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Crime & Punishment

 
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Can this type of behaviour warrent a ban?
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Darth Bri
Maniaci Dello Spazio
#21 - 2013-03-02 22:02:21 UTC
Anya Klibor wrote:
Darth Bri wrote:
Everything was good until he reported someone for IRL threats.


Damn rat.


Aren't IRL threats funny to anyone else besides me?


There's levels and limits.

When someone threatened to report me to the FBI for cyberterrorism because we found his alt corporation and dec'd it, we all laughed.

When a WT CEO threatened to **** my CEO's 15-month-old daughter, we took it seriously because they had originally been friends, and the WT was mentally unstable enough that we took it seriously. He knew where my CEO lived, after all.

You can insult me all you want. I don't care. But when you insult my significant other or children or whatever because you take this game way too seriously and do not like being outplayed by me, then we'll play games. I have no problems griefing bads.

OP: You need to understand that like it or not, you're a PvPer. You may not be good at it, but with the interaction that occurs in this game, the fat you can lose your ship anywhere when you undock is PvP. Sucks, doesn't it?


So.... Your response to someone threatening your children in a game is to get that person banned from said game?

Wouldn't that be furling the fire?
Vimsy Vortis
Shoulda Checked Local
Break-A-Wish Foundation
#22 - 2013-03-02 22:08:36 UTC  |  Edited by: Vimsy Vortis
Darth Bri wrote:
Everything was good until he reported someone for IRL threats.


Damn rat.


Aren't IRL threats funny to anyone else besides me?

Correction, everything was okay until someone made real life threats. At no point in your daily life is it okay for you to threaten people with violence, why would you think it's okay to do it via a computer game?
Psychotic Monk
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#23 - 2013-03-03 01:27:24 UTC
Zedrik Cayne wrote:
There is one brand of play that I've never played in, and that is the awox. There is no defence for it if initiated by a sufficiently motivated attacker.

There are no 'tools' that anyone could come up with short of complete immersion breaking stuff. (List of characters that log in from the same machine or IP address anyone?)

Folks who run the big lottery sites have before connected alts together by IP. But joe average will not be able to. And CCP providing the information is highly unlikely.

I suppose you could remove the 'free fire on corp members' and require limited engagements.

HEY! That sounds like a plan. Someone poke CCP.


There are plenty of ways to stop an awox in its tracks. The real question is why should safaris be made impossible? Why should protection come from CCP when it is well within the reach for the players? Killing this would be killing one of the few ways in which you can interact with someone in highsec in a competitive manner.

This is supposed to be a competitive game, after all.

Belligerent Undesirables Selling Griefer Immunity
Anya Klibor
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#24 - 2013-03-03 04:40:59 UTC
Darth Bri wrote:
Anya Klibor wrote:
Darth Bri wrote:
Everything was good until he reported someone for IRL threats.


Damn rat.


Aren't IRL threats funny to anyone else besides me?


There's levels and limits.

When someone threatened to report me to the FBI for cyberterrorism because we found his alt corporation and dec'd it, we all laughed.

When a WT CEO threatened to **** my CEO's 15-month-old daughter, we took it seriously because they had originally been friends, and the WT was mentally unstable enough that we took it seriously. He knew where my CEO lived, after all.

You can insult me all you want. I don't care. But when you insult my significant other or children or whatever because you take this game way too seriously and do not like being outplayed by me, then we'll play games. I have no problems griefing bads.

OP: You need to understand that like it or not, you're a PvPer. You may not be good at it, but with the interaction that occurs in this game, the fat you can lose your ship anywhere when you undock is PvP. Sucks, doesn't it?


So.... Your response to someone threatening your children in a game is to get that person banned from said game?

Wouldn't that be furling the fire?


Is there any other choice? Should you let him continue to do it thinking there's no consequences?

Leadership is something you learn. Maybe one day, you'll learn that.
Surfin's PlunderBunny
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#25 - 2013-03-03 05:11:25 UTC
Anya Klibor wrote:
Darth Bri wrote:
Anya Klibor wrote:
Darth Bri wrote:
Everything was good until he reported someone for IRL threats.


