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Player Features and Ideas Discussion

 
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Remove High-Sec Belts and replace with Roaming Grav Sites

Author
Shahai Shintaro
State War Academy
Caldari State
#21 - 2013-03-19 16:06:17 UTC
New players may be given the books and what not, but I personally hate the scanning system. Maybe I just don't get it, but I even had issues with the scanning tutorial. I am against anything that makes me use probes. If I can find them the same way I can find an FW plex then I'm ok with it
Angelic Resolution
The Arcanum
#22 - 2013-03-20 03:45:19 UTC  |  Edited by: Angelic Resolution
Shahai Shintaro wrote:
New players may be given the books and what not, but I personally hate the scanning system. Maybe I just don't get it, but I even had issues with the scanning tutorial. I am against anything that makes me use probes. If I can find them the same way I can find an FW plex then I'm ok with it


Agreed however the difficulty of finding 1 site could increase depending on the minerals available within the site, thus effort = reward. Up the level of rats that are in there, based on difficulty to scan down and risk = reward.

Both covered. What's more is because the sites aren't easily find-able by people, I'd also put forward that Concord couldn't show up as easily. A multiplier of 10% for response times as an example per security level would probably do it.
Tarn Kugisa
Kugisa Dynamics
#23 - 2013-03-20 05:05:18 UTC
Velicitia wrote:
Angelic Resolution wrote:
Remove High-Sec Belts


Stopped reading there. I support this product and/or service.

Be polite. Be efficient. Have a plan to troll everyone you meet - KuroVolt

tankus2
HeartVenom Inc.
#24 - 2013-03-20 05:24:04 UTC
I'll support this regardless of requiring a probing ship or not, since its easy enough to move the probing ship about (typically being frigates and all)

Of course, requiring that they need a probing ship to find makes them some-what safer to mine in while at war, though this is still a foolhardy task unless you are in a 100+ AU system, which even then its risky.

I'd actually do this in two parts:
first is to have belts scannable via ship scanner, though these belts will only yield veld/scord in empire, veld/scord/faction 0.8/ faction0.6 (so a combination of pyroxeres/kernite/omber/plagioclas) in low sec, then all of that plus the (current) low sec ores for nul.
second is to have belts that require probing, and these would be more like the ones we currently have and are self-explanatory, though the ores missing from their more-easily located cousins are in considerably greater abundance.

but why would we go through all of that? Simply put; if you work harder, you should get better stuff. If you don't want to work harder, then sorry you've got veld and scord to munch on have fun. Or go into more dangerous space to get better ores. Or get probes and stop being lazy.

Where the science gets done

Azrael Dinn
Imperial Mechanics
#25 - 2013-03-20 06:59:22 UTC
mynnna wrote:
Grav sites should be something you can find with the system scanner anyway, and that requires no skills to use whatsoever. Newbie problem solved.


Well this could be a nice idea. Still keep the bigger grav sites, remove normal belts and add sites that can be scanned down by normal onboard scanner.

After centuries of debating and justifying... Break Cloaks tm

Angelic Resolution
The Arcanum
#26 - 2013-03-20 07:40:35 UTC
Would be pretty sweet, 3 levels of sites. Ones to get to using a ship scanner, another that it 50% easier to get using probes and another that's 100% harder than scanner to get to also using probes.

It'd also stand to reason that each different level gets different yields, ship scanner gets normal, 50% easier gets 10% and the 100%'s get the 20% good stuff.
Little Dragon Khamez
Guardians of the Underworld
#27 - 2013-03-20 09:22:32 UTC
I think this is a great idea. Make it like a complex, mine enough ordinary ore then get an escalation that takes you to the really good stuff several jumps away in a random location.

I don't know anything about botting, but I imagine it would be hard to program a bot to do all of that, especially as you are then into the logistics of storing all of that valuable ore somewhere, this might be a challenge if the target system doesn't have a station or a decent market to sell the stuff through. It's even more problematic if the escalation is in low or null. It would make miners work for their money and no one could ever say that mining is dull again. It might even force some cooperative gameplay if they've got the guts to get the goodstuff.

Dumbing down of Eve Online will result in it's destruction...

Tonto Auri
Vhero' Multipurpose Corp
#28 - 2013-03-20 09:29:22 UTC
Angelic Resolution wrote:
2 Fold reason for this:
1) It does away with botters pretty well as they'd need to scan down a site prior to actually using it.
2) As an aussie logging in after roid respawn DT, there's nothing left. I've gone 5 systems over scouting for a belt and it's all gone.

