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[AISA] Time for Action: Gen. Kartaka's Comments, CONCORD action needed.

First post
Author
Lialus Raithe
Doomheim
#41 - 2013-03-19 11:46:27 UTC  |  Edited by: Lialus Raithe
Mekhana wrote:
The poor general is dead I'm afraid. So much for being in control, so much for making threats. We Gallente when pushed are people of action, a lesson many have learned the hard way. The war won't be lasting much longer now that the fascists have lost their headquarters and their forces are in disarray crumbling before the unified might of Federal Marines, the Resistance, Mercenaries and Federation Loyalists.

The best is yet to come however.



Andreus Ixiris wrote:
There'll be nothing left to gloat over when this is done.

I'll make sure of it.


This is what has become of us? Pithy comebacks and petty quips?

I must disagree with your notion that the war will be over shortly. The last time we went to war with the Caldari in full force, both sides became so exasperated that we simply agreed to stop shooting at one another. Not before massive amounts of destruction and death had occurred, mind you.

The fact that this conflict will drone on and be costly is why we've avoided all out war for so long, surely you can understand this? Do not make the mistake of underestimating your enemy or overestimating yourself. The Caldari have demonstrated great resolve in this conflict and I suspect they have much more still to demonstrate.

There is nothing glorious about this war, nothing worth gloating about. Wanton and absolute destruction of the Caldari should not be the desire or will of any of us.
Tiberious Thessalonia
True Slave Foundations
#42 - 2013-03-19 12:42:26 UTC
Lialus Raithe wrote:
Mekhana wrote:
The poor general is dead I'm afraid. So much for being in control, so much for making threats. We Gallente when pushed are people of action, a lesson many have learned the hard way. The war won't be lasting much longer now that the fascists have lost their headquarters and their forces are in disarray crumbling before the unified might of Federal Marines, the Resistance, Mercenaries and Federation Loyalists.

The best is yet to come however.



Andreus Ixiris wrote:
There'll be nothing left to gloat over when this is done.

I'll make sure of it.


This is what has become of us? Pithy comebacks and petty quips?

I must disagree with your notion that the war will be over shortly. The last time we went to war with the Caldari in full force, both sides became so exasperated that we simply agreed to stop shooting at one another. Not before massive amounts of destruction and death had occurred, mind you.

The fact that this conflict will drone on and be costly is why we've avoided all out war for so long, surely you can understand this? Do not make the mistake of underestimating your enemy or overestimating yourself. The Caldari have demonstrated great resolve in this conflict and I suspect they have much more still to demonstrate.

There is nothing glorious about this war, nothing worth gloating about. Wanton and absolute destruction of the Caldari should not be the desire or will of any of us.


Andreus Ixiris is claiming, here, that he will "Make sure of it" by exterminating every Caldari in the cluster, a sentiment he shared yesterday, brought on by imagined threats of the same via the Caldari, which do not actually exist.
Lialus Raithe
Doomheim
#43 - 2013-03-19 12:44:41 UTC
Tiberious Thessalonia wrote:

Andreus Ixiris is claiming, here, that he will "Make sure of it" by exterminating every Caldari in the cluster, a sentiment he shared yesterday, brought on by imagined threats of the same via the Caldari, which do not actually exist.


Then I repeat:

Lialus Raithe wrote:
Wanton and absolute destruction of the Caldari should not be the desire or will of any of us.


It is nothing short of psychosis.
Solarienne
Hrimdraugar
#44 - 2013-03-19 12:45:32 UTC
Tiberious Thessalonia wrote:

Andreus Ixiris is claiming, here, that he will "Make sure of it" by exterminating every Caldari in the cluster, a sentiment he shared yesterday, brought on by imagined threats of the same via the Caldari, which do not actually exist.


I've never seen 'preen and yell that he totally called it/pulled strings to make it happen without evidence or proof of capacity' spelled like that before.

PY-RE Combat Pilot

Quinzel Nikulainen
Kokako Acquisitions
#45 - 2013-03-19 12:46:34 UTC
Lialus Raithe wrote:

It is nothing short of psychosis.


Thank-you, sir.

Maybe he will see reason when it's spoken by a comrade.

Ex-Kaalakiota citizen. Ex-Hyasyoda citizen. CEO of KŌKAK, a Nugoeihuvi affiliate corporation.

ISD Suvetar
ISD Community Communications Liaisons
ISD Alliance
#46 - 2013-03-19 14:06:12 UTC
Fluid routers in the sector appear to have been glitching again; bit of spit an polish and all's well again.