Damn rat.


Aren't IRL threats funny to anyone else besides me?


There's levels and limits.

When someone threatened to report me to the FBI for cyberterrorism because we found his alt corporation and dec'd it, we all laughed.

When a WT CEO threatened to **** my CEO's 15-month-old daughter, we took it seriously because they had originally been friends, and the WT was mentally unstable enough that we took it seriously. He knew where my CEO lived, after all.

You can insult me all you want. I don't care. But when you insult my significant other or children or whatever because you take this game way too seriously and do not like being outplayed by me, then we'll play games. I have no problems griefing bads.

OP: You need to understand that like it or not, you're a PvPer. You may not be good at it, but with the interaction that occurs in this game, the fat you can lose your ship anywhere when you undock is PvP. Sucks, doesn't it?


So.... Your response to someone threatening your children in a game is to get that person banned from said game?

Wouldn't that be furling the fire?


Is there any other choice? Should you let him continue to do it thinking there's no consequences?


Probably best to call the police... as I wouldn't put anyone at r/l risk over internet spaceships

"Little ginger moron" ~David Hasselhoff 

Want to see what Surf is training or how little isk Surf has?  http://eveboard.com/pilot/Surfin%27s_PlunderBunny
Anya Klibor
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#26 - 2013-03-03 05:39:21 UTC
Our CEO thought it was freaking hilarious.

Leadership is something you learn. Maybe one day, you'll learn that.
Manny Moons
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#27 - 2013-03-03 06:07:02 UTC
I would only add that maybe it's time to read the EULA. Because it sort of sounds like you are condemning allowed behavior and defending forbidden behavior.
Judo Chopped
GET TO DA CHOPPER
#28 - 2013-03-03 09:01:53 UTC  |  Edited by: Judo Chopped
Everything has been said, perhaps except this;
In your original post, you learned from the first incident and actually started doing the correct things.

Yes, your corp right now may look destroyed, but now you get to start a fresh, but this time with experience.
This time, do all the things you are supposed to do (the sheer tonnage of advice in this thread is a good start).

Don't give up, there are many industry corps living the high life right now - the only difference between them and you is that they do all the right things.
Sixx Spades
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#29 - 2013-03-03 16:58:50 UTC
Sounds like the guy that awoxed the OP took home the ultimate prize. Who doesn't enjoy seeing spergy eve-o posts after a job well done? Pirate

Also, it sounds like your friend needs to realize that this is a video game, OP. Internet spaceships aren't worth getting unreasonably disturbed over.

Using a weapon as a deterrent in a diplomatic situation is only viable when you have proven that you have deployed it in the past and are willing to use it in the future.
Emma Royd
Maddled Gommerils
#30 - 2013-03-03 20:03:25 UTC
The reason you can't insta-kick a member in space is quite simple.

You could be at war and in a fight against legitimate war targets and you get insta-kicked out of the corp, thus your war with the player you're shooting at ends and you get concordededed, hence why you need to be either A) Docked or B) Over a Downtime to get kicked out of a corp.

The only way ccp could get around this is deactivate all your modules and insta-warp you out of the area but a proper insta-warp not affected by scrams, bubbles, structures etc.

But that could end in abuse with directors kicking their alts who are getting their ar$e$ handed to them on a plate thus saving their ship, so basically it won't work and shouldn't be altered from what it is now.
Takseen
Federal Defense Union
Gallente Federation
#31 - 2013-03-03 21:23:46 UTC
I remember being quite confused after finding out you can freely engage members of your own corp without Concord intervention. If CCP wanted to remove awoxing, that'd be the easiest way to address it.

There's some interesting difference of opinion in this thread. On the one hand everyone seems to be against RL threats. On the other hand some have suggested only recruiting people or giving importants roles to people "who you can punch in the face in RL" if they screw you over.

And in the overall scheme of things, awoxing feels like a poor man's corp theft. No need to gain people's trust or get access to any special roles, just get the corp invite and you're free to open fire.
deeks87 deacon
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#32 - 2013-03-03 21:31:56 UTC  |  Edited by: deeks87 deacon
Takseen wrote:
I remember being quite confused after finding out you can freely engage members of your own corp without Concord intervention. If CCP wanted to remove awoxing, that'd be the easiest way to address it.

