These forums have been archived and are now read-only.

The new forums are live and can be found at https://forums.eveonline.com/

Market Discussions

 
  • Topic is locked indefinitely.
12Next page
 

[LOAN #4] PRVEN: 20B @ 9%/month, 2 1/3 months, uncollat. (CLOSED)
Author
Previous Topic Next Topic
Kethas Protagonist
Protagonist Ventures
#1 - 2011-09-27 03:44:53 UTC  |  Edited by: Kethas Protagonist
This is a continuation of the loan's thread in the old forums.

September interest payments of 900M each have been sent to the two investors.

The next payment will be 900M interest + 10B principal repayment on or before November 1.

Prior to that, I'll launch a thread for a new loan of at least 20B, although I won't accept funds until after I've paid back my current investors.


I still owe you guys an update, too. I'll get to that within the next day or so.
Michelle P1H9A8N1
Intergalactic Better Business Corporation
#2 - 2011-09-27 09:00:24 UTC
900M received. Thanks.Big smile
flakeys
Doomheim
#3 - 2011-09-27 19:46:09 UTC
Received payment

We are all born ignorant, but one must work hard to remain stupid.
Kethas Protagonist
Protagonist Ventures
#4 - 2011-10-02 03:57:38 UTC
Phew. I'm finally ready with that update. You're expecting a brief "Business is going great, see you at the end of the month," right?

FECK NO!

This is Protagonist Ventures. We do things differently around here.


Remember my description of my three industries from the loan's OP on the old forums? No?

I wrote:
I currently operate three distinct businesses:

1) My original niche offers a high return on capital and easy hauling, but uses blueprints too inexpensive to serve as collateral.

2) My second niche offers a lower return on capital, but uses high-value blueprints and thus lets me finance production with lower-interest collateralized loans.

3) I've been experimenting in a third niche since early July. It offers a higher return on capital than the first business while retaining easy hauling, but its lower market volume keeps me from exploiting it as much without swamping the market.



Lifetime performance (*)

Industry #1:

  • Sales: 580B
  • Profits: 55B
  • Margin: ~9%

Industry #2:

  • Sales: 205B
  • Profits: 11B
  • Margin: ~5%

Industry #3:

  • Sales: 56B
  • Profits: 12B
  • Margin: ~21%


Last 30 days (**)

Industry #1:

  • Sales: 109B
  • Profits: 9.1B
  • Margin: ~8%

Industry #2:

  • Sales: 30B
  • Profits: 1.0B
  • Margin: ~3%

Industry #3:

  • Sales: 36B
  • Profits: 5.5B
  • Margin: ~15%


(*): For lifetime performance, profits were defined as:

Lifetime sales
+ Current material stock
+ Current manufacturing jobs
+ Current product stock (not yet on the market)
+ Current sell orders

- Lifetime materials purchases
- Lifetime product purchases (presumably undervalued, for subsequent resale)
- Broker fees
- Sales taxes

(**): For performance during the last 30 days, profits were defined as:

Total sales

- Product purchases
- Material cost of sales not supplied by product purchases, with prices set at the average price paid for the relevant material over the 30-day window
- Broker fees
- Sales taxes


The first definition of "profit" is a bit more accurate, but it's hard to apply to a specific window of time unless you keep a running historical tally of what your material and product stocks were at all times, which I do not.

Note that neither version of "profits" includes non-industry-specific expenses such as POS fuels, loan interest, PLEXs, etc., so my actual net profit will be lower than the above would lead you to believe. Unfortunately, I can't tell you how much lower, since that'd be a security risk (e.g. PLEX cost would tell you how many accounts I have).

Similarly, although my audit gave me better resolution - I have product-specific profit figures, for example, since one purpose of this self-review was to help me pick which products to move into or out of - you can't have it. Neener neener.

Finally, remember this note from the OP?

I wrote:
I have four distinct goals for this loan:

...

3) Start experimenting in a fourth business. It offers a lower return on capital than niche #2, but requires very little keyboard time and has a sky-high market volume compared to everything else I do, so if it's profitable (which I'm convinced it is) I'll be able to dump a ton of capital into it with little effort.


