Player Features and Ideas Discussion

The subject says it all. Wholesale ganking of mining barges in highsec has picked up again. I had a Hulk fitted for nullsec successfully ganked by two destroyers in highsec. While poking around killmails, I found an orca that had been ganked in high sec by a gang of 24. Why is that a problem? It had less than 7 million ISK worth of cargo in it:

http://eve.battleclinic.com/killboard/engagement.php?id=19043594 (and no the orca pilot wasn't at war as he was in an NPC corp)

That's wholesale ganking for nothing except statistics boosting and that shouldn't be happening in highsec.

There needs to be a balance between those that like to destroy and those that like to create, or else one group will leave. Those that like to destroy have an enormous playground called lowsec and nullsec. Highsec is the playground of industry. I know of no changes that inhibit the destroyers from having a good time in their playground.

Kill rights are awesome, but they don't make up for getting back 45 million ISK from Platinum insurance (I got 65 million back from the insurance which cost 20 million) for a 200 million ISK ship (not including fittings). Especially since it probably cost the gankers less than 10 million ISK.

The last time this kind of behavor was happening, I cancelled the subscriptions on my two accounts for a year and half. And this time I haven't paid for 6 months in advance. I learned my lesson.


Here's some ideas on how to solve this:


1) My understanding is that insurance is no longer paid out for ganker's ships for attacks in high sec. That's a good step and I hope that hasn't changed.

2) Change the killmails for unauthorized ganks in highsec. Obviously, part of what these people are looking for is boosting their stats. Don't give them the stats. Only provide that ships were destroyed, who had their ships destroyed and who did the destroying (and the system). Don't provide information about what ships were destroyed or what was dropped. That way there's no stat boosting from easy targets in highsec.

3) Change the kill rights so that they allow for more than just one ship destroyed. Most of these guys are flying around in T1 fitted destroyers that don't cost much. As already indicated, destroying one or two 5 million ISK ships doesn't make up for the destruction of one 200 million ISK ship. Perhaps the kill right would be satisfied once the value of the ganker's ships destroyed equals the value of the ship destroyed by the ganker (or when 30 days is up). In other words, if you had two gankers destroying a 200 million ISK Hulk, the kill rights would allow for the destruction of 100 million ISK worth of ships for each of the two gankers (200 million divided by two). The kill right would still expire after 30 days, but within that time period the kill right allows for the destruction of ships up to a total calculated by the value of the destroyed ship. If a 200 million ISK ship were destroyed by five gankers, it would be 40 million each. This would also mitigate people using alts to get rid of kill rights.

4) The ganker can run around and gank people at will, but the ganked can only execute a kill right for 15 minutes at a time? The kill right should be able to be left on as long as the kill right remains available to the ganked, but the kill right can be turned on or off once every 30 minutes minutes (to prevent idiots from spamming it). In other words, the ganked can turn on the kill right and leave it on the entire remaining time the kill right provides if they so desire.

5) The destruction of a shuttle or newb ship should not qualify for the satisfaction of a kill right. Perhaps there should be a value limit under which the ship doesn't count? Of course, this could be ignored if #3 were implemented since the value is so small it wouldn't make a difference.

6) The email notification sent to the person on the other end of a kill right currently gives too much information. The only thing it should say is that the kill right has been activated. It shouldn't say that it's for everyone, for the corporation, or for a given individual. The ganker should be looking over their shoulder wondering where the attack is going to come from rather than potentially knowing and being able to look out for those hunting them.


I especially like #3. It brings some parity between the value of the ships being destroyed by the gankers and the ships that can be destroyed via kill rights.



P.S. I'm a long time player obviously using an alt to avoid the inevitable hatemail from cowardly whiners that like to destroy ships that can't fight back.

I see no problem here, aside from you.

Because that is HIGH SECURITY space. Not lowsec. Not nullsec. It has a purpose. The purpose is to allow those that don't want to be in constant danger of having their stuff destroyed a place to go and do their thing. Otherwise, there's no reason to have a highsec. If that goes out the window again (as it did during Hulkegeddeon), those people will start to leave again.

You children out there that decry the carebears don't understand they help keep this game alive and help keep this game around so you can play it. Whether you like it or not, you need them. You need them because CCP needs them. If this weren't true, "Retribution" would never have happened. It would have a different name with a different theme.

High sec ganking has a place in this game. But it should be to get loot worth the risk or the repercussions, not just because it boosts stats. It appears that the repercussions are still too low.

High security, not total or perfect security.

It's purpose is to be safer than low and null, not safe.

Oh and you say you lost a Hulk to 2 destroyers. Saying it was fit for null, means nothing tbh. How was it fit exactly?

High-sec os not a safe-zone. High-sec is not a sacntuary. High-sec is not a WoW city in space.
High security does not mean absolute immunity.



I bet it was fit for maximum ore yield.

Nullsec tanked hulk is great for rats (where they're more the "wear you down with low alpha, high dps") ... not so hot for player pirates (where the name of the game is "alpha").


With that said, ships exploding is always a good thing (for business, anyway). Gankers _DO_ lose their ships, and, well you need a new hulk now.

The real interesting thing is going to be when the miners realize that trit is 6.5 ISK/unit nearby, because that's where the indy pilots are making a killing by selling to both sides (dessies to the pirates, barges to the miners). Granted, they'll never put up anything as heinous as a system or constellation or region-wide embargo on minerals ... but goddamn that would make for good gameplay...

Miners (and by extension, industrial corps/alliances) -- you have your supply area by the balls ... if you get together AND STOP MINING AND SELLING GOODS ON THE OPEN MARKET the area's economy will collapse. Sure, it also means you're not selling on the open market and making your wallet grow fat ...

... but you can mine ...
... i need minerals ...
... I trade completed (whatever you need) for minerals ...
... we're both happy ...
... market starts having fewer and fewer dessies/whatever ...
... pirates now have longer and longer logistics chains...
... OTHER pirates gank these logistics chains (because, seriously ... it's not like it's "all the gankers over here" vs "all the carebears over here") ...

This thread. Wow.

Yeah, I hear ya. I've changed now too. The only thing is you lose even more ore volume given the lower bonuses, even when compared to a hard fitted Hulk. No point in having Hulks if you can't fly them in highsec.

Since you believe this is true, what fit do you believe fits that description? I'll take that fit and compare it to the Hulks that have been destroyed over the last week and see if that holds true.

I'm not looking for advice on a fit here. I'm looking to compare your statement with reality to see if that's an accurate statement.

Everything isn't about highsec, but why would you use a Hulk in lowsec or nullsec? That's crazy talk. The only time you would do so is when you have a large, well protected mining op going on. Otherwise, it's much better to use a Skiff in those circumstances. So, if you are using a skiff everywhere because Hulks are getting ganked in highsec, I see no point in even having a Hulk in the game. I might be wrong, but I would be willing to bet the vast majority of Hulks are being used in highsec.