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C4's: It's full of noobs...
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Domoso
Planisphere Salvage
#1 - 2013-03-10 12:50:14 UTC  |  Edited by: Domoso
Been noticing a huge increase of population in C4's, mostly noobs and mostly russian, possibly not noob but, probably mostly drunk on cheap vodka. And we've been enjoying the hell out of the pew coming from that class as well. We're taking our whapps and giving back. It's been a cornucopia of small gang fun.

C4's used to have a bad reputation all around, no pew, no fun. But that doesn't seem to be the case anymore. Killing 3 Orcas in 5 days plus other ships in between would speak otherwise.

Anyone else noticing the change?
Adoris Nolen
Sama Guild
#2 - 2013-03-10 13:07:04 UTC
SSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Kitty Bear
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#3 - 2013-03-10 14:19:08 UTC
They are just utilising an area of j-space that was for the most part considered undesirable

C4 static exits are (offhand) C5, C4, C3 & C2. so access to hisec is more complicated and has a higher element of risk than it does for a corp using a C1-C3 with a Hisec static.

The non-statics can be just as bad from a logistics viewpoint, decent odds on a hisec exit is about 1 in 16.
Rroff
Antagonistic Tendencies
#4 - 2013-03-10 15:02:22 UTC  |  Edited by: Rroff
Kitty Bear wrote:
They are just utilising an area of j-space that was for the most part considered undesirable

C4 static exits are (offhand) C5, C4, C3 & C2. so access to hisec is more complicated and has a higher element of risk than it does for a corp using a C1-C3 with a Hisec static.

The non-statics can be just as bad from a logistics viewpoint, decent odds on a hisec exit is about 1 in 16.


C4 with a static C2 isn't too bad you have a high chance of rolling into one with a highsec for one of its statics. A static C3 isn't much fun but not terrible - good chance of a lowsec which is often useable tho when we had a C5/3 on a bad day we've crashed the static for over an hour before finding a highsec. C4/4 is absolutely deathly as atleast with a C5 static theres a chance of wandering k-space connections - from what I've heard people with C4/4 not completely infrequently end up with a chain something like home->C4->C4->home :S
Winthorp
#5 - 2013-03-10 22:37:02 UTC
LIES.
Godfrey Silvarna
Arctic Light Inc.
Arctic Light
#6 - 2013-03-10 22:53:18 UTC
Rroff wrote:
Kitty Bear wrote:
They are just utilising an area of j-space that was for the most part considered undesirable

C4 static exits are (offhand) C5, C4, C3 & C2. so access to hisec is more complicated and has a higher element of risk than it does for a corp using a C1-C3 with a Hisec static.

The non-statics can be just as bad from a logistics viewpoint, decent odds on a hisec exit is about 1 in 16.


C4 with a static C2 isn't too bad you have a high chance of rolling into one with a highsec for one of its statics. A static C3 isn't much fun but not terrible - good chance of a lowsec which is often useable tho when we had a C5/3 on a bad day we've crashed the static for over an hour before finding a highsec. C4/4 is absolutely deathly as atleast with a C5 static theres a chance of wandering k-space connections - from what I've heard people with C4/4 not completely infrequently end up with a chain something like home->C4->C4->home :S

I previously lived in a C5 with a C4 static... THOSE CHAINS! I still have nightmares of the c5-c4-c4-c4-c4-c5-c6-c5-c4-c4-c4-c4-c5-... limbo.
Mattalious
Doomheim
#7 - 2013-03-11 03:31:13 UTC
C4s are both a blessing and a curse. It can get deathly quiet in those babies, so unless you go looking for trouble you can weeks without seeing anyone else. On the brighter side of life, it allows Eve players to make money without being beholden to the larger Alliances that occupy C5/C6s. As for the never ending chaings? Meh, that's what orcas are for. Fold baby, fold!
Svodola Darkfury
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#8 - 2013-03-11 19:24:29 UTC
This trend actually began in May or June of 2012. Several Russian alliances started buying up C4 wormholes with C2 or C3 statics, probably for the seclusion, easy C4 sites, and easy solo sites out of their statics.

The money in C4s is actually comparable to any sites you can do without capital escalations (a little over 100 million an hour per pilot, more with more pimped ships, up to about 8 people) and the Russians started to realize this. Made for many months of good hunting in "Russian o'Clock" through our C4 static. It's still abysmal hunting in the US timezone.

