Warfare & Tactics

omg another thread about this cant u guiys just look and comment on the other 100 threads by carebears too scared to work cos someones in there system who they dont know.........

if u wanna do that **** in peace go to high sec.............................

Easy enough to define.

An eve player who can acutaly build the system, the station, the ships the infrastructure the rest of you use to pve and pvp in.

without player own station there would be no homes in null.
without infrastructure your anomalies would be small in number.
without infastruture the miners would not be there for you to mock and gank.
without people wanting to actual play in that system the afk cloak would have nowhere to hove but an empty systemr..

so, without hardcore industrialist you wouldn't have a game to play.

simple.

Oh yay, another one...

Tears? wine?

lol.

I am saying that the cloak is a broken game mechanic.

The Cloak is perfectly safe until they choose to engange... witch is completely opposite to what eve is, even by your view.

There isn't supposed to be any one ship that is king.. being undetectable by any means, allowing for the ship to sit possibly not interacting with the eve environment is not what ccp wanted. As said, you want safe? dock up in a station.. or log out.

If that was so, why would even the Dust 514 trailer show the mercs on the planetside shoting at a ship in orbit?

I am suggesting that ccp fix the issue...

A mothership with specialty fighters with probe capabilities to patrol systems, perhaps with the abitliy to take out frigate and possible cruiser class cloaked ships. This would take skills, game expierince, ect.
Not just an alt trained for a few weeks sitting in a cloaked ship undetectable.

That would leave bs and more importantly Black ops squads a clear role to play. Still findable,, still with the abitly to interdict system, but leaving a way for the system to respond in their time, not some semi afk player who isn't playing eve actively with that account.

Its a can of worms as stated.

Your own view point shots your argument of it being left as is "in the foot":

I read your post and agree, that is the other half.
I strongly support people getting in their ships and defending space, claiming space. Without the infrastructure to support those fleets, it gets very difficult to maintain that level of pvp.

I didn't say they stopped my activities.
that seems to be the mistaken idea, I am strongly suggesting it gets fixed.

So, essentially your suggesting cloaking gets hit with the nerf bat to prevent people from "afk cloaking" to interdict a system. Suggesting instead people setup a POS to interdict the system?

Things to keep in mind:
1.) Any nerf to cloaking should not inhibit the general utility of a cloak.... The SOLE purpose of a cloak is to hide... and any ship utilizing a cloak has some serious drawbacks while cloaked, and even drawbacks above and beyond that... As such, any method to scanning down a cloaked ship (i.e. to unhide the person that fit a module to hide) fundamentally alters the purpose of the cloak. Its very hard to do his in a balanced manner.

2.) The "infrastructure" based interdiciton is flawed. There are only a limited number of moons at which you can anchor a tower, and it's easy to populate all those moons with towers to "prevent" your suggested form of interdiction. This problem is amplified by the fact that offline towers still have FULL HP, which means it takes a TON of firepower to timely removed such a structure, while it is trivially easy & cheap to anchor one at every moon.

3.) Local chat is biased toward the defender, and any nerf to "afk cloakers" in particular removes the only in-game work-around to make a system "dangerous" again. Currently, pilots don't even try to get safe until AFTER a hostile enters system... The time it takes to enter system, locate a target, and warp in is generally longer than it takes for a slow-aligning carrier to "get safe". If you want to remove AFK Cloakers, then you need to address the current threat constraint local chat provides.

I personally think afk cloaking is a lame tactic, but cannot support any changes to it until the nullsec's danger scale is addressed.

As the thread title says, Can of worms..,

semi AFK cloaker is immune to attack until they choose to initiate, completely opposite to the pirate view, the dangers of null sec, ect.


If
you had a mothership with specialty fighters able to scan and kill frigate and possibly cruiser size ships that where cloaked... it would give an active role to Black ops. Black ops roles in both interdicting the system and in potenitaly attacking that motherships sitting outside of the pos shields. (nice kill mail there if you catch them!)

The frigates and cruisers could still log in and out like they already do when they find a person foolish enough to come back to a known mining or ratting point for loot or ore. (Darwin award for those pilots.) and doesn't structuraly change their abilty to interdict a system from "Risk evasive" players. The semi afk cloaker is a risk evasive player. If they want to be unseen in local, go to WH space and find targets there. Its not like people don't mine those systems for pure isk gain.



How an probe fighter systm patrol might work;

The system map for probe scaning could be used by the mothership fighter probes. This could be setup to do a system patrol. Smaller targets delt with possibly by the specialty fighers, while the larger BS targets would require the standing fleet once discovered. They could still possible escape as well, to a new hiding spot.

The system patrol wouldn't be instant discovery, and if the covert cloak was active; most likely using DScan; could possibly fly around the patrols, (wow, just like the brave soul they claim to be!, imagine the eve story of the lone covert cloaky who avoided the system patrols for days and days,,,)

(I am not an FC, but I regularly help host a system standing defense fleet)

So changing the mechanic so the player has to be active isn't changing their abiltty to interdict the system. just prevents them from doiong it easily, afk or as a bot.
Just like finding them should not be easy either, but it should be possible to bring the fight to them, and not just at their choice of time and place.
Completely opposite to the nature of null sec they want to foster, witch is of danger all the time. Currently the danger is onesided and only at their choice of initiating. No where else in eve is there that.

In WH space both are hidden, both parties must scan down the other. Equal terms so to speak.

So, a can of worms, including the idea of local being "perfect" intel.
But they are initialy using a gate, witch expends huges amounts of energy, and has a crew,, who of course would never broadcast the nature of the ship that just jumped into the system to every system local pilot, including giving the new arrival the same benefit of saying who is there.

Perhaps local should fade unless triggered? something like allanice chat?

I like afk cloaking... you make your money ratting 8-10 hours... ill make mine ransoming the system... whats broken is the ability to bot err play 8-10 hours 7 days a week.

You're right. I should not be able to terrorize War Targets by simply being online in a station while not actually at my computer.

So we should get rid of local entirely in all space, including High Sec. The guest list in station needs to go as well. And I should not be able to affect their activities while sleeping, docked in a high sec station 25 jumps away. The watch list has to go while we're at it.

I see no problem with people sitting in a station. At least then they know where they have you. You also won't be doing it in a system where the station is hostile.