I haven't been able to/been motivated to touch that industry yet. All my cash has been devoted to #1-#3. As a result, I currently own a large number of highly researched, very expensive BPOs, undergoing very expensive research jobs. It's not the most efficient use of my capital in the short run, but I consider it a down payment on an eventual quasi-retirement where I can make enough profit for my needs with minimal effort.


In conclusion:

Business is going great. See you at the end of the month.
flakeys
Doomheim
#5 - 2011-10-02 06:02:19 UTC
Long read but with a good cup of coffee in the morning enjoyable Blink

Thanks for the update keth

We are all born ignorant, but one must work hard to remain stupid.
Michelle P1H9A8N1
Intergalactic Better Business Corporation
#6 - 2011-10-02 21:07:13 UTC
Kethas Protagonist wrote:
Phew. I'm finally ready with that update. You're expecting a brief "Business is going great, see you at the end of the month," right?

FECK NO!



When i got to that line i was like "FACK.....not another scammer coming out of the closet"...then i continued to the end...good read. Liked.
Kethas Protagonist
Protagonist Ventures
#7 - 2011-10-15 09:51:04 UTC
A quick update: the last two weeks have been great, the plan hasn't changed, and I'll be announcing a new loan over the next few days that will start Nov 1. It won't be as large a jump in principal as this one was - somewhere in the 20B-30B range. The loan and bidding process will be the same, too (starting at 10%/month, bid downward, etc. etc). Some of you have requested that I notify you when I launch; thank you for your interest, and I'll do so ingame once I have specifics.
Kethas Protagonist
Protagonist Ventures
#8 - 2011-10-21 06:32:51 UTC
My new loan thread is up.

As far as this loan is concerned, everything's going fine, and you'll both be receiving your 10B back on or before Nov. 1.

When you do receive the principal back, please post a confirmation here at your nearest convenience, so I can transition from this loan to that one as smoothly as possible.
Kethas Protagonist
Protagonist Ventures
#9 - 2011-10-27 20:11:41 UTC
Michelle informed me two days ago that, for RL reasons, she'd be away starting today and unable to confirm repayment until well into November. Yesterday I repaid her 10B principal + 900M interest for October early, hoping to give her a chance to confirm. As she hasn't confirmed receipt by now in either this thread or my new loan's, she presumably won't until some time in November.

When I informed flakeys of this, he asked that I post the explanation for Michelle's lack of confirmation publicly, presumably so that if for some reason I'm making it up Michelle can see and challenge me. That's this post. I'm also posting in my new loan's thread.

For the record, Michelle's reason for being away (which I will not disclose), if true, is legit and I don't particularly mind (although it's unfortunate that it makes me look a bit sketchy until she can get back). Informing flakeys of the discrepancy early, these posts, etc. are just due diligence.
Hyrath Rotineque
Dagger-1
The.Enclave
#10 - 2011-10-29 14:12:36 UTC
Same 3 people in thread...
Elise DarkStar
Garoun Investment Bank
Gallente Federation
#11 - 2011-10-29 14:46:23 UTC
Hyrath Rotineque wrote:
Same 3 people in thread...


And Michelle P1H9A8N1 is a known shill alt.
RAW23
#12 - 2011-10-29 15:49:32 UTC
Elise DarkStar wrote:
Hyrath Rotineque wrote:
Same 3 people in thread...


And Michelle P1H9A8N1 is a known shill alt.


flakeys too. I mean, if anyone had been stupid enough to invest in everything that he has propped up over the last two years they would have lost so m ... oh, wait.

There are two types of EVE player:

those who believe there are two types of EVE player and those who do not.
Elise DarkStar
Garoun Investment Bank
Gallente Federation
#13 - 2011-10-29 15:51:30 UTC
RAW23 wrote:
flakeys too. I mean, if anyone had been stupid enough to invest in everything that he has propped up over the last two years they would have lost so m ... oh, wait.


