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Free2Play
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Sir Substance
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#21 - 2011-10-25 05:53:44 UTC
Mara Rinn wrote:
Sir Substance wrote:
I was actually far more concerned about the login server.


Multiple login servers, multiple proxy servers connecting players to the actual Tranqulity cluster. The redundancy is already there. Your concern is misplaced.


When lots of people try to log in at once, the login server appears to put them in a stack rather then a queue. Forgive me for not having 100% confidence in its stability.

The beatings will continue until posting improves. -Magnus Cortex

Official Eve Online changelist: Togglable PvP. - Jordanna Bauer
Julius SurJo
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#22 - 2011-10-25 07:25:37 UTC
Asuka Solo wrote:
I like the idea, but I think it should be implemented in another fashion.

1) Retain the current trail system (14 days or 21) to allow FiS and WiS content. Once the trail account runs out, it is reverted to a WiS only F2P account.

2) F2P accounts will be a more offline focused trail, without FiS. These players will basically have the ability to walk around stations and post on the forums. They should not be allowed to participate in any economical activities, access ships, join corps, trade or influence buy orders or contracts. No skills, no PI, no science or industry of any kind. At most, they can chat with other eve players in channels or wander the halls once Incarna's public areas are put online. By increasing the life of a trial account, but limiting it's capabilities even more, you leave enough room for people to continue experiencing Eve and hopefully sign on.


^this

+1
Terminal Insanity
KarmaFleet
Goonswarm Federation
#23 - 2011-10-26 05:59:32 UTC  |  Edited by: Terminal Insanity
Anshio Tamark wrote:
Taint wrote:
free2play is stupid, and shall newer be

Agreed. Most F2P MMOs I've played have been bad or just trivial, which is the exact opposites of what EVE is.

All bad f2p mmo's were bad not because they were F2P. They were bad because they were bad games.


Nova Fox wrote:
F2P in eve is quite abusable by bots still.

How so? If he is unable to sell anything, unable to create contracts or market orders, and only has access to private chat rooms and /dance command in WiS. How does a bot abuse this? There is no possible way for him to effect the game environment, except through his words. And he would be unable to use those words in Local, or any of the official trade channels.


Taint wrote:
free2play is stupid, and shall newer be

Yeah. And reading is for fags! If you're going to hate on something, at least have a reason. Hopefully a logical, well thought out reason. But you sir, have no reason. Your opinion is based on fear and irrationality. F2P cant be "stupid". It might be bad, but if its implemented good, it can be great for the eve community, by appealing to different types of people, and luring them in front of my guns!


Nezumiiro Noneko wrote:

why would f2p need api access....thye wouldn't be able to train. Want the sp's, want to buy a sub. Eve killed ghost training way back, they aren't bringing it back in any fashion. Ghost training was f2p. Put in your freightter 5, "quit" eve for 2 months
and come back to said freighter 5 skill all trained up for free.

If leaving eve.....get a fresh final update on your evemon/eft before the sub dies. Thes programs don't wipe data. Evemon will warn you it cna't pull api data, but leaves old data in place. I know this well....I have a dead account that gets full evemon functionality except api (which is not needed, the char's record does not change) on a char who if I return to eve full time and go 0.0 I can wake up this char and do a power cap alt train.

And again...how does letting people type /dance for months on end = more subs. Eve is learned playiing it. For example in blockade you learn to not kill the trigger NPC's. usually after you do it the first time nad have 2 waves of ships in the room and you being sensor damped to death and it takes forever to clear out both waves. then if really stupid...you kill hte 2nd waves trigger early and you now have 3 waves in your room. PVP more of the same. I can tell you what to do iwhen you land in bubbles. I will also tell you the first time you land in one you will forget hlaf of what I said to do. I did anyway, read all the bubble tactics, went in prepared (I thought) and acted like a tard my first bubbles since it was sink or swim and and I sank lol. What exacly does typing /dance do to ease player transition to this game for the above?


I never said they would need API access. I was just making the connection that a F2P account would be like having an API key - It would literally allow you to do nothing, except VIEW (in this case, the game world)

Now, letting people dance for free in stations is good, because it places eve into the Free2Play category. Many players will give eve a try because of this fact alone. This would attract many fresh eyes to the eve world, and hopefully some of them subscribe. It would also be an awesome publicity stunt. Eve is an 8 year old game, with graphics that are better then nearly any MMO, turns F2P in a FREE expansion that features awesome graphics, free content, and even free accounts. It would get thousands of new people trying it.

