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Latest in a long line of small gang PVP nerfs...
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Andski
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#41 - 2013-02-20 06:35:02 UTC
hold on hold on hold on I have the PERFECT quote for this thread

Twitter: @EVEAndski

"It's easy to speak for the silent majority. They rarely object to what you put into their mouths."    - Abrazzar
Andski
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#42 - 2013-02-20 06:36:31 UTC
Akirei Scytale wrote:
:David Attenborough:

And here, we see the FOTM kiddie in its natural habitat, the forums. This one has just lost his ability to hunt with impunity, never needing to rely on his wit nor his skill. Having grown soft when he could hunt with ease, he has realized that he may struggle to hunt, now that he is on a level playing field with the rest of the jungle. His response, as you can see, is to pull out his hair and gnash at the shadows, occasionally screaming gibberish. He may not survive the winter.

Twitter: @EVEAndski

"It's easy to speak for the silent majority. They rarely object to what you put into their mouths."    - Abrazzar
dark heartt
#43 - 2013-02-20 07:23:04 UTC
When frigates went through their tericide, I saw a distinct influx of people who were flying frigates you really never saw before. Now we will see the same thing with BC's because for the most part I really saw Drakes and Canes in PVP. Now we can expect to see a lot of other ships being flown and being reasonably equal.

http://tetrisisunrealistic.blogspot.com.au/
Petrus Blackshell
Rifterlings
#44 - 2013-02-20 07:40:10 UTC
I can't believe you guys. Did all the real PvPers leave when I wasn't looking, just to be replaced by blobbing braindead goons?

I should just unsub, this game is starting to not be worth it anymore. I'm not paying to be part of a super carebear noob haven of people who like to pretend they "PvP".

Accidentally The Whole Frigate - For-newbies blog (currently on pause)
Dante Uisen
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#45 - 2013-02-20 07:48:15 UTC
Kahega Amielden wrote:
Listen to your core small gang PVPers.


9 out of 10 times small gang PVPers is just another way of saying gate campers, gate camping is not really a concept that game balance should be centered around.

If you take something like factional warfare where you have a lot of 1 vs. 1 fights, you will see that people are flying all the T1 frigs, dessies and cruisers now, and there are a lot of different play styles and tactics being used.
Andski
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#46 - 2013-02-20 07:48:30 UTC
Ignoring the fact that you resorted to argumentum ad goonum, let me make an attempt to address your concern re: the sky falling because CCP apparently doesn't agree with your idea that only a handful of ships in the game should be useful.

In the past, a newbie would need to spend months training in order to get into a ship worth a damn. There was a massive gap between T1 and T2 hulls, the most glaring one being between T1 support and T2 logistics. Flying a Merlin, Tristan or Vexor effectively did not only take skill, it took the amount of specialized training required to fly their T2 counterparts. Those ships are now worth flying on their own merits and not just in gimmicky gang compositions.

CCP came to a realization in mid-2011 that bankruptcy was a Bad Thing and that the "**** you, you're utterly useless for your first six months and still crap for your first two years" approach to game design was driving away more players than they could afford. This, compounded with the fact that their game is 10 years old and has been losing many core players who move on with their lives to careers and marriages, means that it is important to increase player retention without abandoning the core principles of the game. This is not WoW, where your first few months are spent exclusively in the forests grinding to level 90 or whatever the cap is nowadays. This is EVE, where every ship can present a larger-than-obvious threat.

I'm sorry that your orca swapping was nerfed and that you're apparently getting taken to the ownzone by 2 month old players in T1 cruisers, but the blame does not lie with whatever external entity you attribute your own failures to.

Twitter: @EVEAndski

"It's easy to speak for the silent majority. They rarely object to what you put into their mouths."    - Abrazzar
Tah'ris Khlador
Space Ghosts.
Break-A-Wish Foundation
#47 - 2013-02-20 07:49:50 UTC
Petrus Blackshell wrote:
Did all the real PvPers leave when I wasn't looking, just to be replaced by blobbing braindead goons?


