Science & Industry

If you have two accounts get a covetor and a retriever.

Mine with both to fill the retriever as the hauler.

Use anchored secure cans in low high sec... or get a second account and fly a hauling orca.. or buy a retriever or mack and make trips to the station as the hold fills.. Jet Canning is the major reason can theft still happens.

If they steal from your can they get GCC flagged.

If they are GCC flagged you, or I believe with the new crime watch anyone else, are free to attack them without concord defending them. However if you do attack first after they get the GCC flag, then they are free to attack you without concord stepping in at all.

If you just ignore them they will stay flashy to you for I think 15 minutes, but they can not attack you without concord blasting them, unless you attack first.

this used to be called can flipping. And the idea was to go out an flip cans in a T1 frig, then if you attack them think oh it is just a frig, I can take him. They then warp off and switch to a T3 cruiser or other high power PVP ship and return to blow you away. Once you attack them, even if they are GCC flagged, they are free to attack back.

If you happen to find a quite system where you can jetcan mine without getting disturbed, another option is to use the new freight cans instead of a jetcan. Drop it off with your itty 5 and you can mine away filling it. The advantage of a freight can is it will not despawn after 1-2 hours like a jetcan will. they stay until someone shoots them. Also they can hold up to 250,000m3 depending on which freight can you use.

The disadvantage is they can not be locked, so are no more secure than a jetcan. you can drop one in a belt and continue mining until you fill a 250,000m3 can, And return later with your itty 5 to make several trips emptying it, or a single trip with a freighter. However anyone can steal from it, and it can be destroyed very easily.

Either destroying the can, or stealing from it will result in a GCC flag, but unless you are an urber PVPer you would be stupid to attack as they most likely do not care about the ore, but are just looking for an easy kill.

Use 2 retrievers. A covetor makes a little bit more yield/hour then a retriever but makes less isk/hour because of the retrivers large cargohold, and less time spent hauling. Your goal should be to have both characters setup in retrievers and just mine to station since they will have comparable cargo hold space to most industrials.

Also train one of your miners to miner foremen V, and set this character as your fleet booster, this will give you 10% more yield per hour.




This is old information from the days of Hulks having huge m3/hour yields over the other mining ships. These days the difference in yield/hour is minor, and covetors,hulks, procurer, skiffs are mainly only useful in mining ops. With solo mining (no Orca) mackinaws and retrivers will make you more isk/hour. So don't bother with jet canning, just use ships with the bigger cargo holds.




As I said above, using the mining ships with bigger cargoholds and just mine to station. Unless you have an orca you will not see any gains jet canning and mining per hour over just mining to station.



Use the dotlan website. Look for low activity systems, away from trade hubs / trade lines. Dead end systems are best since you don't get any traffic and it is easier to watchout for gankers, other wise systems with low activty (systems that have 2 or more stargates, but are not heavily used because traffic passes though another near by system). On dotlan you can see the activity of the system, number of belts, ship losses, etc. I would suggest fly around (in a fast ship) and check out the belts before hand. Find a system that dosen't activly have miners in it (if you visit a belt and there are roids you might be in luck) , little to no ship losses, and low traffic passing though.

And yes to find really good systems takes time, effort and chances are you'll in a system far away from trade hubs, which is what you want.

Hi,

I've cleaned this thread up.

If you guys want to have a personal argument about this then take it in-game; please stop detailing other peoples threads.

Thanks.

i disagree. the gap between an exhumer and a mining barge is far too small to justify the difference in price. that, however, is obviously subjective. looking at the figures though, they imply the majority of people agree.

i agree about ganking, the chance of being ganked is laughably low. still, the reason my alt won't sit in a mackinaw is that i can't justify purchasing one, it may sit in a hulk once i have exhumers V, or maybe IV, but for the time being there are other skills i'd like to finish training. it's not that all exhumers aren't worth the price tag, it's mainly that the mackinaw isn't worth the price tag, however since it's somewhat apparent that the "big ore bay ship" is simply the king of mining, exhumers may as well be synonymous with the mackinaw.

freighters simply are not an efficient use of a pilot, unless he can not fly a mining ship. due to an orca being cheaper, and faster it's easily a superior choice for hauling from the belt to the station, along with the fact that by the time you come to the point where one orca is unable to keep up with the volume being mined you have more than likely already exceeded the point where you can stay in a belt long enough to make use of a freighter anyway. i did explain this, in more detail, in a thread in general discussion shortly after it was announced.

and one orca can empty another orca in under 4 cycles, therefore again, freighter is overkill.
a 2nd orca is cheaper, faster, etc.

i guess you've never dropped a log on an airplane, without checking if there's ample toilet roll?

1) i don't believe i ever explicitly stated that the hulk wasn't worth it's price tag. the skiff and mack aren't (skiff because it's just a useless ship, mack because well we've already been over that) that's 2 vs 1, that's a majority so i was being lazy and just said "exhumers" because generally, it's true. in addition, we're seeing an obvious shift to "mack/ret or gtfo" when it comes to mining, especially in high sec, around 2/3 of all ore mined in high sec seems to be done by a mack or a ret. (if memory serves)

2) because i trained it pre barge changes when the hulk was pretty much the only worth while mining ship. if i was a new player, would i train it again? to level 4 maybe, to level 5 perhaps not. at least, not until i had more sp and was running out of other mining related skills. depends how often i found myself in a non-afk fleet.

3) i was talking about my new alt, not me. that account hasn't finished training all of the t2 crystals i'd like yet. given that they're a 16% yield increase vs 1% for a single rank of exhumer... yeah, there are more important skills to train.

4) i assume that whether i do or not, has any bearing on the fact that a second orca is more than adequate to haul for a mining fleet? mainly because it's superior in every way except cargo capacity, which is irrelevant since by the time the dedicated hauling orca is hauling slower than you're mining you'll be stripping belts so fast that it's irrelevant.

1) i didn't ignore that fact. it wasn't even up for discussion. also, if you're serious about making money with mining you'll be in a hulk.

2) i know it was worth training to 4, i did so, did you not read what i wrote? however, the fact remains that currently, unless you're flying a hulk exhumer V really is NOT worth the time, training it to IV is worth it, but isn't a high priority.
the comment about logging off afk players was sarcasm, because it was a stupid idea but never mind...

3) no, i clearly stated i was talking about my alt from the start. you're really not reading what i write are you? not reading posts is making you look stupid, so far.

4) yes, i mine in a 0.7 system. i don't mine in it because it's 0.7 that's just how it ended up. "very good mining systems" is a stupid statement. once again, 0.7 systems contain all high sec ore types, also there are other considerations to what makes a good mining system other than it's security status.
if by "hauling with an orca is more work than a freighter" you mean it has less cargo space, what's your point? you make 3x the amount of warps, but with a shorter align time, utility modules, a cheaper ship, all the utility that comes with an orca itself (spare ships in the bay, etc) the only bonus a freighter has is the ore space. in addition the orca pilot is guaranteed to be able to fly a mining ship if the fleet is small for some reason and therefore isn't simply dead weight in the fleet just idling and producing nothing.

also i appreciate the irony of you ignoring me after saying i ignore facts. points 2 and 3 make it even more ironic.