It has nothing to do with training players to play eve wtf? Its simply about bringing new players into eve, and giving old players who's subscriptions have expired a chance to log in and check out the new environment, and interact with all their old friends, permanently. Though, if he wants to fly with his old friends again he's still gonna have to subscribe ^_^ Perhaps one of his corpmates will toss him a PLEX? And suddenly wow, a subscription that wouldn't have been, is re-activated.

--

C'mon all i see is haters raging against f2p and not a single legitimate argument against it. You claim it would ruin the economy or be abused by bots? It cant, because F2P accounts could be restricted in a way that would limit them against this. You say F2P is "Stupid"? well F2P doesn't think, so it cant even be stupid. Yes its not "pew pew internet spaceships", well get over it. Market trading isnt pewpew. Mining isnt pewpew. PI isnt pewpew. There are many aspects of eve that do not involve spaceships. WiS is inevitable (at least i hope!) and F2P is a model that all videogames are going back to (yes i said BACK TO, because BACK in the day, most games were SHAREWARE, this is basically stepping back away from a paid-only model, and giving us our shareware / freeware / donate type software back. This is an awesome thing.

"War declarations are never officially considered griefing and are not a bannable offense, and it has been repeatedly stated by the developers that the possibility for non-consensual PvP is an intended feature." - CCP
Terminal Insanity
KarmaFleet
Goonswarm Federation
#24 - 2011-10-26 06:16:32 UTC
Gevlin wrote:
further thinking about it.... I am not sure F2P will attract more players to eve.

the MMO market is now saturated with F2P options as all the big name MMO's open a F2P option on their Games.
I see people simple flipping from one game to the next just not really investing their time in any direction.

Eve might stand out from the others by the fact there is no real long term no obligation "F2P" option

I disagree. I've been playing TF2 for ages, and since its turned F2P theres been many new players, and the servers are much more full. Sure, many people will try it and never play it again, but for every 100 of those people, maybe 1 actually likes it and stays. Over a year's time? thats hundreds of new subscriptions.

I'm actually downloading Spiral Knights right now, because i've seen it advertized so much in TF2, and because its completely F2P and people seem to play it. I'm gonna give it a shot. =P

I'm only hoping that CCP gives people this same ability, so we keep our internet spaceships alive and well for another 10 years.

I believe F2P can be implemented in a way that it would NOT effect the spaceships or economy at all, and could only serve to benefit EVE

"War declarations are never officially considered griefing and are not a bannable offense, and it has been repeatedly stated by the developers that the possibility for non-consensual PvP is an intended feature." - CCP
Claire Katelo
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#25 - 2011-10-27 19:14:52 UTC
Id never played F2P and only saw it on steam once it had already gone F2P but to be honest TF2 is an awesome game which didnt deserve F2P slapped on it. If id known about the game earlier I would have actually spent money on it. F2P games are awful poor games and TF2 is an exception to the rule.
Taint
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#26 - 2011-10-27 19:19:51 UTC
Well imagine JITA and other trade hubs, how spamed do you think they will get ? and not even to speak off ISK sellers, they are dreaming of this idea.
Asuka Solo
I N E X T R E M I S
Tactical Narcotics Team
#27 - 2011-10-27 19:35:03 UTC
You know... if this idea is going to lobby for offline mode or WiS to become exclusively f2p, then i'd have to reject the concept.

WiS should be the other side of Eve, not some freebie.

Eve is about Capital ships, WiS, Boobs, PI and Isk!
Callic Veratar
#28 - 2011-10-27 20:44:50 UTC
Claire Katelo wrote:
Id never played F2P and only saw it on steam once it had already gone F2P but to be honest TF2 is an awesome game which didnt deserve F2P slapped on it. If id known about the game earlier I would have actually spent money on it. F2P games are awful poor games and TF2 is an exception to the rule.


You make it sound like F2P is a punishment. The difference is a barrier to entry: with no cost to start playing, people are willing to just try it. If they like it they'll stick around.

The problem with the idea of making EVE F2P at the moment is that there is no reasonable way to incorporate F2P and still have the game make money. TF2 works because people can drop a dollar or two (or three or 20) on weapon unlocks. LoL works because you can drop $10 on a new champion or skin NOW instead of playing 100 games.

At the moment, EVE has... a pair of indestructible boots and a space-monocle that some players might buy. Nothing in the plans demonstrates an idea for consumable, non-game breaking products that the average player will want to buy on a regular basis.

There have been discussions of ship skins and cosmetic ammo, but nothing has materialized yet.

EVE may be F2P some day, but that day is not today, and it won't be any time Soon™.
David Xavier
The Capsuleers of Unconscious Thought
#29 - 2011-10-27 21:08:18 UTC  |  Edited by: David Xavier
Well, I have yet to successfully convince any of my friends to play EVE. When I get to the skills and training times and they hear that some of them take months to train in a game with monthly subscription I always get laughed at. Ugh

Point is, no amount of F2P game time will entice people to subscribe when they don't like one of the core aspects of the game.

