Player Features and Ideas Discussion

This thread should be posted in the Missions and Complexes topic.
https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=topics&f=248

My general feeling is that this game would be more interesting if there was either some sort of conflict, or a good deal of organization need to get to the best income. So you CAN stay in highsec to make isk, but just running boring, old, soloable, easy missions won't get you nearly as much income as fighting for resources or building a great production chain with ten other people from the ground up. Get my drift? Carebears can still have income, just not nearly as much as people willing to fight for the bounties of dangerous space, or the great industrial leader organizing a whole corp.

PS- If level 4s are the only reason to play EVE of a person, then I'll be baffled. Missions are by design boring.

Yeah. I'm not refuting the logic but lowsec/0.0 is underpopulated because of several reasons OTHER than the quantity/quality of missions.

The type of person that does missions all day (rightly or wrongly) is also not the type of person to head to lowsec/0.0 to make their coin.

You must keep in mind that 0.0 and L5's in lowsec are much more profitable than L4's, so using your logic, why haven't they moved? It's not the isk, it's the safety.

Same reason why PvP'ers stay in highsec. Mitigation of risk.

The Apostle > You must keep in mind that 0.0 and L5's in lowsec are much more profitable than L4's

Level 5s maybe, but 0.0?

I'm still feeling that 4s are way overpowered. Overpowered enough to make dangerous ventures not worth it. Fives may reward more, I don't really have much to say on that.

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EDIT : I just realized the question wasn't aimed at me , I'll leave my answer anyways


I play for fun I don't really fell like QQ'n much, right now I just have access to the forums and not my client , so I though I'd share something on my mind. To answer your question more completely, I enjoy small gang lowsec pvp alot and I margin trade for ISK

It doesn't take a "whether" man to tell which way the wind blows. Do level 5s.

What you're running up against is, I think, the following problem:-

EVE is the best-made space game out there.

Lots of people who want to play a space game aren't very interested in PvP.

The number of people who are interested in MMORPG-style PvP isn't very much, probably not enough to sustain a whole MMO (of course MMORPG style PvP is very different from other kinds of PvP - it requires time, it's based on who has more sp/better numbers on their side, rather than twitch skill - that' why you get perennial whining on these boards from people who want to cut out the time element and make EVE an instant-action PvP game in which anyone can fly really powerful stuff from the get-go). Or, if there are enough PvP-ers to sustain an MMO, they're not likely to stick with it - they'll move onto the next available game once they master the challenges.

So EVE actually has to cater to a whole bunch of PvE-ers - in fact, it's probably the PvE-ers who are paying most of the subs. These are PvE-ers who have accepted the devil's bargain of EVE - you can have your PvE, so long as you are prepared to occasionally lose stuff to the antics of silly PvP-ers.

IOW, it's people who want a relaxing bit of trance-inducing PvE at the end of a day's work, who are probably paying most of EVE's subs, and probably also paying for PLEX to play too. They want a decent s-f simulator that's a bit of a challenge to master (for someone playing an hour or two a day), but not too much of a challenge, not "hardcore".

So CCP is unlikely to do anything other than tweak L4s a bit here and there. That they are reasonably lucrative and not too challenging is, I think, by design. That they are by no means the most lucrative thing you can do in EVE is also by design.

I think we got off topic. The argument isn't trying to move people to 0.0 or lowsec. The biggest problem with level 4 missions is that they don't encourage multiplayer interaction in a game driven by multiplayer interaction. I have no problem with there being very lucrative things in highsec and I do not expect people to be forced to move into less safe space. I happen to agree with the OP when he states that the most lucrative things in high sec should take at the very least a minimal amount of teamwork and coordination beyond what currently exists.

As for 0.0 ratting/plexing whatever. I works just like EFT, on paper it sounds wonderful and there's shiny pots of gold everywhere. Realistically for the average null-sec player it is far more difficult. Most systems are **** and the ones that aren't **** are already in heavy use by other players. You can still make a lot of ISK in null no doubt but its not always the ISK printing machine some people make it out to be.

You're absolutely right and it comes back the same ol'. Did the significant shift to highsec occur after the Sanctums nerfs?

The high population in the "good" systems (as you said) took away the isk potential so much so that moving to highsec gave you similar income without the risk - particularly Incursions.

Although, granted, Incursions require solid fleet discipline and multiplayer ethos but the coinage is superb for relatively low risk.

I'm pretty sure CCP have the numbers and the Sanctum nerf may well be reversed if what we're saying has any truth in it.

For mine, L4 missions ain't the problem, they're the result.

Hey man, I don't want Missioners to go to pvp, I am HAPPY if they PvE, I have an issue with the missions being easier than pac man. Let them stay in high sec, we can't pvp all the time, just add some challenge to it.