I hope.

[b]ISD Suvetar Captain/Commando Community Communication Liaisons (CCLs) Interstellar Services Department[/b]

Tiberious Thessalonia
True Slave Foundations
#47 - 2013-03-19 14:11:31 UTC
Vlad Cetes wrote:
Ethnic cleansing is an effective security solution. For some reason humans seem to be offended about effective security measures. This is illogical.


I just want to bring this post up from the dredges. I know it belongs there.

No, it isn't. Vlad, as someone who claims to support Nation (though I find that suspect) you should understand that we are the perfect example of why it isn't. We were ethnically cleansed. We have come back stronger than before, only now we are angry, and armed.

"Cleansing" a population only works if you get everyone. This is damned near impossible, nowadays, with how utterly vast space is. Space was our home when our planets were being glassed.

Now, go crawl back under your rock.
Che Biko
Alexylva Paradox
#48 - 2013-03-19 15:26:32 UTC  |  Edited by: Che Biko
If you want a thing done well, do it yourself:

Che Biko wrote:
It looks like CONCORD will not step in until after the Shiigeru/Kimotoro fleet is attacked, if even then. Therefor I would suggest the creation of a multi-ethnic capsuleer peacekeeping fleet, designed to pacify combatants, without lethal weapons, but I don't have high hopes this could be realized, considering the current climate and sentiments on the IGS.
Anslo
Scope Works
#49 - 2013-03-19 16:06:03 UTC
Che Biko wrote:
If you want a thing done well, do it yourself:

Che Biko wrote:
It looks like CONCORD will not step in until after the Shiigeru/Kimotoro fleet is attacked, if even then. Therefor I would suggest the creation of a multi-ethnic capsuleer peacekeeping fleet, designed to pacify combatants, without lethal weapons, but I don't have high hopes this could be realized, considering the current climate and sentiments on the IGS.


You can't do peacekeeping without weapons. What do you want? A missile that flips the enemy ship's off switch??

[center]-_For the Proveldtariat_/-[/center]

Lialus Raithe
Doomheim
#50 - 2013-03-19 16:18:13 UTC
Anslo wrote:
You can't do peacekeeping without weapons. What do you want? A missile that flips the enemy ship's off switch??


Technically you could rely on various forms of electronic warfare to nullify and suppress target fire. Sensor dampeners and Electronic Counter Measures being primary among them. However, as appears to be the nature of the situation, it will likely only serve to escalate with more and more pilots until there's not enough suppression to keep the situation pacified.

At which point the outcome becomes even more dead.
Erik Kaassan
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#51 - 2013-03-19 17:36:31 UTC
Che Biko wrote:
If you want a thing done well, do it yourself:

Che Biko wrote:
It looks like CONCORD will not step in until after the Shiigeru/Kimotoro fleet is attacked, if even then. Therefor I would suggest the creation of a multi-ethnic capsuleer peacekeeping fleet, designed to pacify combatants, without lethal weapons, but I don't have high hopes this could be realized, considering the current climate and sentiments on the IGS.


A multi-ethnic peacekeeping fleet? Isn't that what Concord IS? Aren't you being a bit redundant?

Simon Louvaki
Khaldari InnoTektoniks and Analytical Solutions
#52 - 2013-03-19 17:45:28 UTC
Erik Kaassan wrote:

A multi-ethnic peacekeeping fleet? Isn't that what Concord IS? Aren't you being a bit redundant?



CONCORD is refusing to act until things reach a boiling point and its too late. CONCORD is the redundant one.

-- "The weak of mind are quick to judge with slightest tempt; Thus fools go forth to spread false word." - The Scriptures, Book of Trials 2:13 - 2:21

--"At the narrow passage, there is no brother and no friend." - Hyasyoda Proverb

Julianus Soter
Blades of Liberty
#53 - 2013-03-19 20:02:23 UTC
Arve Vesren wrote:
Good evening Gentlemen,

Over the course of the day the Directive Enforcement Department have received a number of messages of concern from Federal officials regarding the wording of the release in question.

The position of the CONCORD Assembly is quite clear. This is a territorial dispute between the Caldari State and Gallente Federation that CONCORD will not become involved in with regards to offensive military action unless either party breaches the Yulai Convention.

At this point in time, the situation on Caldari Prime is under review by the Inner Circle, and by Directive Enforcement Department Command. We will continue to monitor developments in the system of Luminaire, and may respond appropriately within the remit laid out for DED action under the Yulai Convention should the situation escalate further.