Svo.

Director of Frozen Corpse Industries.
Comy 1
Imperial Shipment
Amarr Empire
#9 - 2013-03-11 20:05:35 UTC
Svodola Darkfury wrote:
This trend actually began in May or June of 2012. Several Russian alliances started buying up C4 wormholes with C2 or C3 statics, probably for the seclusion, easy C4 sites, and easy solo sites out of their statics.

The money in C4s is actually comparable to any sites you can do without capital escalations (a little over 100 million an hour per pilot, more with more pimped ships, up to about 8 people) and the Russians started to realize this. Made for many months of good hunting in "Russian o'Clock" through our C4 static. It's still abysmal hunting in the US timezone.

Svo.


Got to say that over 100mil/h in a C4 is not really bad, but if that is all you get running cap escalations you are either doing something terribly wrong, or use WAY too many pilots to do it.
Derath Ellecon
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#10 - 2013-03-11 20:39:53 UTC
Comy 1 wrote:
Svodola Darkfury wrote:
This trend actually began in May or June of 2012. Several Russian alliances started buying up C4 wormholes with C2 or C3 statics, probably for the seclusion, easy C4 sites, and easy solo sites out of their statics.

The money in C4s is actually comparable to any sites you can do without capital escalations (a little over 100 million an hour per pilot, more with more pimped ships, up to about 8 people) and the Russians started to realize this. Made for many months of good hunting in "Russian o'Clock" through our C4 static. It's still abysmal hunting in the US timezone.

Svo.


Got to say that over 100mil/h in a C4 is not really bad, but if that is all you get running cap escalations you are either doing something terribly wrong, or use WAY too many pilots to do it.



She very clearly stated WITHOUT capital escalations...

Just sayin.
Comy 1
Imperial Shipment
Amarr Empire
#11 - 2013-03-11 22:39:33 UTC
Derath Ellecon wrote:
Comy 1 wrote:
Svodola Darkfury wrote:
This trend actually began in May or June of 2012. Several Russian alliances started buying up C4 wormholes with C2 or C3 statics, probably for the seclusion, easy C4 sites, and easy solo sites out of their statics.

The money in C4s is actually comparable to any sites you can do without capital escalations (a little over 100 million an hour per pilot, more with more pimped ships, up to about 8 people) and the Russians started to realize this. Made for many months of good hunting in "Russian o'Clock" through our C4 static. It's still abysmal hunting in the US timezone.

Svo.


Got to say that over 100mil/h in a C4 is not really bad, but if that is all you get running cap escalations you are either doing something terribly wrong, or use WAY too many pilots to do it.



She very clearly stated WITHOUT capital escalations...

Just sayin.


You are totally right, I should not post tired.
Dato Koppla
Neuronix
#12 - 2013-03-11 22:45:53 UTC
The endless chains aren't as bad as people say, it's nice for hunting and usually you'll get a decent kspce exit within 3 whs if your static is a c2, and if you don't just close the hole and try again. It's nice to have a quiet home system for bearing.
Oxandrolone
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#13 - 2013-03-11 23:24:31 UTC
Only an idiot would live in a C4 heres why:

- No cap escalations but still require groups to PvE
- Static masses are horrible, all require multiple orca's
- No freighter HS's so pain in the ass without lots of hauling in itty V's or orcas.
- No k-space statics compared to low-class wormholes
- No high class gas sites
- Ventures are OP
- Ultimate faggots build caps in there (if you have a cap why not C5's?)
- Isk / hour is terrible considering you need a group to run sleepers
Derath Ellecon
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#14 - 2013-03-12 00:42:12 UTC
Oxandrolone wrote:
Only an idiot would live in a C4 heres why:


Spoken like a true High class WH snob.

Oxandrolone wrote:
- No cap escalations but still require groups to PvE
-Isk / hour is terrible considering you need a group to run sleepers


Easily dual boxed. Which while C3's can technically be solo'd, they are better dual boxing as well. Consistently better isk/hr dual boxing C4's vs C3.

Having run C1 through C4 sites, C4's are on par for sub cap escalated isk/hr. Farming C4's overall has been better isk/hr than C3. Largely because its much easier to roll your C4 static to find a nice empty C4 full of sites to run, than an empty C3 full of sites to run.