Calling me a Goon is probably an insult to the goons.

Member of the Pink Pony Killboard Padding Alliance
baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#48 - 2013-02-20 07:54:52 UTC
Tah'ris Khlador wrote:
Petrus Blackshell wrote:
Did all the real PvPers leave when I wasn't looking, just to be replaced by blobbing braindead goons?


Calling me a Goon is probably an insult to the goons.


Don't worry we are used to being insulted by the wretches of high sec.
Revajin
Doomheim
#49 - 2013-02-20 08:00:16 UTC
Confirming the Drake and Cane are still mad op. Thread is pointless.
Petrus Blackshell
Rifterlings
#50 - 2013-02-20 08:02:16 UTC
Ugh don't even remind me of the plague of T1 logistics everywhere. Their affordability and easy availability has made them the new "win button" for PvP. They can be fit up for higher sensor strength and almost the same reps as their T2 counterparts, but can appear in ridiculous numbers.

It used to be that a small gang of smart (read: actually skilled) pilots could maneuver around a larger gang, pick off stragglers, etc. To counter this, gangs could go the extra mile and effort (plus risk) of bringing in ewar or logi support -- especially the latter. Now, with the ubiquity of both of these in large numbers of T1 ships, what can the small gang do? Bring their own logi? Their own ewar? More numbers? ... OH WAIT, THAT'S RIGHT! The only counter to a blob is a bigger blob! No skill involved.

Andski wrote:
I'm sorry that your orca swapping was nerfed and that you're apparently getting taken to the ownzone by 2 month old players in T1 cruisers, but the blame does not lie with whatever external entity you attribute your own failures to.


I have no idea where you're pulling this false crap out of.

Accidentally The Whole Frigate - For-newbies blog (currently on pause)
Xanthe Kado
Doomheim
#51 - 2013-02-20 08:04:19 UTC
Posting in a we should've named ourselves Whinerlings thread.
Andski
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#52 - 2013-02-20 08:14:29 UTC
You know how I'd approach bringing up the topic of overbuffed T1 logistics for discussion? It doesn't involve ranting and accusing CCP of working for Goonswarm. Unless you honestly believe that we've ever had problems fielding dozens of T2 logis in our fleets (hint: we don't) or reimbursing them (hint: we most definitely don't)

Twitter: @EVEAndski

"It's easy to speak for the silent majority. They rarely object to what you put into their mouths."    - Abrazzar
Petrus Blackshell
Rifterlings
#53 - 2013-02-20 08:16:39 UTC
Andski wrote:
You know how I'd approach bringing up the topic of overbuffed T1 logistics for discussion? It doesn't involve ranting and accusing CCP of working for Goonswarm. Unless you honestly believe that we've ever had problems fielding dozens of T2 logis in our fleets (hint: we don't) or reimbursing them (hint: we most definitely don't)

Of course you don't, knowing the depth of your lined pockets. But that's an issue for another thread.

Accidentally The Whole Frigate - For-newbies blog (currently on pause)
Liang Nuren
No Salvation
Divine Damnation
#54 - 2013-02-20 08:22:26 UTC  |  Edited by: Liang Nuren
Petrus Blackshell wrote:
Okay so if everything is so good, tell me: how would you handle a blob if you're solo or in a small gang (5-10 people or less). Oh and don't say "bring links" because CCP are about to nerf those too as part of their crusade to buff the goon blob.


What kind of blob are we talking about? You can't just say "blah blah blah blah" and get a meaningful response. A blob of supers? A blob of caps? A BC blob? How big a BC blob?

-Liang

Ed: Also, Petrus... this thread is most unlike you guys. Seriously, it's just ******* stupid.

I'm an idiot, don't mind me.
Roime
Mea Culpa.
Shadow Cartel
#55 - 2013-02-20 08:23:15 UTC
Petrus Blackshell wrote:
Ugh don't even remind me of the plague of T1 logistics everywhere. Their affordability and easy availability has made them the new "win button" for PvP. They can be fit up for higher sensor strength and almost the same reps as their T2 counterparts, but can appear in ridiculous numbers.

