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Russian Roulette - CCP vs. Goonswarm
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Jenshae Chiroptera
#121 - 2011-10-28 17:56:28 UTC
"The best predictor of future behaviour is past endeavours."

Expect the worst from Goons. I agree with "Scorched Earth" and I probably would have put a God mode corp of developers in null sec just to blow Goons away. It could only benefit the game as a whole.

CCP - Building ant hills and magnifying glasses for fat kids

Not even once

EVE is becoming shallow and puerile; it will satisfy neither the veteran nor the "WoW" type crowd in the transition.
Barbara Nichole
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#122 - 2011-10-28 17:57:55 UTC
Ladie Harlot wrote:
Poetic Stanziel wrote:
No one is suggesting that CONCORD be removed.

I am. I hate when I'm trying to help some clueless player quit mining by blowing up his mining ship and concord swoops in and blows me up for no reason.



he's blowing you up to save his life.. because he is not vaccinated against the mumps.

  - remove the cloaked from local; free intel is the real problem, not  "afk" cloaking -

[IMG]http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a208/DawnFrostbringer/consultsig.jpg[/IMG]
Teamosil
Good Time Family Band Solution
#123 - 2011-10-28 18:10:49 UTC
There are economic realities at play here. Ultimately, if CCP concludes that suicide ganking is costing them too many new players, they'll nerf it. And there is nothing wrong with that. Having a growing player base is in all of our interests. More players means more devs means more content. It isn't like adding on hi-sec only carebears hurts the rest of us. It doesn't affect us directly really, but if it means CCP can afford to make more cool content, that helps us. It's a balancing that CCP needs to do. If they can get more existing players to engage more intensively with the game by making hi sec less hospitable without losing a lot of them, that would be great. But, at the same time, if they just end up making players unsub by making hi sec less hospitable, then that hurts all of us. I don't claim to know which path they should follow, but there is definitely a lot more to it than the whole "EvE is supposed to be like X, so everybody needs to be made to play like X" line of reasoning.
Nimrod Nemesis
Doomheim
#124 - 2011-10-28 18:18:03 UTC
Hahaha, lookat this bitter Mittani envy from the OP.
Rage Cloud
Machete Diplomacy
#125 - 2011-10-28 18:20:36 UTC
There will come a time, when GoonScum will fall.
GoonScum is the worst alliance and or corp in Eve in my mind.
Scam after scam after scam.
I was in a corp that were blue to the GoonScum and had the oppourtinity to part take in some of their operations fighting PL and friends. Let me say this, there is no doubt in my mind that all the players in GoonScum are just loosers in real life. They have been degraded in real life and have found EVE to take their anger out. I have had the pleasure of listening to people just discuss how they scammed this newbie or that newbie. It was really embarrassing to be associated with these people.
The make Eve not fun. It is simple as that...I think CCP needs to take some action against this corp. Start by taking out Bitchitani off the board.
Krios Ahzek
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#126 - 2011-10-28 18:22:29 UTC
Rage Cloud wrote:
There will come a time, when GoonScum will fall.
GoonScum is the worst alliance and or corp in Eve in my mind.
Scam after scam after scam.
I was in a corp that were blue to the GoonScum and had the oppourtinity to part take in some of their operations fighting PL and friends. Let me say this, there is no doubt in my mind that all the players in GoonScum are just loosers in real life. They have been degraded in real life and have found EVE to take their anger out. I have had the pleasure of listening to people just discuss how they scammed this newbie or that newbie. It was really embarrassing to be associated with these people.
The make Eve not fun. It is simple as that...I think CCP needs to take some action against this corp. Start by taking out Bitchitani off the board.


Saddest attempt at bitchy nicknames ever.

 Though All Men Do Despise Us
Elyssa MacLeod
Doomheim
#127 - 2011-10-28 18:30:31 UTC  |  Edited by: Elyssa MacLeod
reading the first page I saw

Quote:
Hilmar has already suggested that CONCORD needs buffing to curb ganking.


what? bullshit!
Link that please, thats stupid!

