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Occupation(al) Hazards

Author
Silas Vitalia
Doomheim
#1 - 2013-03-20 15:34:23 UTC
Salutations my dear Caldari State capsuleers, and the rest of you unfortunate baseliners tuning-in.

So!

Much ado lately over your occupation. Rumors are flying, ordinance is changing hands, chaos is the order of the day. The men at the club have been talking you see, and it seems a lack of control is quickly developing.

The thing with deterrents... is that you actually have to be willing to use them. You people need to stop with the hands-off approach and begin acting like the real occupying force you should be. If you want to maintain control that is.

The millions of Gallente you will displace aren't going to just give things up, stubborn little things; they need be relocated, intimidated into submission, or you know. *draws finger across neck slowly*

So how about this. They knock down one of you shiny towers, you level a city.

They kill one Caldari, you kill one thousand Gallente.

You people really need to go old-school reclaiming to produce the desired results here. You know I'm right.

Anyway, just some friendly advice. They already think you heartless monsters, why bother trying to win a PR war? Better to have you victory en total using tried-and-true methods and then write whatever you like for the history books. Your progeny will thank you for making the hard choices.






Sabik now, Sabik forever

Lialus Raithe
Doomheim
#2 - 2013-03-20 15:51:26 UTC
Well, aren't we the sadistic one?

What makes you think the Caldari are interested in winning a PR war and not simply maintaining some measure of dignity and discipline in their dealings? A retaliation of the sort you're propagating is rarely ever painted in a positive light through history and even more seldom does it bring about the results you desire it to.

If the Caldari responded as you've suggested they should, it would only serve to rally the cry against them from within the Federation and increase the chance of all-out hostility against their home world and its fleet. It would not only be utterly monstrous, it would be a tactical fallacy.

The unrest on the planet is unfortunate but the Caldari are demonstrating wisdom in not escalating things even further by exacerbating an already tenuous situation.
Silas Vitalia
Doomheim
#3 - 2013-03-20 15:55:43 UTC
Lialus Raithe wrote:
Well, aren't we the sadistic one?

What makes you think the Caldari are interested in winning a PR war and not simply maintaining some measure of dignity and discipline in their dealings? A retaliation of the sort you're propagating is rarely ever painted in a positive light through history and even more seldom does it bring about the results you desire it to.

If the Caldari responded as you've suggested they should, it would only serve to rally the cry against them from within the Federation and increase the chance of all-out hostility against their home world and its fleet. It would not only be utterly monstrous, it would be a tactical fallacy.

The unrest on the planet is unfortunate but the Caldari are demonstrating wisdom in not escalating things even further by exacerbating an already tenuous situation.


I think perhaps landing an invasion force and taking the planet by force might have already served your 'rallying cry' That die was cast long ago. The question is weather to follow-through or continue with half-measures and reap the results.

There's nothing sadistic about it. You'd actually save quite a few more lives creating an environment so inhospitable that most of the ethnic Gallente self-deport.

Ooh I like that. Self Deport.


Sabik now, Sabik forever

Lialus Raithe
Doomheim
#4 - 2013-03-20 16:01:40 UTC
Lady, they can't self-deport. Attempts to leave the planet result in them being fired upon and cities blasted from orbit, at least if their Executor Heth sticks to his word.

Furthermore, taking the planet is one thing. Mass murdering civilians is another. Right now, the "hostage" situation on the planet is one of their greatest tactical advantages and you're suggesting they throw it away.

I'd much prefer the situation reach stability, with the attacks on Caldari Military assets ceasing and civilians no longer being under threat.
Anslo
Scope Works
#5 - 2013-03-20 16:05:23 UTC
And the CONCORD comes in and stops Caldari forces due to violation of human rights and crimes against humanity in general.

This isn't nul. Go bleed a cow or something.

[center]-_For the Proveldtariat_/-[/center]

Silas Vitalia
Doomheim
#6 - 2013-03-20 16:10:01 UTC
Anslo wrote:
And the CONCORD comes in and stops Caldari forces due to violation of human rights and crimes against humanity in general.

This isn't nul. Go bleed a cow or something.



CONCORD doesn't seem particularly interested or capable of stopping those sorts of things these days. I'm sure the millions of dead, dying, and miserable baseliners on the frontlines of the Empyrean war will be seeing those CONCORD rescue ships any. day. now.

Oh wait, they aren't coming.

Sabik now, Sabik forever

Gosakumori Noh
Coven of One
#7 - 2013-03-20 16:10:59 UTC
Tangentially: love the new look, darling. Love it!
Anslo
Scope Works
#8 - 2013-03-20 16:11:28 UTC
Silas Vitalia wrote:
Anslo wrote:
And the CONCORD comes in and stops Caldari forces due to violation of human rights and crimes against humanity in general.

