Player Features and Ideas Discussion

Any campaign here to remove "local" is a distraction of the thread and a pvper's whine about how pvp is not easy enough for them. Makes the pvper look like a carebear when he/she complaigns about how local makes it hard to pvp. If you are a pvper, then "man up" and get clever. If you are only interested in easy kills, then go rat a belt and stop calling yourself a "pvper." The belt rats don't care about "local" so problem solved already!

"Local" may be connected to every issue in Eve, but it is not the problem with every issue. Changes to it may provide a solution, but there are many other solutions as well, and after I have clearly stated that this thread is intended to cover increasing the risk and effort required of cloaky cyno ships and to avoid discussion of "removing local" as a possible solution, then further discussion of it is ditracting from the OP of considering the cloaky cyno camping rewards, risk and effort. The system intel network established by CCP does not decrease the effort or risk for the hunter any more than it does for the target. Removing local increases the effort and risk to the cloaky cyno hunter MUCH LESS than for the target because the hunter is cloaked and his titan-jumping friends are distant (in a far away system IN A POS) .. now if only the cyno was a longer-lasting wh which allowed people to jump both ways through it, then the friends might not be as safe/risk-free. Turning our attention to real solutions which increase the risk to the hunter and friends, we have just now shifted the discussion from local to cynos (and other stuff). The only discussion of local which increases the risk or effort for cloaky cyno ships is one where local reports that a player is cloaked, or "disconnected from local," or the amount of time the player has been cloaked; if players think that it should also report whether a player is docked, then I say fine, even though that doesn't really aim specifically at the subject of this thread "cyno cloakies."

Edit: To Nikk, below, this issue is significant to cloaky pilots who get great rewards for little risk. I am a cloaky pilot myself and recons are my favorite. I know how easy it is for a skilled pilot, I do it frequently, and I know that the risk is, for all practical purposes, zero; for all but the noobs. Some things are simple, Nikk, and then there are skilled pilots who do much more, but there is very real risk despite the simplicity. Also, thanks to datarunner for clarifying the correct use of the term "necro." And no, data, I am not wrong. Covert Cloaks are second nature to me and whs too.

Necroing is referred to a thread that has been dead for a great amount of time, like lets say for this community a month, then someone brings it back to life, clearly this thread hasn't even been dead for 12 hours before someone responds to it, so it clear that this thread isn't dead.

You are right, it not the problem with every issue, but in general it THE problem in ALMOST all issues.



And you refuse to accept that before any other solution can be put in play, there must be a balance if you want to give the ability to hunt a cloaker you must disable the ability for everyone to instantly see that cloaker is in that system, a balance must be brought to the table.




once again this is incorrect as the hunter doesn't know what the defenders bring to the table as much as the /hunted/ you so speak of doesn't know what attacker brings to the table for all the /hunter/ knows the defender could be protecting what looks like easy prey with stealth bombers, or some other attack ship that is use a free worthless high slot with a basic cloak.



and again we offer solutions on how to fix local that would balance both sides, like Nik suggestion one way to fix local, and hell I even suggested a simple fix for local that wouldn't fully effect others, and that fix was a two way disconnect, a person couldn't a cloaker in local, but in turn a cloaker can't see anyone else in local either. What happening here is that you out right refuse to accept that other people might be right and you are wrong, and that you have never played as a cloaker before.

The role of blackops is not to just get easy kills from unsuspecting pve ships. You want easy kills from ships that are not likely to be fit to fight you very well or bring in backup fast enough to pose a risk to your blops ship .. I get it. Should pvp really be without risk or effort?

Plus, if you read the proposal, the cyno is only delayed if you decloak. If you stay cloaked, the blops fleet can be brought in cloaked without affecting local. How cool (and appropriate) is that?

Lastly, what proposals do you support? Easy pvp only? Not up for fighting pvp ready ships? Lay down your ideas or support the proposals here. Your call.

Edit: to Kali below, I already said a) I have no problem with a 1 minute wait after decloak, and b) you can remain cloaked and light the covert cyno immediately .. no wait. My response is a very good answer to your comment.

[/quote] Same reason whs don't apply to this discussion: no cynos or supers/titans allowed there (in either whs or hs).[/quote]


you can have titans and supers in wh, you can build them there. probly never get them out of wh but they can exist. And you can use cynos is the same space just not to anther system.

.. building supers and titans requires sov.

Edit: and to Kali, who so desperately wants to lock a thread which threatens to reveal how much pvpers want easy pve-fitted ship kills by removing local and by protecting the afk cloaky cyno camper, answer me this: Why are you so desperate for easy pvp that it makes you look like a carebear? Answer that please. Why can you not support clooaky cyno ships having to have the same risk to themselves and friends as every other kind of pvper?

.. and my reply was already added as a "Edit" to my previous post that I already answered your question.

Ok, I'm going to go ahead and call all the afk cloak whiners out. AFK = AWAY from kb. Hence the big bad hidden man can't hurt you. If the player is not afk the tactic is working as intended.

But to the real point to the afk cloak whine that has been going on in these forum for years that no one wants to point out = BOTTERS. They refuse to admit that the main force complaining about afk cloak are people in alliances known for having botters. The afk cloak whine is about them not having isk in their wallet when they get home from work. When they complain about risk vs reward and they won't take the risk to undock with neuts in system.

And if local were removed as it should be the botters would have no way to defend the risk reward argument they hide behind.

In null you should grow a set and get out there. Afk cloak or not. If the neut is truly afk then there is no issue. The issue is their bot doesn't leave station when neuts are in local.

Check my KB..i go after PVP ships when i do black ops. So your redirct there is invalid, please try again. I do go after miners in high sec when i gank! shall we have a warning box pop up whenever i enter high sec in a destoyer? Oh **** i dont want to give you or greyscale any ideas

There are no botters in this thread, local does not need to be removed, and cloaky cyno pilots need to grow a pair instead of suggesting the former two points.

It sounds like, if you have a pair, then you may be suggesting that local needs to indicate whether or not a cloaky is afk. That would be a good step in the right direction if that were possible. While it would not make sense for local to know and thus report the last time a cloaky pilot interacted with his client, it would reveal some information about whether or not the pilot was afk. If a webcam could report in local whether the cloaky was actually looking at the screen, that would do some good toward this area. But it would make little sense in the game mechanics/theory, and it would be quite creepy. And it would do nothing for the negligible risk of the active cloaky. So I think you can agree with me that continuing to discuss whether or not the cloaky is actually afk is fairly pointless. It is fair enough to accept that afk represents zero effort for the rewards of risk elevation to neuts in a system and leave the discussion of "afk" at that.

Edit: and to Kali's absurd point above, if you can light cyno's in high sec, then let me know. otherwise stop talking about hs. This discussion holds the cyno as a central point, which naturally excludes hs.

He dances around the point an comments cause he has no true come back to any remark someone else makes, he actually can't defend his thread so he points out different issues in hopes that if he does it enough times, someone actually say. "You know what his idea is actually good." When it truth, that will never happen. Kinda like how he ignores all my retorts and responses.

Do i light cyno's in high sec? What in the world are you going on about? I said i "gank" with "destroyer" in high sec and that i go after PVP ships when i black ops. You really must be the most ignorant person I’ve never met