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Moving forward with WiS
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Vincent Athena
Photosynth
#101 - 2013-02-27 16:51:43 UTC
Sura Sadiva wrote:
Krixtal Icefluxor wrote:
I think the folks who hated Incarna WIS were just trying to stir up drama with "hot video cards", which may be true but most of the time with a descent card means absolutely nothing. The fan kicking on is just a sign that it is doing its job.

What was all the money spent for with an expensive card if it's not even pushed to half it's limit ?


Well, no; the performance problem was real at the Incarna release.

Not only overheatting, in general CQ rendering was a severe load for the client. And the code was bugged as well. I think this made impossible to release a multiuser avatar envinronment without allocating enough resources for several months after Incarna. And CCP resources were (as still are) absorbed by Dust.

So, not being able to deliver a multiuser setting any further impementation lost sense.

But anyway in all the expansions after Incarna (till retribution) they kept reiterating on CQ fixing rendering bugs and optizzing the code. Now seems pretty polished and stable to me. On my nvidia gt250 I have no problem in running 2 clients with CQ at max graphic settings and even after almost 2 years still the best avatar engine on the market.

I think the elements for a limited (5-10 avatar) multiusers envinroments are all already in, they only need to be rearranged and provided with a UI.

Ive been wondering about those old assets. I remember watching a sisi update pre-incarna and seeing files with names like "Establishments...". Something was made. But its been 2 years. Many other changes have been made to the client, how it does things, the data structures and so on. Has that 2 year old code gone stale? How much work would it be to get it into the game?

I still think some sort of multi-avatar area is needed without game play first, just to insure it works on everyone's hardware. I would not want a broken new feature released for something that mattered. If done CCP would need to call it what it is: A stress test. Why not do it just on Sisi? Because not enough people visit sisi to give it a full test.

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Sura Sadiva
Entropic Tactical Crew
#102 - 2013-02-27 17:36:21 UTC
Vincent Athena wrote:

Ive been wondering about those old assets. I remember watching a sisi update pre-incarna and seeing files with names like "Establishments...". Something was made. But its been 2 years. Many other changes have been made to the client, how it does things, the data structures and so on. Has that 2 year old code gone stale? How much work would it be to get it into the game?

I still think some sort of multi-avatar area is needed without game play first, just to insure it works on everyone's hardware. I would not want a broken new feature released for something that mattered. If done CCP would need to call it what it is: A stress test. Why not do it just on Sisi? Because not enough people visit sisi to give it a full test.


yes. A multiavatar envinroment is a base requirement for any kind gameplay and integrations you want to develop. And it's also the more easy to deliver cause I think actually is already developed, only need to be rearranged.

Prototypes of this were released already in 2006-2007 and later.
Like this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5l_ZjVyRxx4

or this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LzZRRPPw_QE


incarna was a mere retexture of this :)
Vincent Athena
Photosynth
#103 - 2013-02-27 18:57:02 UTC
Sura Sadiva wrote:
Vincent Athena wrote:

Ive been wondering about those old assets. I remember watching a sisi update pre-incarna and seeing files with names like "Establishments...". Something was made. But its been 2 years. Many other changes have been made to the client, how it does things, the data structures and so on. Has that 2 year old code gone stale? How much work would it be to get it into the game?

I still think some sort of multi-avatar area is needed without game play first, just to insure it works on everyone's hardware. I would not want a broken new feature released for something that mattered. If done CCP would need to call it what it is: A stress test. Why not do it just on Sisi? Because not enough people visit sisi to give it a full test.


yes. A multiavatar envinroment is a base requirement for any kind gameplay and integrations you want to develop. And it's also the more easy to deliver cause I think actually is already developed, only need to be rearranged.

Prototypes of this were released already in 2006-2007 and later.
Like this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5l_ZjVyRxx4

or this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LzZRRPPw_QE

incarna was a mere retexture of this :)

Is it just a retexture? I thought it is much more.
Those videos show what may be the one and only emote CCP added: Salute.
Also I remember a dev post saying the way they were going to handle multi-avatars on less than the best hardware was dynamic detail loss. More avatars, less detail. Especially for those in the background.

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Vincent Athena
Photosynth
#104 - 2013-02-27 19:45:38 UTC
Unsuccessful At Everything wrote:
-We should have communal places in station where we can all sit around and make catcalls and wolfwhistles at all the female toons, who of course more than likely are 40 year old men.
-Also need dark places in station for us users of illegal substances to expand our minds.
-NPC prostitutes...ones that you can beat up and get your money back...we need those too.
-In the center of every station should be a pit with saws and jagged stuff at the bottom, so you are forced to jump in to biomass.
-A window in one of communal places that allows you to see outside station at all the undock campers..that would be cool too, but im sure would be horribly hilariously abused.

The window idea would work if at the same time we got a way to stop re-docking. Like a comms jammer module. If your comms are jammed you cannot request docking or stargate jumps. Then undocking into a station camp means you are most likely going to die. The balance to this? You can go look outside first.

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Krixtal Icefluxor
INLAND EMPIRE Galactic
#105 - 2013-02-27 20:12:57 UTC  |  Edited by: Krixtal Icefluxor
I just feel it has a direct tie into the concept of "Internet Spaceships".

The idea of an area of 'commonality' and interaction even extends back through the literature to LArry Niven's "Draco's Bar" stories.

Of course it fits in to EVE.

The naysayers just have no imagination. And I'm sure EVE players will find plenty of exploits heretofore unheard of within the concept.

EDIT: Draco's TAVERN. And I will let the mistake stand intact.

"He has mounted his hind-legs, and blown crass vapidities through the bowel of his neck."  - Ambrose Bierce on Oscar Wilde's Lecture in San Francisco 1882
Midori Amiiko
Garoun Investment Bank
Gallente Federation
#106 - 2013-03-01 13:28:59 UTC
Not sure about user-generated stuff. On one hand I've seen some really cool stuff on IMVU and SecondLife...but on the other hand, I've seen some really lame stuff on IMVU and SecondLife. I would love some transparent clothing, I'd hate cat costumes. I'm ambivalent about sex dungeons, but If I could install a stripper's pole and drag an exotic dancer to my CQ, I'd consider that a win.

If rendering multiple avatars is a problem, I'd suggest to CCP that the POV shift to 1st person. That takes drawing me out of the equation at the least.

I don't know about the freshness quotient of the code. CCP is still using Carbon, right? Isn't that the shiny thing that's supposed to make this stuff go?
Vincent Athena
Photosynth
#107 - 2013-03-04 17:31:18 UTC
Ive been reading the news reports about the current "Uprising". I note that alot of the action takes place in stations. At present these are just text reports, just "cut scenes" which we cannot interact with. We have to wait for the action to spill over into space. As long as the events are in a station we cannot effect the outcome, cannot help shape the development of New Eden.

Unless that door opens. Being able to interact with ongoing events in the station may be a way to bring meaningful game play to WiS.

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Midori Amiiko
Garoun Investment Bank
Gallente Federation
#108 - 2013-03-13 12:15:58 UTC
Meaningful game play would be great, but I'd benefit greatly if I could just voicechat with other players while looking at their avatars. Put a face to a voice to a name, you know? In a big corp/alliance knowing who I'm talking to can be a challenge. Especially if I just joined up.