I don't suffer from insanity.. I enjoy it !
Callic Veratar
#30 - 2011-10-28 16:01:43 UTC
David Xavier wrote:
Well, I have yet to successfully convince any of my friends to play EVE. When I get to the skills and training times and they hear that some of them take months to train in a game with monthly subscription I always get laughed at. Ugh

Point is, no amount of F2P game time will entice people to subscribe when they don't like one of the core aspects of the game.


Why would you use examples like Battleship V to give someone a picture of the game? That's like trying to entice someone into a game by saying "the loading screens in this game take about 5 minutes if something goes wrong."

You can be in a battleship within your couple weeks, if you try.
Terminal Insanity
KarmaFleet
Goonswarm Federation
#31 - 2011-10-30 18:31:23 UTC
with the advent of Dust, the F2P option could (at least the WIS) be ported to Console with Dust it could be presented as a cool interactive community / social environment, kinda like a more advanced alternative to Playstation Home

"War declarations are never officially considered griefing and are not a bannable offense, and it has been repeatedly stated by the developers that the possibility for non-consensual PvP is an intended feature." - CCP
Terminal Insanity
KarmaFleet
Goonswarm Federation
#32 - 2011-11-07 08:48:26 UTC  |  Edited by: Terminal Insanity
Asuka Solo wrote:
You know... if this idea is going to lobby for offline mode or WiS to become exclusively f2p, then i'd have to reject the concept.

WiS should be the other side of Eve, not some freebie.


I could easily see that in the future, being in WiS and everyone, players, NPC's, pets, etc, all vanish. You can walk around and re-design your character, until downtime is over, or you re-gain connection to eve, and everyone re-appears around you =) Inside your ship? A VR Terminal will provide you with a virtual link to your local jumpclone while downtime/disconnect is in effect =P

I cant ever imagine a true 'offline' mode to eve though =P and god i hope they dont waste resources on that.




Claire Katelo wrote:
Id never played F2P and only saw it on steam once it had already gone F2P but to be honest TF2 is an awesome game which didnt deserve F2P slapped on it. If id known about the game earlier I would have actually spent money on it. F2P games are awful poor games and TF2 is an exception to the rule.

There is no rule. Those bad F2P games were bad because they were bad games. They were rushed out the door, and the mechanics are very minimum. I said in an earlier post i was trying Spiral Knights, well i'm definatly not sticking with that game =P But there seems to be many people in there who have stayed. It wasnt my type of game. At least that was some exposure however, and a chance.

The reason most F2P games suck, is that they are designed specifically to be F2P, by small indie developers, usually 1 or 2 developers total, and F2P model lets them push their trash out the door easily.

TF2 worked as F2P because it was dseigned to be a good game on its own, F2P was later added to something that was already great. EVE could do this for sure.

And,

Callic Veratar wrote:
You make it sound like F2P is a punishment. The difference is a barrier to entry: with no cost to start playing, people are willing to just try it. If they like it they'll stick around.

The problem with the idea of making EVE F2P at the moment is that there is no reasonable way to incorporate F2P and still have the game make money. TF2 works because people can drop a dollar or two (or three or 20) on weapon unlocks. LoL works because you can drop $10 on a new champion or skin NOW instead of playing 100 games.

At the moment, EVE has... a pair of indestructible boots and a space-monocle that some players might buy. Nothing in the plans demonstrates an idea for consumable, non-game breaking products that the average player will want to buy on a regular basis.

There have been discussions of ship skins and cosmetic ammo, but nothing has materialized yet.

EVE may be F2P some day, but that day is not today, and it won't be any time Soon™.

I think if they finished WiS they would have most of the hard work towards F2P done. They would just need to start making cool virtual clothes, even start accepting community submissions like they've done with the spaceships, to make this easier on their staff.

The store is lacking for sure, Not much variety yet, and the item prices are a bit wonky to say the least. But all the back-end work is done. All the players, modeling, etc etc is all done, its just a matter of re-texturing some stuff and making new clothing items. I think after WiS is viable, it wouldn't take much work at all for F2P to be implemented. Besides, when was the last feature you saw released in eve, that was completely, fully fleshed out right from the start? =P In eve, everything evolves, Im sure it'll suck at the start, but it will get better in later iterations

"War declarations are never officially considered griefing and are not a bannable offense, and it has been repeatedly stated by the developers that the possibility for non-consensual PvP is an intended feature." - CCP
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