There's some interesting difference of opinion in this thread. On the one hand everyone seems to be against RL threats. On the other hand some have suggested only recruiting people or giving importants roles to people "who you can punch in the face in RL" if they screw you over.

And in the overall scheme of things, awoxing feels like a poor man's corp theft. No need to gain people's trust or get access to any special roles, just get the corp invite and you're free to open fire.



Yeh i agree there does seem to be some people who support this awoxing business and others like me(for obvious reasons disagree with it). Now luckily for us it wasn't a major blow in comparison after doing some research how much other corps have suffered massive blows.There was some incidents that has driven players to actually rage quit the game thus CCP not making more money from said players, i agree that if you play the game you must accept all associated risks that come with it.
However it just don't seem worth it for CCP to potential loose revenue so some one can get a few laughs, any other MMO games i have played anything that can consist of greifing would result in a warring then a ban. just my opinion.

Don't get me wrong if your set up in null then it's a dog eat dog badlands so i would be all for such activities.In my opinion it doesn't seem right that such cowardliness should be allowed in high sec. I'm just glad it has happened when it did cause if those guys rely wanted to endgame us then all he had to do was wait to we had rely expensive ships and gained our trust.

Those who forget the past, are destined to revisit it! use us for all your insurance needs @  http://igc-eve-online-insurance.webs.com
Zedrik Cayne
Standards and Practices
#33 - 2013-03-03 21:35:07 UTC  |  Edited by: Zedrik Cayne
Psychotic Monk wrote:
Zedrik Cayne wrote:
There is one brand of play that I've never played in, and that is the awox. There is no defence for it if initiated by a sufficiently motivated attacker.

There are no 'tools' that anyone could come up with short of complete immersion breaking stuff. (List of characters that log in from the same machine or IP address anyone?)

Folks who run the big lottery sites have before connected alts together by IP. But joe average will not be able to. And CCP providing the information is highly unlikely.

I suppose you could remove the 'free fire on corp members' and require limited engagements.

HEY! That sounds like a plan. Someone poke CCP.


There are plenty of ways to stop an awox in its tracks. The real question is why should safaris be made impossible? Why should protection come from CCP when it is well within the reach for the players? Killing this would be killing one of the few ways in which you can interact with someone in highsec in a competitive manner.

This is supposed to be a competitive game, after all.


Oh, so everyone needs to have ECM fit or fly a set of ECM drones? How are you 'competing' with the folks you awox? Don't pretend that it is some competitive drive except the competition between you and your compatriots as to who can extract the biggest tears.

With limited aggression on tap, the free fire on corpmates has outlived its usefulness. Seeing as the only use for the mechanic now is safari work. It should probably be abolished.

I honestly feel like I just read fifty shades of dumb. --CCP Falcon
deeks87 deacon
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#34 - 2013-03-03 21:44:50 UTC
I'm sure it will never be abolished( in high sec at least) until it starts to effect CCP's wallet IRL:) IE Ragequits.
I actual listened to a TS3 recording of this guy getting awoxed the other night and he lost something like 4or 5b , he was actually crying and sounded like he was going to go hang himself just because some awoxer wanted a laugh.

Those who forget the past, are destined to revisit it! use us for all your insurance needs @  http://igc-eve-online-insurance.webs.com
Agent Trask
Doomheim
#35 - 2013-03-03 23:26:29 UTC
deeks87 deacon wrote:
Yeh, i was working on getting some pvp pilots. My corp was only a few days old, the very least CCP should do to help with these attacks is make it possible to kick corp members instantly no matter where there ship is.


I assume you did not have a mining permit from James 315 paid for. Pure carebear miners are a lower form of life in EvE, and should be encouraged to turn to honorable ganking and PvP.

Therefor you deserved to be asploded, and would continue to be asploded as long as you remained in corp.


Your Awoxer will have undoubtedly remained logged in and cloaked at a safe spot whenever he needed to sleep, in order to prevent you from using unfair corporation mechanics to remove him from the corp.

