Warfare & Tactics

It's easy for people like you to say such things when 9/10 times you have the long end of the stick.

I can not think of a single situation my pve fit cruiser/bc has an advantedge/chance over any pvp fit ship. Even a frigate will keep me scram pined since i have no nuet or web. Even if i had a web, what stops him warping out?.

I choose to run, from everything.. becuase they'd have to be prety damn bad to lose. I give -10 players more credit than that.

My targets only ever get the chance to use WarpStabs once... then I use my Phobos. No matter how many stabs you fit the Phobos says NO!!!

Don't fit stabs though. All you are actually doing is fitting for failure. Going into a fight fitted to run away means you will run away.

Stopped reading the thread towards the end of the first post so not sure if this was addressed. Someone mentioned something about Concord.

Never rely on Concord. If the person attacking is doing something wrong they will show up regardless, they won't show up because of and ECM Burst. They will show up and kill YOU if you fire that ECM burst and have an effect on something neutral, such as a gate, station, etc.

Long story short Concord is not your friend and chances are if they are going to show up you will already be dead. They are there only to punish, not to protect.

Mmmkay. Phobos. I will look that up. Kind of like a photon torpedo ?

Why is running away bad?

[quote=Todath Narod][quote=JAF Anders]I don't like this thread being about escaping every fight. I'll start talking about how you get out of a particular fight you're probably not going to win. Topic! Prepare to be boarded!

I had problems like you - kinda. I've lost BC's, Cruisers, Dessies, Frigates - all T1 hulls. As brazen as I am, I don't care to loose a T2 hull, until I'm reasonably confident that I won't lose it simply for idiocy on my part.

There is alot of great advice on this thread, even from the folks who are telling you to man up and not run from a fight - becuase they are really making a good point. Let me explain.

1. The folks that are telling you to harden up or to not fit WCS's are doing so, b/c when you fit to run - you fit to lose. They don't mean that you should never run. They mean - don't fit to be a failure. You are flying in low-sec. It doesn't matter why. There are people in low-sec that are going to eat you. Start thinking of EVE as the Sahara. Asteroid Belts, Planets, Warp Gates, and anything else that people "go to" to make use of are the Waterholes. Even if you are a water buffalo (PvE), you need to remember that there are lions and alligators (PvP - Pirates and the like) and other predators coming to the waterhole with the sole purpose of predating on you. A water buffalo may be an herbivore, but it has defenses and will make use of them when needed.

2. Furthering the analogy - DSCAN. Read and Re-Read the post by the pilot that was kind enough to tell you how to do a 360 degree "localized" directional scan. That water buffalo may go to the waterhole to drink (Rat in a Belt), but you can bet your back-side that the first thing he is doing is listening for danger and paying attention to his surroundings. If you can't rat or run missions and pay attention to DSCAN - you either need to spend time practicing it in High-Sec until you can do it or stay out of low-sec altogether - or the Rats/Mission may be too difficult for your ship fitting/skills/ability as a pilot.

3. I would like to leave you with an example - I took an Omen (Amarr Cruiser) into FW space to do a medium Plex. I needed to do so, because my frigates and destroyers didn't put out enough dps to kill the NPC in the Plex. However, I was well aware that my medium guns didn't have the tracking to handle a frigate sized vessel and that I would most likely be targeted by one as soon as I entered system. I went to the plex, killed the rat, and I burned out to 28km from the button - that way there was some distance from where an enemy warship would enter the plex (access is controlled by a gate). This hole time, I would hit my DSCAN about every 10-20 seconds. Sure enough, a Navy Slicer (Amarr Faction Frigate) showed up on my DSCAN that wasn't there on my prior scan 20 seconds prior. So, I knew (or could speculate with an high certainty) that the pilot of the Navy Slicer was thinking about whether or not he wanted to engage. He didn't think long, because he probably surmised that I was an easy target (We noobs like to bring in big, flashy ships that die in fire). He was confident that he would be able to get under my guns. What he did NOT anticipate was that I was sitting there waiting for him, FAR out of his optimal range. As soon as he showed up on my grid, I targeted him and had my web drones on him (all 5) immediately. As slow as he was going, tracking and hitting him wasn't a problem. No - I didn't kill him, but after just a few seconds I had him in armor and he hot-footed it out of my area. My point is simply this - I knew my weaknesses and I found a way to counter that weakness with teeth. (As an aside - I was still a juicy target. I was soon after flushed from that system into a gate-camp a couple of systems over. That's a whole other issue. However, even though I lost my ship - I still ended up taking out a tech II frigate on my way down.)

4. Long story short - if you fit your ship to lose, you always will. Running away may in fact save your ship and that's a really good thing - but you can't always run. When you can't run, you need to be able to utilize your options and you may as well start learning now.

5. Finally, it is great advice - that you join a corp. Find a good group of folks to fly with and if you have a good attitude, you will find much more help than you anticipate. Annnd finally (for real) - you can always strike up a good conversation with the folks that kill you. You'll be surprised how often they graciously point out to you, how they leveraged a weakness against you. That will go a long way to helping you find the areas you need to strengthen.

Fly Dangerously and With a Vengeance!

- Kobalos

"Oh my god give me fights please! Please!"

1. I do NOT think that he was necessarily stating the obvious nor do I think that he was interfering. I think that the way he replied was rude and didn’t need to be said. I work in IT and things that are obvious to me are NOT obvious to my clients the majority of the time. The fact of the matter is, low-sec is really about opening the players up to a more dangerous environment than high-sec. What makes it more dangerous is the vulnerability to hostile players that it introduces. In that context, I think that he and the other posters are spot on with their point. Its just that some folks feel they need to be rude – for whatever reason.

2. Which example are you referring to? Are you referring to my Sahara analogy or the fact that I lost my Omen? Lol

3. I like to think about countering folks and being underestimated and full of surprises. I find that its part of the excitement of PvP.

4. If I had been at 10km instead of 28km, he would have been much harder for my weapons to track. EVE likes to use physics and in this case, I would have swung the pendulum of physics to favour him. In other words, it is easier to track a ship that is farther away than it is one that is close. But, I did have a web and a scram fitted – so…yes…if he got too close I might have been able to lock him down even harder. The key word here is “might.” In PvP, nothing is 100% certain. There is one PvP video out there in which the pilot uses the “look at” feature to see what type of weapons his opponent had fitted – loooong before his target was within range. Every thing you can do to prepare to win, the better. Use everything to your advantage – everything. Part of making sure I could win was to use all of my strengths to my advantage. My main advantage, if I could hit him, was distance. Frigates use small weapons, while I had medium weapons fitted. Think a 5’4’’ boxer fighting another boxer that is 6’2’’.

What ship do you fly? If it's a boat with a bigger drone bay than drone bandwidth, keeping spare ECM drones in your drone bay is one of the best deals you can get to get out with a pinned down ship, especially if the opponent is a frigate (smaller ships have lower strength to counter ECM in most cases). Fitting a web on your ship is also a decent module for countering ganks because it's not a wasted slot for PvE as it will in most cases increase your dps against frigs/cruiser rats.