Quote:
No word yet on whether this is something CCP is currently working on, but Arnar Hrafn Gylfason (Senior Producer for EVE Online) readily agreed with Hilmar.


Link this too please. The higher ups planning on softening EVE is not something good for this game and I for one want proof

Quote:

I'm beginning to think that The Mittani's agenda is scorched earth. That he decided sometime in August that he was leaving EVE Online after his CSM term was complete, but that before he left, he was going to leave EVE in such a state, that he would feel absolutely no compulsion to return.


You say this like its a secret that Goons are out to destroy the game...
They wont police the game unless its another CSM member or they mine ice (hey isnt abusing petitions a offense too?)
Quote:
Mittani: Basically all ice miners are bots. Report them after you kill them! This way, not only do you kill them, you get them temp-banned!

GM Homonoia: Suicide ganks are a valid and viable tactic in EVE.

Where is your God now carebear?
Baaldor
Pandemic Horde Inc.
Pandemic Horde
#128 - 2011-10-28 18:34:29 UTC
Rage Cloud wrote:
I was in a corp that were blue to the GoonScum


Oh really?




Teamosil
Good Time Family Band Solution
#129 - 2011-10-28 18:36:27 UTC  |  Edited by: Teamosil
Rage Cloud wrote:
there is no doubt in my mind that all the players in GoonScum are just loosers in real life.


Wait a minute... Are you saying that some people who play a video game 16 hours a day, 7 days a week are not international sex symbols living in 20 million dollar manshions with super models lining up just in the hopes of getting their pictures taken with them by the paparazzi in real life? No... I don't believe your lies! Next you're going to try to tell me that some football players aren't good at math.
Elyssa MacLeod
Doomheim
#130 - 2011-10-28 18:39:06 UTC
Plus, I was looking at the forum rules for ***** an giggles and this is the list of offenses so far in the first post alone:

um lets see
Rule 18 violation - no advertisements
She's advertising her blog (with links provided)
(eh that one's kinda shaky lol)
oh definate rule number 5 "ranting prohibited" violation
DEFINATELY trolling Goons so rule #7 violated
Due to the rule 5 violation, this is not constructive so Rule #20 violation

GM Homonoia: Suicide ganks are a valid and viable tactic in EVE.

Where is your God now carebear?
Baaldor
Pandemic Horde Inc.
Pandemic Horde
#131 - 2011-10-28 18:50:40 UTC
Elyssa MacLeod wrote:
Plus, I was looking at the forum rules for ***** an giggles and this is the list of offenses so far in the first post alone:

um lets see
Rule 18 violation - no advertisements
She's advertising her blog (with links provided)
(eh that one's kinda shaky lol)
oh definate rule number 5 "ranting prohibited" violation
DEFINATELY trolling Goons so rule #7 violated
Due to the rule 5 violation, this is not constructive so Rule #20 violation


Based on the above, that should pretty much **** can this entire forum.
Karn Dulake
Doomheim
#132 - 2011-10-28 18:56:21 UTC
I love the Goons as they give the rest of EVE something to laugh at

have you ever seen any of them speak at fanfest they are always overweight and look like they are in desperate need of the Asthma inhaler


+1 to the goons everytime. If you are invisible to the rest of society at least you can be important in a computer game
I dont normally troll, but when i do i do it on General Discussion.
Poetic Stanziel
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#133 - 2011-10-28 19:00:11 UTC  |  Edited by: Poetic Stanziel
Rage Cloud wrote:
There will come a time, when GoonScum will fall.
GoonScum is the worst alliance and or corp in Eve in my mind.
Scam after scam after scam.

I'm not looking for them to fail. Not looking for them to stop scamming. Not looking for them to stop ganking. Goonswarm adds a lot of flavour to the game, and since it is the players that are responsible for adding the flavour, kudos to Goonswarm.