This isn't nul. Go bleed a cow or something.



CONCORD doesn't seem particularly interested or capable of stopping those sorts of things these days. I'm sure the millions of dead, dying, and miserable baseliners on the frontlines of the Empyrean war will be seeing those CONCORD rescue ships any. day. now.

Oh wait, they aren't coming.



You're lecturing others on killing people?

Heh™

[center]-_For the Proveldtariat_/-[/center]

Silas Vitalia
Doomheim
#9 - 2013-03-20 16:14:25 UTC  |  Edited by: Silas Vitalia
Anslo wrote:
Silas Vitalia wrote:
Anslo wrote:
And the CONCORD comes in and stops Caldari forces due to violation of human rights and crimes against humanity in general.

This isn't nul. Go bleed a cow or something.



CONCORD doesn't seem particularly interested or capable of stopping those sorts of things these days. I'm sure the millions of dead, dying, and miserable baseliners on the frontlines of the Empyrean war will be seeing those CONCORD rescue ships any. day. now.

Oh wait, they aren't coming.



You're lecturing others on killing people?

Heh™


I'm pointing out that CONCORD will huff and puff, and then show up after the fact with a stern finger-wagging and perhaps a bit of scolding.

You'll recall that the Minmatar Republic seem to still be members of the club after killing thousands of CONCORD employees and blasting one of their main stations.

They are a farce, and we all know it.

Sabik now, Sabik forever

Anslo
Scope Works
#10 - 2013-03-20 16:16:54 UTC
Silas Vitalia wrote:
They are a farce, and we all know it.


Says the Revan wanna-be Bleeder.

[center]-_For the Proveldtariat_/-[/center]

Silas Vitalia
Doomheim
#11 - 2013-03-20 16:17:26 UTC
Lialus Raithe wrote:
Lady, they can't self-deport. Attempts to leave the planet result in them being fired upon and cities blasted from orbit, at least if their Executor Heth sticks to his word.

Furthermore, taking the planet is one thing. Mass murdering civilians is another. Right now, the "hostage" situation on the planet is one of their greatest tactical advantages and you're suggesting they throw it away.

I'd much prefer the situation reach stability, with the attacks on Caldari Military assets ceasing and civilians no longer being under threat.


I'm suggesting a change in Heth's policy, yes.

The permanent hostage situation is... untenable. And besides I don't believe Heth has the stones to obliterate half of his home planet.

Relocate / Eliminate the dissenting foreign population. Fortify. If they want it back make them pay dearly for every inch.

Sabik now, Sabik forever

Silas Vitalia
Doomheim
#12 - 2013-03-20 16:18:46 UTC
Anslo wrote:
Silas Vitalia wrote:
They are a farce, and we all know it.


Says the Revan wanna-be Bleeder.



You aren't even trying anymore, kiddo. Dear Neferis and I always found that comparison quite laughable.

Sabik now, Sabik forever

Anslo
Scope Works
#13 - 2013-03-20 16:21:35 UTC
Silas Vitalia wrote:
Anslo wrote:
Silas Vitalia wrote:
They are a farce, and we all know it.


Says the Revan wanna-be Bleeder.



You aren't even trying anymore, kiddo. Dear Neferis and I always found that comparison quite laughable.


Well I was gonna say something about the money shot tattoo on your forehead, but I figured you'd sod off after you stirred the pot a bit.

Seriously, go bleed a cow or rat or something. Mass murder isn't an option for anyone. Doesn't matter about the war's premise. Might work for you out in nul when you cull people for your rituals, but that's there. This is here.

Off you go now.

[center]-_For the Proveldtariat_/-[/center]

Kallo Unarmored
Doomheim
#14 - 2013-03-20 16:24:38 UTC
For the sake of argument if the entire Gallente population living on Caldari prime was gone; there would be no more reason for the Navy not to pound the planet again. Caldari evac round two.
Silas Vitalia
Doomheim
#15 - 2013-03-20 16:26:51 UTC
Anslo wrote:
Silas Vitalia wrote:
Anslo wrote:
Silas Vitalia wrote:
They are a farce, and we all know it.


Says the Revan wanna-be Bleeder.



You aren't even trying anymore, kiddo. Dear Neferis and I always found that comparison quite laughable.


Well I was gonna say something about the money shot tattoo on your forehead, but I figured you'd sod off after you stirred the pot a bit.

Seriously, go bleed a cow or rat or something. Mass murder isn't an option for anyone. Doesn't matter about the war's premise. Might work for you out in nul when you cull people for your rituals, but that's there. This is here.

Off you go now.


You need to get out more, and awaken your senses to just how much bloodshed happens in our names and on our behalf.