At this time we will continue to closely monitor the situation.

Regards,

Arve Vesren
Director of Operations
Directive Enforcement Department
CONCORD Assembly


Following Moira. Combat Reconnaissance missions to the surface of Caldari Prime, it has come to my attention that a number of the military forces on Caldari Prime are being transported to the surface by drop ships and orbital vessels. particularly by the Caldari State Protectorate.

This escalation of the surface warfare is in direct breach of the Yulai Conventions and should immediately trigger a DED intervention to blockade all military traffic in the Caldari Prime orbital zone, including Caldari Navy forces and the Shiigeru Leviathan-Class titan.

The situation is dire and Moira. Corporation, and indeed, the Villore Accords, requests an answer.

We are forwarding combat data to the Federal Intelligence Office and the Office of the President regarding large-scale, ongoing ground combat on Caldari Prime as well.

Moira. Corporation CEO, Executor, Villore Accords, @Julianus_Soter https://zkillboard.com/alliance/99001634/

Lyn Farel
Societas Imperialis Sceptri Coronaeque
Khimi Harar
#54 - 2013-03-19 20:52:47 UTC
Simon Louvaki wrote:
Erik Kaassan wrote:

A multi-ethnic peacekeeping fleet? Isn't that what Concord IS? Aren't you being a bit redundant?



CONCORD is refusing to act until things reach a boiling point and its too late. CONCORD is the redundant one.


Unfortunately, CONCORD is bound by the very treaties that created it in the first place.

Also, I suspect that CONCORD must be extremely careful when planning any intervention. Any interference in any side's affairs would probably be dramatic on the long run, especially when they have no mandate to do so.
Aelisha
Societas Imperialis Sceptri Coronaeque
Khimi Harar
#55 - 2013-03-19 21:08:57 UTC
Julianus Soter wrote:
Arve Vesren wrote:
Good evening Gentlemen,

Over the course of the day the Directive Enforcement Department have received a number of messages of concern from Federal officials regarding the wording of the release in question.

The position of the CONCORD Assembly is quite clear. This is a territorial dispute between the Caldari State and Gallente Federation that CONCORD will not become involved in with regards to offensive military action unless either party breaches the Yulai Convention.

At this point in time, the situation on Caldari Prime is under review by the Inner Circle, and by Directive Enforcement Department Command. We will continue to monitor developments in the system of Luminaire, and may respond appropriately within the remit laid out for DED action under the Yulai Convention should the situation escalate further.

At this time we will continue to closely monitor the situation.

Regards,

Arve Vesren
Director of Operations
Directive Enforcement Department
CONCORD Assembly


Following Moira. Combat Reconnaissance missions to the surface of Caldari Prime, it has come to my attention that a number of the military forces on Caldari Prime are being transported to the surface by drop ships and orbital vessels. particularly by the Caldari State Protectorate.

This escalation of the surface warfare is in direct breach of the Yulai Conventions and should immediately trigger a DED intervention to blockade all military traffic in the Caldari Prime orbital zone, including Caldari Navy forces and the Shiigeru Leviathan-Class titan.

The situation is dire and Moira. Corporation, and indeed, the Villore Accords, requests an answer.

We are forwarding combat data to the Federal Intelligence Office and the Office of the President regarding large-scale, ongoing ground combat on Caldari Prime as well.


Those FDU dropships aren't delivering welfare and good will you know.

CEO of the Achura-Waschi Exchange

Intaki Reborn

Independent Capsuleer

Scherezad
Revenent Defence Corperation
Ishuk-Raata Enforcement Directive
#56 - 2013-03-19 21:45:53 UTC
Julianus Soter wrote:
Arve Vesren wrote:
Good evening Gentlemen,

Over the course of the day the Directive Enforcement Department have received a number of messages of concern from Federal officials regarding the wording of the release in question.

The position of the CONCORD Assembly is quite clear. This is a territorial dispute between the Caldari State and Gallente Federation that CONCORD will not become involved in with regards to offensive military action unless either party breaches the Yulai Convention.

At this point in time, the situation on Caldari Prime is under review by the Inner Circle, and by Directive Enforcement Department Command. We will continue to monitor developments in the system of Luminaire, and may respond appropriately within the remit laid out for DED action under the Yulai Convention should the situation escalate further.

At this time we will continue to closely monitor the situation.

