
#11 - 2013-03-21 21:48:43 UTC
You can still scam a player with it. With alt A put up an insane buy order for a rare but worthless item. With alt B put up a less insane sell order with worthless rare item. Now insure that A doesn't have enough isk to buy said item....

Former forum cheerleader CCP, now just a grumpy small portion of the community.
Sola Mercury
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#12 - 2013-03-22 07:02:08 UTC
Marsan wrote:
You can still scam a player with it. With alt A put up an insane buy order for a rare but worthless item. With alt B put up a less insane sell order with worthless rare item. Now insure that A doesn't have enough isk to buy said item....


I would fix the order you perform these stepsBig smile
Anva Dante
Bunch of Noobs Logistics
#13 - 2013-03-22 08:22:32 UTC
Margin trading should be removed as the current scam using it are quite malicious and difficult to spot without knowledge of it.

and no, i haven't be caught out by it :)
Candy Oshea
Techfree Investment Group
#14 - 2013-03-22 09:18:09 UTC  |  Edited by: Candy Oshea
Anva Dante wrote:
Margin trading should be removed as the current scam using it are quite malicious and difficult to spot without knowledge of it.

and no, i haven't be caught out by it :)



Why would you want to hamstring yourself by doing some silly like that? Esp since they added all the faction modules on the market O_0

A better solution, simply introduce a tutorial (Or slip a more detailed market "mission" than "buy this ore"), the same way as they teach people to scan, how to buy and sell an item, how to use a courier contract and an explanation on all market mechanics, a small "note" at the bottom *Player driven organisations use these methods to buy cheap items & sell them for large profit or the like, or something, doesn't allude to it being a scam, but makes ppl ask the question.

I dunno, i like margin trading when i'm day-trading stuff.

That feel when responding to a possible troll Big smile

iCandy  - I have accidently swallowed some Scrabble tiles, my next shit could spell disaster!
Anva Dante
Bunch of Noobs Logistics
#15 - 2013-03-22 09:45:44 UTC
Nah I am not trolling :)

The problem with it is if there is a buy order uses margin trading and you sell something to it, if it can't cover for it then CCP automatically stick it for a sell order at the buy order price and charges you rather than letting you know what it is doing.

The only indication that it is a scam is knowledge and experience, rather than being able to prove that it is.

A possible solution for this is that buy orders should be labelled if the buy order is not covered by ISK.



flakeys
Doomheim
#16 - 2013-03-22 10:20:59 UTC  |  Edited by: flakeys
Anva Dante wrote:
Margin trading should be removed as the current scam using it are quite malicious and difficult to spot without knowledge of it.

and no, i haven't be caught out by it :)



I agree , contracts also need to be removed as well as the removal of items that can not be set for sale on the market like titan/mothership/bpc/etc as they are also high scam items.

Ow and also couriers set through low or player owned stations ... yes those also need to go ASAP .

We are all born ignorant, but one must work hard to remain stupid.
Quinzel Nikulainen
Kokako Acquisitions
#17 - 2013-03-22 10:54:13 UTC
flakeys wrote:
Anva Dante wrote:
Margin trading should be removed as the current scam using it are quite malicious and difficult to spot without knowledge of it.

and no, i haven't be caught out by it :)



I agree , contracts also need to be removed as well as the removal of items that can not be set for sale on the market like titan/mothership/bpc/etc as they are also high scam items.

Ow and also couriers set through low or player owned stations ... yes those also need to go ASAP .


Not going to lie, before I noticed who was posting I read as far as italics and lost my ****.

Ex-Kaalakiota citizen. Ex-Hyasyoda citizen. CEO of KŌKAK, a Nugoeihuvi affiliate corporation.
Anva Dante
Bunch of Noobs Logistics
#18 - 2013-03-22 12:50:48 UTC
flakeys wrote:
Anva Dante wrote:
Margin trading should be removed as the current scam using it are quite malicious and difficult to spot without knowledge of it.

and no, i haven't be caught out by it :)



I agree , contracts also need to be removed as well as the removal of items that can not be set for sale on the market like titan/mothership/bpc/etc as they are also high scam items.

Ow and also couriers set through low or player owned stations ... yes those also need to go ASAP .


Funny little troll \o/

You and I both know there's a difference. You can view a contract and decide if it's profitable, the scam I'm talking about effects new players only as there is no way to confirm or deny if it is legit without using the age old trading guide of:

"If something sounds too good to be true, it definitely is".

As stated I have not be caught by this, but I'm bored of telling poeple it's a scam when i get asked :)
flakeys
Doomheim
#19 - 2013-03-22 13:50:20 UTC
Anva Dante wrote:
flakeys wrote:
Anva Dante wrote:
Margin trading should be removed as the current scam using it are quite malicious and difficult to spot without knowledge of it.

and no, i haven't be caught out by it :)



I agree , contracts also need to be removed as well as the removal of items that can not be set for sale on the market like titan/mothership/bpc/etc as they are also high scam items.

Ow and also couriers set through low or player owned stations ... yes those also need to go ASAP .


Funny little troll \o/

You and I both know there's a difference. You can view a contract and decide if it's profitable, the scam I'm talking about effects new players only as there is no way to confirm or deny if it is legit without using the age old trading guide of:

"If something sounds too good to be true, it definitely is".
As stated I have not be caught by this, but I'm bored of telling poeple it's a scam when i get asked :)


no way to confirm or deny without using the market history graph ... indeed

It affects the same people as contract scams and any other scams , the uninformed and the greedy .

We are all born ignorant, but one must work hard to remain stupid.
flakeys
Doomheim
#20 - 2013-03-22 13:53:30 UTC
And just to clarify i want this skill in effect for just those people you talk about newbies.I

don't use the skill as i have no buy orders and i have not 'needed' this skill for years but i DO remember when i started trading and only had a bag of coins to play with.At that time this skill helped me out TREMENDOUSLY and i want new traders to have the same tools i had.

We are all born ignorant, but one must work hard to remain stupid.