I'm just suggesting, that with recent comments and actions by folks in power at CCP, who seem interested in making highsec more risk-free, that this Gallente Ice Interdiction, at this point in time, could force CCP to move on some highsec changes sooner, rather than them giving it a good think and ponder first.
Poetic Stanziel
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#134 - 2011-10-28 19:12:04 UTC
Elyssa MacLeod wrote:
reading the first page I saw

Quote:
Hilmar has already suggested that CONCORD needs buffing to curb ganking.


what? bullshit!
Link that please, thats stupid!


https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=269835#post269835
Baaldor
Pandemic Horde Inc.
Pandemic Horde
#135 - 2011-10-28 19:16:00 UTC
Karn Dulake wrote:
I love the Goons as they give the rest of EVE something to laugh at

have you ever seen any of them speak at fanfest they are always overweight and look like they are in desperate need of the Asthma inhaler


+1 to the goons everytime. If you are invisible to the rest of society at least you can be important in a computer game


Wait, Remedial is back?
Hans Jagerblitzen
Ice Fire Warriors
#136 - 2011-10-28 19:31:22 UTC
Kinis Deren wrote:
Hmmm, yes I'm a noob, but to be honest, I feel the OP is reading far too much into current events involving CCP, the CSM, Hi Sec and the sandbox. I guess it makes for a great conspiracy theory and potential blog visits - all that is missing is the obligatory doomsday date prediction.Blink

Isn't the whole concept of the sandbox based upon the fact that players can adjust tactics in response to the tactics of others? Game play will evolve in a similar style to a biological arms race. New players, like me, will either learn passively and suffer the consequences, or will take an active approach to learn much needed survival skills. If we accpet all this, why would the Goon's current campaign be any different to anything else the game has previously faced?



Seriously, how is that this self-proclaimed noob understands more about EvE than most of the veterans complaining in this thread? This guy will go far in the game. He has the perfect attitude right out of the starting gate.

Why is that so many players refuse to adapt?

Why is that so many players feel they should have immunity to danger?

EvE is fundamentally built on the principle that space is dangerous, no matter where you are. The mechanics were designed to allow highsec ganking, and only to punish the offender after the fact, not removing any risk element from highsec completely.

Eve is fundamentally built on the principle that there is no limit to the power and resources one can amass and implement, and hands the keys over to the players to drive the fate of New Eden. Mittani is not the harbinger of EvE's doom - he was an inevitability from the beginning. If it wasn't him, it would be someone else. He may be rude in personality, or a bigot who likes to call everyone gays and fags, but when it comes to gameplay, he is operating completely within the parameters of EvE's game design.

Everyone here signed up to play a game that was at its core about a race to power - not an egalitarian society where wealth is distributed, everyone can have every ship, and everyone is free to play their own way without interruption or harassment. Did nobody pay attention to the introductory video that plays when you install the game for the first time?

The angry highsec playerbase, armed with the ability to withhold money from CCP and clog the forums with the same repeated threads, may be finally changing Hilmar's and Zulu's minds about how safe Highsec needs to be to make everyone happy and placated.

But do not be fooled - if highsec becomes immune to danger, as those in here are clearly advocating, it will be YOU that has fundamentally destroyed the premise upon which EvE was orginally constructed. Trying to call out Mittani for bending the rules to his liking is a sad misdirection from the real underlying issue - many players can't handle the fact that you can be blown up anywhere, anytime, and want to transform a portion of the game into a clone of many other MMO's out there, where you must ask permission to harm another player in any way.

Even brand new pilots can see right through this sham of a crusade. They came here for the danger, the risk, the reward, the meaningful deaths. You all did too - and couldn't handle it, couldn't handle having less power and control than other players, and now want to be able to mine, mission, and trade in a vision of highsec that was never meant to be.

CPM0 Chairman / CSM7 Vice Secretary
Hans Jagerblitzen
Ice Fire Warriors
#137 - 2011-10-28 19:32:01 UTC
Kinis Deren wrote:
Hmmm, yes I'm a noob, but to be honest, I feel the OP is reading far too much into current events involving CCP, the CSM, Hi Sec and the sandbox. I guess it makes for a great conspiracy theory and potential blog visits - all that is missing is the obligatory doomsday date prediction.Blink

Isn't the whole concept of the sandbox based upon the fact that players can adjust tactics in response to the tactics of others? Game play will evolve in a similar style to a biological arms race. New players, like me, will either learn passively and suffer the consequences, or will take an active approach to learn much needed survival skills. If we accpet all this, why would the Goon's current campaign be any different to anything else the game has previously faced?