It used to be that a small gang of smart (read: actually skilled) pilots could maneuver around a larger gang, pick off stragglers, etc. To counter this, gangs could go the extra mile and effort (plus risk) of bringing in ewar or logi support -- especially the latter. Now, with the ubiquity of both of these in large numbers of T1 ships, what can the small gang do? Bring their own logi? Their own ewar? More numbers? ... OH WAIT, THAT'S RIGHT! The only counter to a blob is a bigger blob! No skill involved.


You know, these kind of changes reveal the pilots who didn't have the skills or smarts to win, but relied on OP equipment to get kills.

It's quite sad, you ruined the reputation of Rifterlings in one single thread of really stupid posts.

.
Roime
Mea Culpa.
Shadow Cartel
#56 - 2013-02-20 08:25:48 UTC
Milton Middleson wrote:

lol. ccp buffed scrub ships like t1 firgates and cruisers cause blobbers are afraid to fly something that costs more than a few million iskies. why would you even fly a bc or hac now that cruisers are just as good and cost halve or tenth as much. meanwhile, their going to nerf real pvp ships like t3s because scrubs dont have the balls to field something worth that much so they whine intil ccp does something about it.

o7m8s enjoy ur carebear pvp.


You don't have any kills in T3s, you only fly scrub ships.

07m8s enjoy your trolling, scrub.

.
Petrus Blackshell
Rifterlings
#57 - 2013-02-20 08:35:53 UTC
Liang Nuren wrote:
Ed: Also, Petrus... this thread is most unlike you guys. Seriously, it's just ******* stupid.

Sigh... I guess you simply never noticed how much I loved flying my Drake. Those days are gone, now, of course.

Accidentally The Whole Frigate - For-newbies blog (currently on pause)
Cass Lie
State War Academy
Caldari State
#58 - 2013-02-20 08:37:44 UTC
Petrus Blackshell wrote:
Ugh don't even remind me of the plague of T1 logistics everywhere. Their affordability and easy availability has made them the new "win button" for PvP. They can be fit up for higher sensor strength and almost the same reps as their T2 counterparts, but can appear in ridiculous numbers.

It used to be that a small gang of smart (read: actually skilled) pilots could maneuver around a larger gang, pick off stragglers, etc. To counter this, gangs could go the extra mile and effort (plus risk) of bringing in ewar or logi support -- especially the latter. Now, with the ubiquity of both of these in large numbers of T1 ships, what can the small gang do? Bring their own logi? Their own ewar? More numbers? ... OH WAIT, THAT'S RIGHT! The only counter to a blob is a bigger blob! No skill involved.

Andski wrote:
I'm sorry that your orca swapping was nerfed and that you're apparently getting taken to the ownzone by 2 month old players in T1 cruisers, but the blame does not lie with whatever external entity you attribute your own failures to.


I have no idea where you're pulling this false crap out of.


So, in your definition, skill = more SP and more expensive toys to play with. Mind boggles.
Riddle me this. If you are actually skilled, how come you can't come on top even when the the gear on both sides becomes more even?
Deathan Taxxis
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#59 - 2013-02-20 08:42:15 UTC
Petrus Blackshell wrote:
I can't believe you guys. Did all the real PvPers leave when I wasn't looking, just to be replaced by blobbing braindead goons?

I should just unsub, this game is starting to not be worth it anymore. I'm not paying to be part of a super carebear noob haven of people who like to pretend they "PvP".


You're probably right, you should unsub.

As you're one of the clearly '1337 pvpers' you must have quite a lot of stuff?

Can I have it?
Dante Uisen
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#60 - 2013-02-20 08:42:19 UTC
We start with
Kahega Amielden wrote:
Ship choice used to matter. Flying something like a Merlin or a Tristan or a Vexor took skill. Only people who knew what they were doing could do it properly in the face of the FotM.


now we have
Petrus Blackshell wrote:
Sigh... I guess you simply never noticed how much I loved flying my Drake. Those days are gone, now, of course.