Make the Grav sites more challenging if needed but by mining out a Grav Site have another one spawn 4-8 hours later so it can be regulated - and won't drive mineral prices down.

And for those wondering, no it won't affect noobies, they're taught to use scanner probes from the get-go now.

1. Won't affect them even slightly.
2. Leave highsec?

Two most common elements in the universe are hydrogen and stupidity. -- Harlan Ellison

Angelic Resolution
The Arcanum
#29 - 2013-03-20 10:01:46 UTC
Tonto Auri wrote:
Angelic Resolution wrote:
2 Fold reason for this:
1) It does away with botters pretty well as they'd need to scan down a site prior to actually using it.
2) As an aussie logging in after roid respawn DT, there's nothing left. I've gone 5 systems over scouting for a belt and it's all gone.

Make the Grav sites more challenging if needed but by mining out a Grav Site have another one spawn 4-8 hours later so it can be regulated - and won't drive mineral prices down.

And for those wondering, no it won't affect noobies, they're taught to use scanner probes from the get-go now.

1. Won't affect them even slightly.
2. Leave highsec?



1. Yes it will, any program that's able to faciliate the scanning of a probe would have to have a hook into the EVE Client in order to tell where the location of the site is. If you read the thread, I believe I stated it as 3d mapping within a 2d environment.

2. So you're saying because I'm in a location where by I can't get on after down time due to commitment the next day, others should have it better by default?

Sorry dude, I don't think you're adding anything to the topic at all. Post something with a bit more relevance otherwise thanks for the bump =)
Mike Whiite
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#30 - 2013-03-20 11:05:30 UTC
This sounds abit like DRM.

We have a problem with people doing something that isn't allowed, so lets come with a solution that makes it harder for every one??


Result, those that do things that aren't allowed come with a solution and those that where doing it acordingly still have a harder time doing it.

attack botters not the path they use, that was made for everyone.

Onomerous
Caldari Black Hand
Caldari Tactical Operations Command
#31 - 2013-03-20 12:11:19 UTC
Mike Whiite wrote:
This sounds abit like DRM.

We have a problem with people doing something that isn't allowed, so lets come with a solution that makes it harder for every one??


Result, those that do things that aren't allowed come with a solution and those that where doing it acordingly still have a harder time doing it.

attack botters not the path they use, that was made for everyone.



Bold for emphasis
DataRunner Attor
Doomheim
#32 - 2013-03-20 13:22:53 UTC
Angelic Resolution wrote:
Effort? it takes 2-5 minutes to scan a site down. Hell you could even have it so the easy to find Grav sites are more accessible where as the harder to find Grav Sites take longer.



Easier it is to scan the more likeliness of it already been mined out for all the minerals people want and leave behind the junk stuff they don't need or want. Which in turn won't solve your problem with the current sites anyways, and it will still cause minerals to skyrocket because it will take more effort then just right clicking on the screen and saying warp to belt. Then those belts that are harder to fine will be locked down by the bigger corps, AKA declaring war on anyone that is taking their minerals. So I guess on the silver lining it will encourage PVP.

“Point out to me a person who has been harmed by an AFK cloaker and I will point out a person who has no business playing this game.”

Angelic Resolution
The Arcanum
#33 - 2013-03-20 14:25:02 UTC
DataRunner Attor wrote:
Angelic Resolution wrote:
Effort? it takes 2-5 minutes to scan a site down. Hell you could even have it so the easy to find Grav sites are more accessible where as the harder to find Grav Sites take longer.



Easier it is to scan the more likeliness of it already been mined out for all the minerals people want and leave behind the junk stuff they don't need or want. Which in turn won't solve your problem with the current sites anyways, and it will still cause minerals to skyrocket because it will take more effort then just right clicking on the screen and saying warp to belt. Then those belts that are harder to fine will be locked down by the bigger corps, AKA declaring war on anyone that is taking their minerals. So I guess on the silver lining it will encourage PVP.


It's true that if all the good ore - I'm thinking you mean scord - is gone, there's only veld etc left. I use 10mil trit on a rokh. I'd more than happily mine it. Not to consider a cool-down timer could be applied - much to the same as a WH - that despawns the belt if it's not used for an hour or two.