The proper procedure in this case is to pay for mining permits for all of your corpmates, and to politely ask your Awoxer to leave. I suggest showering him with medals and ISK. If that doesn't work, you will have to all drop corp, and leave him with sole ownership of your corp as a trophy to his bravery.

Join the New Order, buy your permit today, and follow the code.

www.minerbumping.com
Vaju Enki
Secular Wisdom
#36 - 2013-03-03 23:32:47 UTC
This is what EvE is all about, emergent gameplay.

People that don't enjoy sandbox mmo-rpg's, shouldn't play them.

The Tears Must Flow
Agent Trask
Doomheim
#37 - 2013-03-03 23:36:36 UTC
Silus Morde wrote:
[quote=Darth Bri] I just tell them to meet me at Dennys near where I live and put up or shut up. No one has shown up yet Sad.


Bannable offense there. You've been lucky so far.

Join the New Order, buy your permit today, and follow the code.

www.minerbumping.com
Vaju Enki
Secular Wisdom
#38 - 2013-03-03 23:37:15 UTC
Zedrik Cayne wrote:
Psychotic Monk wrote:
Zedrik Cayne wrote:
There is one brand of play that I've never played in, and that is the awox. There is no defence for it if initiated by a sufficiently motivated attacker.

There are no 'tools' that anyone could come up with short of complete immersion breaking stuff. (List of characters that log in from the same machine or IP address anyone?)

Folks who run the big lottery sites have before connected alts together by IP. But joe average will not be able to. And CCP providing the information is highly unlikely.

I suppose you could remove the 'free fire on corp members' and require limited engagements.

HEY! That sounds like a plan. Someone poke CCP.


There are plenty of ways to stop an awox in its tracks. The real question is why should safaris be made impossible? Why should protection come from CCP when it is well within the reach for the players? Killing this would be killing one of the few ways in which you can interact with someone in highsec in a competitive manner.

This is supposed to be a competitive game, after all.


Oh, so everyone needs to have ECM fit or fly a set of ECM drones? How are you 'competing' with the folks you awox? Don't pretend that it is some competitive drive except the competition between you and your compatriots as to who can extract the biggest tears.

With limited aggression on tap, the free fire on corpmates has outlived its usefulness. Seeing as the only use for the mechanic now is safari work. It should probably be abolished.


Let's remove corporation infiltration from the sandbox just because some themepark mindset player doesn't like it.

The Tears Must Flow
deeks87 deacon
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#39 - 2013-03-03 23:47:30 UTC  |  Edited by: deeks87 deacon
OK, lets talk hypothetical for a minute. Lets say i was some rich kid with nothing to do and i wanted to ruin the game for a lot of new players, i would simply go around with a ton of alts and destroy every new corp i could get into. i would continue this behavior until those players rage quited the game. and then CCP would be forced to fix this.I'm not saying remove the ability for corporate espionage I'm just saying there should be measures in place to stop new guys like myself from getting this done to them.

There is a thin line between actually playing the game for fun and deliberately setting out to destroy it for others. Now I'm personal y not bothered by this i have learned from it and accepted it but I'm sure there is a lot more people who don't and leave the game.

Those who forget the past, are destined to revisit it! use us for all your insurance needs @  http://igc-eve-online-insurance.webs.com
Agent Trask
Doomheim
#40 - 2013-03-03 23:47:58 UTC  |  Edited by: Agent Trask
deeks87 deacon wrote:
I'm sure it will never be abolished( in high sec at least) until it starts to effect CCP's wallet IRL:) IE Ragequits.
I actual listened to a TS3 recording of this guy getting awoxed the other night and he lost something like 4or 5b , he was actually crying and sounded like he was going to go hang himself just because some awoxer wanted a laugh.


So we should turn highsec into a Hello Kitty themepark because some unstable person is literally crying over game pixels he can replace by purchasing about US$100 worth of PLEX from CCP?

Perhaps he needs to play some other game? Needs to very very badly?

Join the New Order, buy your permit today, and follow the code.

www.minerbumping.com