Oxandrolone wrote:
- Static masses are horrible, all require multiple orca's


Compared to what? Static mass is equal to everyone in lower class WH's. Whether you live in a C2/C3 or a C4/C3, its exactly the same to roll your static.

Oxandrolone wrote:
- No freighter HS's so pain in the ass without lots of hauling in itty V's or orcas.
- No k-space statics compared to low-class wormholes


I'll give you that, logistics are a PITA.


Oxandrolone wrote:
- Ultimate faggots build caps in there (if you have a cap why not C5's?)


I'll give you that one too. But C4's can be a nice stepping stone for a corp without caps that want to move up the WH chain.
Elli M0o
Doomheim
#15 - 2013-03-12 05:11:16 UTC
Derath Ellecon wrote:


Easily dual boxed. Which while C3's can technically be solo'd, they are better dual boxing as well. Consistently better isk/hr dual boxing C4's vs C3.

Having run C1 through C4 sites, C4's are on par for sub cap escalated isk/hr. Farming C4's overall has been better isk/hr than C3. Largely because its much easier to roll your C4 static to find a nice empty C4 full of sites to run, than an empty C3 full of sites to run.




what ships to dual box a c4 site? marauders? tengus? domis? if possible can u pls link the fits?
Qumar Nuom
Clandestine Services
#16 - 2013-03-12 07:52:12 UTC
Elli M0o wrote:


what ships to dual box a c4 site? marauders? tengus? domis? if possible can u pls link the fits?


If you need to ask this questions you are probably not ready to dual box C4s anyways Roll

There are several possibilities, just be creative (or should I say productive) and check fittings with your favorite fitting tool...
Thats a part of the game isn't it Blink
Adoris Nolen
Sama Guild
#17 - 2013-03-12 08:54:32 UTC
Elli M0o wrote:

what ships to dual box a c4 site? marauders? tengus? domis? if possible can u pls link the fits?



2 tengus speed tanking the bs and out range nuets
Domoso
Planisphere Salvage
#18 - 2013-03-12 13:32:05 UTC  |  Edited by: Domoso
Qumar Nuom wrote:
Elli M0o wrote:


what ships to dual box a c4 site? marauders? tengus? domis? if possible can u pls link the fits?


If you need to ask this questions you are probably not ready to dual box C4s anyways Roll


Would have to agree with this. But, on the other hand, Tengu's are king of PVE, especially remote rep tengus. Try not to use anything uber expensive. I'll just leave this here: vargur

The problem with using most other things than tengus is high skill requirements and you need, usually, more than 2 people. RR domi's can work but without high drone skills it will take a while to run sites. You could also use logistics and widen your available ships for farming but that requires more people which requires more time to form up and can be a pita to do.
Svodola Darkfury
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#19 - 2013-03-12 20:46:37 UTC
Comy 1 wrote:
Derath Ellecon wrote:
Comy 1 wrote:
Svodola Darkfury wrote:
This trend actually began in May or June of 2012. Several Russian alliances started buying up C4 wormholes with C2 or C3 statics, probably for the seclusion, easy C4 sites, and easy solo sites out of their statics.

The money in C4s is actually comparable to any sites you can do without capital escalations (a little over 100 million an hour per pilot, more with more pimped ships, up to about 8 people) and the Russians started to realize this. Made for many months of good hunting in "Russian o'Clock" through our C4 static. It's still abysmal hunting in the US timezone.

Svo.


Got to say that over 100mil/h in a C4 is not really bad, but if that is all you get running cap escalations you are either doing something terribly wrong, or use WAY too many pilots to do it.



She very clearly stated WITHOUT capital escalations...

Just sayin.


You are totally right, I should not post tired.


haha, no worries, I got a laugh out of it. Yeah, C5 escalations are worlds away better than anything you can do in any lower wormhole classes. C4s are great for small groups starting out, but that's not really what the OP was talking about :)

Svo.

Director of Frozen Corpse Industries.
Resilan Bearcat
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#20 - 2013-03-12 21:26:56 UTC
Domoso wrote:

...snip
Would have to agree with this. But, on the other hand, Tengu's are king of PVE, especially remote rep tengus. Try not to use anything uber expensive. I'll just leave this here: vargur



LIES~

You should always bling out your mission running ships. It increases your ISK/hour potential and looks better on my killboard and makes for a much more interesting story than the ho-hom I ganked another site runner w/ t2 crap. Pirate
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