EVE General Discussion

Get out.

I would agree the tax could be raised to 2%-3.5%, but now your pushing it with 5%. Don't **** with my margins.

there's gonna be austerity measures woot

Taxes, production penalties and buffs, resource availability, etc etc is all pointless if someone feels that all the "work" they just sunk into producing those goods is now gone because their goods are in a pirates hull and their corpse is a meat-popsicle in space.

Unless you can arrange the logistics of getting goods to market without this risk, low/null will never be as attractive compared to high.

Undoubtedly, but at an increased cost. This cost has to overcome whatever change is made in high/low/null and I doubt you can do that with the nature of this game. There will be some who will be reasonable in their charge for protection, but at the end of the day the cost will be pushed along to the consumer.

I for one would be happy to operate out of a lowsec as long as their was incentive to do so, but the problem isn't as cut and dry as raise taxes, nerfing this and buffing that etc. Individuals have different motivations, and whether you want to admit it or not people in general don't want to lose the time they spent gaining isk for whatever purpose by having it pinched.

If I just spent time acquiring resources, to build 100 widgets to make a 45% profit selling said widgets but I lose them all to a Gate camp because someone just felt like blowing me up for a good time, I have a choice to continue to eat losses that will occur through trade routes or operate out of a relatively safer environment. Being a big boy I can handle the occasional loss and strike it up to a risk factor that the game environment allows for. But since we all know trade routes happen that will funnel traders through areas, and that pirates exist that can and will destroy you if its profitable for them (This i can understand its a game dynamic). Add to the equation that Greifers also exist that will blow you up simply because they can, then you have a very dynamic environment that you are trying to control with way to many variables. Someone will be unhappy, CCP has to determine which group will be the most resilient with whatever change they make.

PVP'rs aren't the problem greifers are the problem, they want to destroy it just cause they can not because they achieve anything from podding you other than a laugh at your expense.

And honestly your one of the smarter arguments that Ive seen. In a perfect world it would work that systems were protected by locally hired gangs and the cost of moving into those new trading hubs would be relatively stable, not concord/empire stable but stable enough to justify the cost.

To be honest, and im putting on my flame suit here cause I know its coming, I don't see any of this mattering when someone can sit AFK and just mine/acquire more resources in an asteroid belt on an alt character while having a blast on their main. If you can AFK and still be productive then its no longer a time factor and you really won't care.

The notion that industrialists and Pirates / PVPers won't work together is dumb.

They constantly use each other. The reason you don't believe it happens is because Pirates want targets and they're not working with "you" when they shoot you.

You're just clueless about how a lot of the actual low-null industry "works" behind closed doors.

Some "Pirates" want an image of being intimidating to keep people away. Meanwhile, they're building billions of ISK of industry while you're cluelessly fighting over Jita margins.

If this is the case then localized markets outside of highsec are already with their own benefits and it's a closed door system with no room for unaffiliated individuals to move in anyways. It's really yet another barrier that needs to be overcome and further devalues that 1% difference which is already of questionable worth to begin with.

Big words, little meaning.

Obviously the markets are being used. Closed doors doens't mean that the markets aren't being used. It just means that the ISK flows through other arrangements to hit the market than just the mash of ISK flowing through Jita that drives the economy out there.

Ok, let me put it another way. Your 1% isn't enough to make expanding those markets or opening new ones worthwhile. And the fact that there are relationships in play means more resistance to newcomers. The incentive is still too low.

I live in hisec and this sounds perfectly fair. Furthermore, I'd even propose a tax hike ... but only if certain provisions were added.

First, every NPC corporation has a flat 11% tax rate. This pays for your hisec security, meaning CONCORD. Your NPC corporation cannot be the target of a declaration of war.

Alright, let us first raise this rate to 20%. Now you have a little more incentive to leave, but it is not a cattle prod shoving you out the door, either. Still fair enough I think.

Next we look at Sales Tax and Broker Fees. Yes, lowering one or even both of these in low and null security space makes perfect logical sense. If one is no longer being protected by CONCORD then why should one be paying their subdivision (read: the SCC) the same fees as those who are?

To put it simple, High Security should have full, normal SCC fees. Low Security should be reduced by at least half (gate guns still work, so that is something I suppose). Null Security should pay little or no SCC at all. Now Broker's Fees are another matter, and do not represent any division of CONCORD, so they can be left as is across the board. Sales Tax, however, should definitely get cheaper when one moves away from CONCORD protection.

Ah but the caveat, and this addresses another issue: War Declaration. There have been many people complaing on both sides of the fence on this issue, and I believe a tax overhaul can provide a lore-friendly answer to this problem. Remember that flat 20% tax rate that NPC corporations face? Let us say that 5% of that is actual tax to their company and the other 15% is what they pay for CONCORD protection against war declaration. It still adds up to 20%, of course, and those still in the company will not care to note the difference.

Now create that same option for player corporations. Oh put down your bullhorns and hear me out for a minute. Allow player corporations to purchase that same protection that the NPC companies have but doing so will cost them an additional 15% tax rate on top of their own corporate tax. Meaning that if a player company has a base tax rate of 15% and they want to be protected from war declarations then they can be, but now their tax rate is 30% - and half of it is going to CONCORD.

Thus companies committed to avoiding PvP can do so, but doing so is going to cost them ISK, and the larger the company then the more ISK that is going to be. To avoid abuse the option to activate or deactivate paying for CONCORD protection could only be changed once per year.

Believe it or not, this would actually be a boon to companies that want to place war declarations. Why? Glad you asked, mister mercenary. How many times have you placed a war declaration only to find your target has docked up, gone on vacation, or simply folded up & reformed their company? You wasted all the time, effort and ISK for nothing. Frustrating, was it not? All things considered, would you not have rather just been told "This company is paying for CONCORD protection and cannot be war targeted" and kept you money? You would no longer lose any ISK, time, or tears trying to fight the unwilling. The unwilling would not longer have to play card shuffling games to remain unwilling, either, and being the unwilling would no longer be free, either. It would have a price - a fixed 15% price that they must pay for this privilege of immunity. Less risk comes at a cost of less reward. This is fair, yes?