No, Flakeys just feeds off the misery of others by getting out right before the big scam cash-in after profiting from the first few initial repgrinds.
RAW23
#14 - 2011-10-29 15:57:59 UTC
Elise DarkStar wrote:
RAW23 wrote:
flakeys too. I mean, if anyone had been stupid enough to invest in everything that he has propped up over the last two years they would have lost so m ... oh, wait.


No, Flakeys just feeds off the misery of others by getting out right before the big scam cash-in after profiting from the first few initial repgrinds.


Odd. There was me thinking that most of flakey's investments never scammed at all. I'm sure you can correct my misapprehension with numerous examples though. Big smile

There are two types of EVE player:

those who believe there are two types of EVE player and those who do not.
Elise DarkStar
Garoun Investment Bank
Gallente Federation
#15 - 2011-10-29 16:00:06 UTC
RAW23 wrote:
Odd. There was me thinking that most of flakey's investments never scammed at all. I'm sure you can correct my misapprehension with numerous examples though. Big smile


You know better than to expect me to waste effort on something as trivial as proving that a scam-riddled pirate forum is a scam-riddled pirate forum.
Esan Vartesa
Samarkand Financial
#16 - 2011-10-29 16:16:16 UTC
Elise DarkStar wrote:
RAW23 wrote:
Odd. There was me thinking that most of flakey's investments never scammed at all. I'm sure you can correct my misapprehension with numerous examples though. Big smile


You know better than to expect me to waste effort on something as trivial as proving that a scam-riddled pirate forum is a scam-riddled pirate forum.


Isn't that convenient. it's funny that we all DO fully expect you to waste effort making wild accusations though.

At least you're consistent.
Elise DarkStar
Garoun Investment Bank
Gallente Federation
#17 - 2011-10-29 16:27:34 UTC
Esan Vartesa wrote:
Isn't that convenient. it's funny that we all DO fully expect you to waste effort making wild accusations though.

At least you're consistent.


Hey, known shill alt #4. How's it hanging?

Nobody has ever put together anything remotely convincing in terms of a theoretically relevant and consistent numerical argument because nobody can be bothered to. However, people do engage in a communally reinforced discourse that makes it appear as if this place isn;t in fact a scam-riddled pirate haven. I am merely counteracting that circlejerkery with the same level of observational authority that goes into propping up all of the scams here.

People can try and paint me as some raving mad man on the corner, but the fact is that I am the voice of reason to the last literally <10 people who don't seem to have realized that the entire investment institution is dead. Although people deluding themselves doesn't really matter to me, they do manage to maintain a tiny corner of communal insanity that still has the potential to deceive the new and unwary.
RAW23
#18 - 2011-10-29 16:47:41 UTC
Elise DarkStar wrote:
RAW23 wrote:
Odd. There was me thinking that most of flakey's investments never scammed at all. I'm sure you can correct my misapprehension with numerous examples though. Big smile


You know better than to expect me to waste effort on something as trivial as proving that a scam-riddled pirate forum is a scam-riddled pirate forum.


I didn't ask you to prove that. I asked you to prove your claim about a particular individual. I mean, you must have the evidence or you wouldn't be making the claim, would you?

There are two types of EVE player:

those who believe there are two types of EVE player and those who do not.
Kethas Protagonist
Protagonist Ventures
#19 - 2011-10-29 19:29:07 UTC
As posted above, I've already sent 900M interest + 10B principal to Michelle.

900M interest payment sent just now to flakeys. The 10B principal was not returned, as it's being rolled over into the new 30B loan.

I'll get around to herding in the trolls in the thread eventually, but a) I just finished about 12hr of hauling so I'm exhausted, and b) flakeys was kind enough to send the 20B for the rollover, so the troll posts are meaningless. Feel free to flame away; I suggest derogatory, unsubstantiated claims as to my sexual preferences.
flakeys
Doomheim
#20 - 2011-10-29 19:31:34 UTC
Confirming i received 900m interest from last month and the principal is being rolled over as also mentioned in the new loan agreement..


Thanks again keth

We are all born ignorant, but one must work hard to remain stupid.
12Next page