Seriously, how is that this self-proclaimed noob understands more about EvE than most of the veterans complaining in this thread? This guy will go far in the game. He has the perfect attitude right out of the starting gate.

Why is that so many players refuse to adapt?

Why is that so many players feel they should have immunity to danger?

EvE is fundamentally built on the principle that space is dangerous, no matter where you are. The mechanics were designed to allow highsec ganking, and only to punish the offender after the fact, not removing any risk element from highsec completely.

Eve is fundamentally built on the principle that there is no limit to the power and resources one can amass and implement, and hands the keys over to the players to drive the fate of New Eden. Mittani is not the harbinger of EvE's doom - he was an inevitability from the beginning. If it wasn't him, it would be someone else. He may be rude in personality, or a bigot who likes to call everyone gays and fags, but when it comes to gameplay, he is operating completely within the parameters of EvE's game design.

Everyone here signed up to play a game that was at its core about a race to power - not an egalitarian society where wealth is distributed, everyone can have every ship, and everyone is free to play their own way without interruption or harassment. Did nobody pay attention to the introductory video that plays when you install the game for the first time?

The angry highsec playerbase, armed with the ability to withhold money from CCP and clog the forums with the same repeated threads, may be finally changing Hilmar's and Zulu's minds about how safe Highsec needs to be to make everyone happy and placated.

But do not be fooled - if highsec becomes immune to danger, as those in here are clearly advocating, it will be YOU that has fundamentally destroyed the premise upon which EvE was orginally constructed. Trying to call out Mittani for bending the rules to his liking is a sad misdirection from the real underlying issue - many players can't handle the fact that you can be blown up anywhere, anytime, and want to transform a portion of the game into a clone of many other MMO's out there, where you must ask permission to harm another player in any way.

Even brand new pilots can see right through this sham of a crusade. They came here for the danger, the risk, the reward, the meaningful deaths. You all did too - and couldn't handle it, couldn't handle having less power and control than other players, and now want to be able to mine, mission, and trade in a vision of highsec that was never meant to be.

CPM0 Chairman / CSM7 Vice Secretary
Minta Contha
Emergent Entity
#138 - 2011-10-28 19:37:11 UTC
OK, although I live mostly in a wormhole, when I'm in Highsec I behave pretty much like a carebear. I mine, I fly missions, I never shoot at anyone, and I get pissed off if I'm ganked.
But... I don't want that risk taken away. Sure, a gank is annoying, but the risk of it forces you to be smart, change your tactics, gives Eve the edge that keeps the adrenaline going even through tedious activities like ice-mining.
Yes, the Goon ganks are annoying. But FFS, people can learn to work round them. Bring armed escorts when you mine ice!
I have never ganked anyone in my life, and have several times been the victim, but I don't want hisec to become a zone of invulnerability. I think many of even the staunchest carebears will agree with me. I think (and I hope) that Hilmar is wise enough to understand that.

NB this does not mean if you see me in Highsec I automatically want to be shot at. Just so you know ;)

My cooking is like my lovemaking - fast, greasy, and unsatisfying.
Trainwreck McGee
Doomheim
#139 - 2011-10-28 19:38:05 UTC
This was garbage. I cant believe i read it all.

Why is it not possible that Goons are just doing this b/c they are bored and so they are RP'ing that they can only get sustenance from miner tears?

CCP Trainwreck - Weekend Custodial Engineer / CCP Necrogoats foot stool
Baaldor
Pandemic Horde Inc.
Pandemic Horde
#140 - 2011-10-28 19:41:09 UTC
Trainwreck McGee wrote:
This was garbage. I cant believe i read it all.

Why is it not possible that Goons are just doing this b/c they are bored and so they are RP'ing that they can only get sustenance from miner tears?



Because they don't get Goons.