When we talk of 'mass murder' we are talking slight differences in degree, not of kind.

But I digress.

The point, for -all of you- is that it's NOT about the numbers. It's about sending a message.

Sabik now, Sabik forever

Kallo Unarmored
Doomheim
#16 - 2013-03-20 16:30:23 UTC
Silas Vitalia wrote:
Anslo wrote:
Silas Vitalia wrote:
Anslo wrote:
Silas Vitalia wrote:
They are a farce, and we all know it.


Says the Revan wanna-be Bleeder.



You aren't even trying anymore, kiddo. Dear Neferis and I always found that comparison quite laughable.


Well I was gonna say something about the money shot tattoo on your forehead, but I figured you'd sod off after you stirred the pot a bit.

Seriously, go bleed a cow or rat or something. Mass murder isn't an option for anyone. Doesn't matter about the war's premise. Might work for you out in nul when you cull people for your rituals, but that's there. This is here.

Off you go now.


You need to get out more, and awaken your senses to just how much bloodshed happens in our names and on our behalf.

When we talk of 'mass murder' we are talking slight differences in degree, not of kind.

But I digress.

The point, for -all of you- is that it's NOT about the numbers. It's about sending a message.




And that message is "We will kill the Gallente if you don't stop" to which the rebels and then the navy will just have more resolve to fight back.
Anslo
Scope Works
#17 - 2013-03-20 16:31:08 UTC
Silas Vitalia wrote:
You need to get out more, and awaken your senses to just how much bloodshed happens in our names and on our behalf.

Again, says the Bleeder. Hypocrite. Don't like people dyin'? Stop tryin'. Til then, don't talk about it.


Quote:
When we talk of 'mass murder' we are talking slight differences in degree, not of kind.

Because talking about leveling cities and 1:1000 death ratios is made better cause we shoot **** in space. No.

Quote:
The point, for -all of you- is that it's NOT about the numbers. It's about sending a message.

Cool story. Now get back to the badlands while we try to solve this without cracking a planet.

[center]-_For the Proveldtariat_/-[/center]

Silas Vitalia
Doomheim
#18 - 2013-03-20 16:32:17 UTC
Kallo Unarmored wrote:
For the sake of argument if the entire Gallente population living on Caldari prime was gone; there would be no more reason for the Navy not to pound the planet again. Caldari evac round two.


Knowing precisely where you enemy will be ahead of time has an advantage all its own, my dear.

I'm confident in the State's ability to use that information to tactical advantage and a Glorious Victory.

The Caldari Navy excels at one thing above all, and that is directed projection of power, precisely concentrated to a single spear tip. In this case a single system.

That my dear is precisely the sort of combat scenario they shine at.





Sabik now, Sabik forever

Silas Vitalia
Doomheim
#19 - 2013-03-20 16:36:50 UTC
Kallo Unarmored wrote:

to which the rebels and then the navy will just have more resolve to fight back.


The Federation and Democracies in general don't have the stomach to wallow in the mud like us for extended periods of time. Public sentiment will eventually crack and the whole thing will not be politically worth it. The Federation is already losing face and turning on their own ideals after just a few short years of a Proxy War.

Once their public sees images of their brave 'rebels' committing retaliatory terrorist actions and more and more dead Caldari children blown apart they'll lose public support.


Sabik now, Sabik forever

Kallo Unarmored
Doomheim
#20 - 2013-03-20 16:42:49 UTC
Silas Vitalia wrote:


Knowing precisely where you enemy will be ahead of time has an advantage all its own, my dear.

I'm confident in the State's ability to use that information to tactical advantage and a Glorious Victory.

The Caldari Navy excels at one thing above all, and that is directed projection of power, precisely concentrated to a single spear tip. In this case a single system.

That my dear is precisely the sort of combat scenario they shine at.


The thing the Caldari navy is good at is how to stage a planetary evac and hide colonies; not so much the spear tip.

Silas Vitalia wrote:


The Federation and Democracies in general don't have the stomach to wallow in the mud like us for extended periods of time. Public sentiment will eventually crack and the whole thing will not be politically worth it. The Federation is already losing face and turning on their own ideals after just a few short years of a Proxy War.

Once their public sees images of their brave 'rebels' committing retaliatory terrorist actions and more and more dead Caldari children blown apart they'll lose public support.



Says the bleeder? You would be amazed at how the Gallente can get riled up after a few years of a titan aimed at them. Not all of us vote Dove and terrorism is usually only defined by the one being attacked. Then when you come on here talking about killing 1000 people for the actions of one, and imploring the Caldari to do the same; your words make the terrorism seems more and more like saving themselves. Something Gallente and even some Caldari respect, not rolling over and dying.
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