War Declare over belts?! Wouldn't that be awesome? XD
Velicitia
XS Tech
#34 - 2013-03-20 15:06:49 UTC
Angelic Resolution wrote:
War Declare over belts?! Wouldn't that be awesome? XD



yes, but it'll never happen.

One of the bitter points of a good bittervet is the realisation that all those SP don't really do much, and that the newbie is having much more fun with what little he has. - Tippia

Tonto Auri
Vhero' Multipurpose Corp
#35 - 2013-03-20 15:25:21 UTC
Angelic Resolution wrote:
1. Yes it will, any program that's able to faciliate the scanning of a probe would have to have a hook into the EVE Client in order to tell where the location of the site is. If you read the thread, I believe I stated it as 3d mapping within a 2d environment.

Are we playing the same EVE online? Have you not seen all these scanning bots running around in magnates?

Quote:
2. So you're saying because I'm in a location where by I can't get on after down time due to commitment the next day, others should have it better by default?

I'm logging into game at random times, sometimes I only have time to play right before downtime, and I don't see any issues with mining. Probably, you should look further, than your nose, if you want to find some ore?

Two most common elements in the universe are hydrogen and stupidity. -- Harlan Ellison

Angelic Resolution
The Arcanum
#36 - 2013-03-20 15:49:36 UTC
Tonto Auri wrote:
Angelic Resolution wrote:
1. Yes it will, any program that's able to faciliate the scanning of a probe would have to have a hook into the EVE Client in order to tell where the location of the site is. If you read the thread, I believe I stated it as 3d mapping within a 2d environment.

Are we playing the same EVE online? Have you not seen all these scanning bots running around in magnates?

Quote:
2. So you're saying because I'm in a location where by I can't get on after down time due to commitment the next day, others should have it better by default?

I'm logging into game at random times, sometimes I only have time to play right before downtime, and I don't see any issues with mining. Probably, you should look further, than your nose, if you want to find some ore?


1. I think you're missing the human interaction part on doing the scanning. Have you tried convo'ing them? Did you report them as a bot?

2. Going 5 systems in each directional, I'll admit isn't a good sample however today I logged on - after roid spawn day - and found nothing after going 10 systems.

Tell me again how you're going to solve the problem of different time zones being given the advantage of a DT respawn on roids?

Again; thanks for the bump.
Commander Ted
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#37 - 2013-03-20 19:07:07 UTC
DataRunner Attor wrote:
At the moment I can't support this idea as the amount of effort to scan down certain grav sites can cause mineral prices to sky rocket even further. "It strange really, you high secers think that every extra second you spend mining something you can increase prices, even though you have a much smaller change of dieing and losing all said minerals."

considering how easy it is to find grav sites, and CCP would increase the spawn rate of them your argument holds absolutely no water at all.

https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=174097 Separate all 4 empires in eve with lowsec.

Commander Ted
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#38 - 2013-03-20 19:08:26 UTC
Mike Whiite wrote:
This sounds abit like DRM.

We have a problem with people doing something that isn't allowed, so lets come with a solution that makes it harder for every one??


Result, those that do things that aren't allowed come with a solution and those that where doing it acordingly still have a harder time doing it.

attack botters not the path they use, that was made for everyone.


Harder than just warp. target, fire laser, wait?

https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=174097 Separate all 4 empires in eve with lowsec.

Commander Ted
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#39 - 2013-03-20 19:10:41 UTC
DataRunner Attor wrote:



Easier it is to scan the more likeliness of it already been mined out for all the minerals people want and leave behind the junk stuff they don't need or want. Which in turn won't solve your problem with the current sites anyways, and it will still cause minerals to skyrocket because it will take more effort then just right clicking on the screen and saying warp to belt. Then those belts that are harder to fine will be locked down by the bigger corps, AKA declaring war on anyone that is taking their minerals. So I guess on the silver lining it will encourage PVP.

No, just find another site. If their are enough sites this wont be a problem. Think about things before you say them

https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=174097 Separate all 4 empires in eve with lowsec.

Commander Ted
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#40 - 2013-03-20 19:12:43 UTC
I also must say the current asteroid belt system makes no sense at all from a science perspective. By what means would a 100km long half cirlce of asteroids appear over the surface of a planet in arbitrary positions?

https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=174097 Separate all 4 empires in eve with lowsec.