Regards,

Arve Vesren
Director of Operations
Directive Enforcement Department
CONCORD Assembly


Following Moira. Combat Reconnaissance missions to the surface of Caldari Prime, it has come to my attention that a number of the military forces on Caldari Prime are being transported to the surface by drop ships and orbital vessels. particularly by the Caldari State Protectorate.

This escalation of the surface warfare is in direct breach of the Yulai Conventions and should immediately trigger a DED intervention to blockade all military traffic in the Caldari Prime orbital zone, including Caldari Navy forces and the Shiigeru Leviathan-Class titan.

The situation is dire and Moira. Corporation, and indeed, the Villore Accords, requests an answer.

We are forwarding combat data to the Federal Intelligence Office and the Office of the President regarding large-scale, ongoing ground combat on Caldari Prime as well.


I will admit to delivering one combatant to Caldari. This was a favour and in no ways reflective on my duties in the State Protectorate.

You should take comfort, sir. Your Navy is very good at defending your territory.
Rinai Vero
Blades of Liberty
#57 - 2013-03-19 21:53:36 UTC
Aelisha wrote:


Those FDU dropships aren't delivering welfare and good will you know.


So, is this you making our point for us? A CONCORD established DMZ would prevent both sides from fighting this conflict out with the civilian population of Caldari Prime in the middle.
Aelisha
Societas Imperialis Sceptri Coronaeque
Khimi Harar
#58 - 2013-03-19 22:12:46 UTC
Rinai Vero wrote:
Aelisha wrote:


Those FDU dropships aren't delivering welfare and good will you know.


So, is this you making our point for us? A CONCORD established DMZ would prevent both sides from fighting this conflict out with the civilian population of Caldari Prime in the middle.


This is me poking holes in your leader's spittle laced rhetoric. But read into it what you like I guess? CONCORD isn't going to do ****.

CEO of the Achura-Waschi Exchange

Intaki Reborn

Independent Capsuleer

Tykari
The Observatory
#59 - 2013-03-19 22:21:57 UTC
The way this is going, this will end up becoming a moment remembered by history for a long time. And for CONCORD and the DED this is going to be a trying time.

Part of their job is maintaining the peace between the Empires, something they have utterly failed at. Though considering how the Empires feel towards each other that is hardly surprising. This has been a long time coming, and it's spiraling further out of control and I'm sure they know it.

To protect the right of civilizations to grow and prosper;
To preserve the surviving sovereignties of the Dark Ages;
To serve justice to those immortals who abuse the privilege of everlasting life;
To safeguard the mortals of worlds from dangers which originate in space;
To prevent empyrean technology from causing the destruction of humanity.


The beloved CONCORD mandate is rather clear, but of course the Yulai Convention makes the mandate somewhat lose it's shine and creates a whole lot of hassle for them, mostly squabbles about jurisdiction and right to interfere. This way the Empires don't need to feel threatened some external power will interfere in their affairs and it prevents the Empires from shifting any responsibility or blame to much towards them so CONCORD can use it's resources more efficiently without having to deal with every minor incident.

The problem, I feel, is that CONCORD sometimes also uses the Yulai Convention as a shield when really, they can and should do something, because they know they'll be in world of pain if they really get involved in the thick of it. I suspect the wounds of the Elder invasion are still lingering and serving as a reminder they are not invincible and that if they make a mistake they may not be able to prevent a total Armageddon of our current civilization. Though this may be one of those moments where they'll be damned either way.

Do something, get involved a massive conflict they might not win and will have massive consequences. Or do nothing, and essentially say to the whole cluster, look we can't do anything even if we wanted to, opening the door for everyone to start wreaking havoc, because the mighty CONCORD turns out to not be mighty after all.

In this dark void we are like brilliant stars, holding within us both the creative and destructive power to bring a new dawn upon worlds or plunge them into eternal darkness.

Rinai Vero
Blades of Liberty
#60 - 2013-03-19 23:41:10 UTC
Aelisha wrote:
Rinai Vero wrote:
Aelisha wrote:


Those FDU dropships aren't delivering welfare and good will you know.


So, is this you making our point for us? A CONCORD established DMZ would prevent both sides from fighting this conflict out with the civilian population of Caldari Prime in the middle.


This is me poking holes in your leader's spittle laced rhetoric. But read into it what you like I guess? CONCORD isn't going to do ****.


You're probably right that CONCORD will not intervene, but that doesn't make the argument that the Yulai Conventions are being breached invalid. Clearly space borne forces are being deployed to the surface of Caldari Prime, in breach of treaty. Pointing out that both sides are violating its stipulations seems to make the case for DED to act even more compelling from where I stand.