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Missions & Complexes

 
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NPC elite frigate AI vs drones - positively vicious

Author
Sturmwolke
#1 - 2013-02-19 02:40:47 UTC
Yes, I noted the NPC AI changes apathetically. I haven't touched proper missions in a long time. Ran a few L4s in Amarr, there doesn't seem to be any significant difference over the few missions that I'd finished.
The NPCs were slightly aggressive vs drones, but overall there doesn't seem to be much changes ... or so I thought.

Ok, so I ran an Amarr epic arc mission (Cowardly Commander). 3 pockets, in which you'll encounter roughly 18-24 elite frigates in total for those pockets. Dear god! These elite frigates will positively shred your drones to pieces. They'll switch target so quickly with no warning and ding one drone to 1/3rd armor before you could reel them in. Rinse repeat ad-nauseum, I can almost guarantee at least flight of drones going to heaven, bleeding from the paper cuts ... at minimum.

Any turret BS will be massively crippled from the almost endless TD untill the elite frigates are eliminated, so it becomes a chicken and egg situation. You can't kill the frigates with your turrets and your drones can't kill the elite frigates in a timely manner without dying. The only thing that will survive this intact (when you're flying solo) is a Golem with a remote armor repper to repair your drone's armor in the field. Heck, even with the Golem, I had to keep a very close watch on the NPC target switching lest I lose a drone. I had to resort to using torps + 2 painters to assist my drones doing their job. How pathetic is that? Roll

So, CCP, can you dial down the notch a little on those bastards NPC AIs with regard to drones (at least for the epic arcs)?
Pretty please? *large kitten eyes*
Tsukino Stareine
Garoun Investment Bank
Gallente Federation
#2 - 2013-02-19 11:36:01 UTC
or fly something more appropriate to the mission?

Like a HAC?
GazBoi08
x13
Pandemic Horde
#3 - 2013-02-19 11:41:16 UTC
sentry drones are your friends
Oska Rus
Free Ice Cream People
#4 - 2013-02-19 11:44:20 UTC
loki ftw. ;-)
sabre906
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#5 - 2013-02-19 12:23:42 UTC  |  Edited by: sabre906
Tsukino Stareine wrote:
or fly something more appropriate to the mission?

Like a HAC?


Not possible in a Hac. Get a clue before making a fool out of yourself.

I know the mission he's talking about. The raw high tracking dps along with high hp neut towers will shred your hac long before it can kill the scramming frigs.

After the td and drone aggro changes, the best you can do is tengu. Stay at range, prioritize neut towers (it has quite a bit of hp) or tengu will die though. Use bonused kinetic scourage fury/faction scourage, not em missiles on neut. Ideally, you'll kill it before it drains you dry.

Sentry boat is tricky. You'll need micro jump drive, jumping out immediately after warping in before rats are on top of you, snipe the frigs then work on the neuts. Range on neut is unlimited anywhere on grid, so watch cap.
Singira
Heffalumps and Woozles.
#6 - 2013-02-20 17:55:19 UTC  |  Edited by: Singira
But the new AI adds so much excitement and content right?
Now missions are liek totally changed and way more fun than before right?
Sturmwolke
#7 - 2013-02-20 21:26:01 UTC
Depends on the age of the player. High probability, newer players (less than 6mon-1yr typically) may find it challenging or interesting.
To many EVE vets (I dare say), including yours truly, it's an annoying put-off that makes you reluctant to log in and run a few missions for the day between other activities.

The AI changes to drone aggro were implemented mainly to combat afk missioning and the multi-boxing metagame and also possibly to pave way for future code additions under the hood. From my perspective, it was never a content addition but instead a "fix".

With the above said, the epic arc drone aggro (as per OP) was simply too aggressive in switching targets to the detriment of a typical average active play. There's a fine balance between discouraging afk missioning/multi-boxi metagame and alienating the typical playstyles (which existed for years). I won't comment on L4 drone aggros since my sample size was too small.
Abrazzar
Vardaugas Family
#8 - 2013-02-20 21:31:31 UTC
I'm pretty sure they changed the AI packages for the different ships without checking through the missions where and in what quantities they were used. So some missions are harmless, while others totally wreck your ship.
Chainsaw Plankton
FaDoyToy
#9 - 2013-02-21 05:16:39 UTC
Singira wrote:
But the new AI adds so much excitement and content right?
Now missions are liek totally changed and way more fun than before right?


I've been trying to make that point in every single npc ai thread I've seen since people started posting them.... oh well Roll

@ChainsawPlankto on twitter

Sturmwolke
#10 - 2013-02-22 02:54:15 UTC
Update:
Previously it was a Golem. Tried the same mission with a Nightmare, it was .. as expected .. a nightmare. TDed incessantly by multiple ships with barely any window to score any hits. The ewar indicator for TD is too buggy to rely on and often you get ghost TD which will only show on the weapons mouseover. CCP should already be aware of this from the TD thread.

Had MJD option in mind, except it ran into fitting issues. The sacrifice to be made on cap & tank for the Nightmare is way too much. There wasn't much point in turning the Nightmare into a jumping jack since the whole point of the Nightmare was to mission efficiently, not waddle along with a limp trying to work around getting NPC TDed.

Conclusion? Mothball all your turreted BS or migrate to Angel space (to face NPC painters, which is easy mode).
Use EXCLUSIVELY missiles vs Sansha ... until CCP changes TD to affect missiles**.

**Great.... so, let's recap to the future :
- can't use guns reliably
- can't use drones reliably
- can't use missiles reliably (if/when proposed TD changes gets implemented)

so what WEAPONS/ECEW can the players use reliably vs NPC TD?
Agrias Hellion
Diligentia Sodalitas
#11 - 2013-02-22 20:17:29 UTC
Chainsaw Plankton wrote:
Singira wrote:
But the new AI adds so much excitement and content right?
Now missions are liek totally changed and way more fun than before right?


I've been trying to make that point in every single npc ai thread I've seen since people started posting them.... oh well Roll


It adds nothing except frustration and a large bill at the end of the mission replacing said drones. It is not a case of players failing to micro manage their drones, I'm in a Dominix it is all I pretty much do during a mission.

It slows the game to a crawl, the missions I was playing were not significantly harder I just lost more drones. If it continues my dom will end being a logistics ship as will have to repair the drones full time.

To be honest I am finding the level 4 mission running to be about exciting as mining with less of an income and more time spent. I just finished Angel Extravaganza and I want to end myself! Lol