EVE General Discussion

No. Anyone who has 100 million SP and still doesn't PvP is never going to voluntarily PvP no matter what. I do think clone costs should be lowered though. In the beginning it scales with your capability to make money, but at a certain point your close cost keeps going up even though you're making as much ISK as you ever will.

TL;DR: while PvP cost *any* money most players won't do it willingly.

Talk about PvP game where PvP is against pilot's (monetary) progression.

Imo what hurts pvp the most isn't clone costs, it's attribute implants. People plug in +4s or +5s into their primary clones, then they're afraid losing hundreds of millions each time they are podded, but they refuse to downgrade to a pvp clone, because that'll slow their skilling. It's just another one of those silly mental barriers to breach.



Then again, by risking a higher cost ship, you essentially nullify the difference in clone cost. Any ship can be destroyed if the enemy gets a drop on you, so it doesn't really matter. Plus, imo people choosing more expensive ships is a good thing, else the entire pvp would turn into oversized RvB brawl.

people currently choose expensive ships because they're generally more powerful. that's not going to change. but people feeling as if flying a cheaper or less survivable ship is not a practical or justifiable option due to the cost of replacing a clone is not a good thing, as it restricts their choices and restricts their gameplay

btw in eve online 'not a practical option' and 'not a justifiable option' are the same as 'not an option' for a player due to real loss

Hello thread.

I wrote an article about clone costs. Ignore the insurance part though.

Don't think so, if anything, implant costs are much more of a problem.
Of course, if you have 100m+ skill points and no cash for new clones, something is wrong anyway.

Ofcourse we did. The clone cost system isn't the only or the worst barrier to more PvP. It's just one more unnecessary barrier and a bad mechanic on it's own. Being married to your implants is another one, that should be fixed by removing the long timers from local clone switching. It's just that these issues are usually discussed separately. The medical clone issue justifies a change on it's own. The fact there are other changes, that would also help and even be more effective in encouraging more PvP don't change that need in any way.

Would free medical clones cause more PvP? Naturally it would. Everything that lowers the cost will increase PvP, but that isn't the question to ask, since on it's own it isn't a reason to make such changes. Good reasons for the change are, that the current mechanic unnecessarily inhibits certain kinds of PvP and the costs become increasingly harder to justify from gameplay and customer loyalty perspective.

The clone cost of a fully skilled frigate pilot is a few hundred thousand ISK. Why do some people need to pay up to 90 million ISK minimum for the privilage of getting podded in one, when those extra skillpoints didn't bring them better performance? Implants can be much more expensive, but it's a realistic option to not use any. Not using an up to date medical clone isn't.

Maybe you say higher SP means higher income earning potential, so the cost is justified. Two problems with that. Initially this is so, but that progression stops fairly quickly, while the cost keep on heavily increasing. This means the cost isn't actually tied to your ability to earn ISK. It likely keeps increasing the way it does just because at the time the system was created no one gave any thought, if it worked at our current SP levels. Secondly, I thought we were playing a sandbox game where I can play as I choose. If I'm not dedicating my time to learn more efficient ways to grind for ISK and want to keep advancing a single character, am I playing the game wrong? Why can't I choose to fly cheap and have the ability to largely ignore the chore of grinding ISK to keep playing?

You can also look at it in a different way by asking another question. What good does the current implementation of the mechanic bring to the game? A minor ISK sink, that is easily replaceable and tranferrable to a place were it's PvP neutral? To me that isn't a good enough reason to justify any of the negatives, so I think the system needs to be revamped to address the issues.

I've said it before and I will say it again.
Let Sov players have the clone cost upgrade like FW! We're the ones who are paying for new clones the most any way (you know, that whole bubble's are only nullsec?)

Let HighSec stay as it is, if you want to play in safer space you pay more for clones (which you shouldn't be losing outside of smartbombs and lag)
LowSec have their discounts and are close for HighSec users
NullSec get the same as LowSec if the system/outpost is upgraded.

I'd PVP a LOT more. I love frigates, and most of my 65mil ISK clone is wasted when I'm in a frigate, and the cost is unjustifiable.

I'd probably be just as effective at flying it in my 15mil alt clone, BUT I DO NOT WANT TO BE MY ALT. I want all my PVP to show up under my main character.

I should not be punished for wanting this. It makes no sense at all. Give people the choice, get more fights!

Think of it this way, in another ten years of eve NONE of you will be pvping. Unless you fancy 500mil-1bil a clone just for losing a T1 frig in null to a dictor bubble which will happen on a DAILY basis if you are active.

Is that where you want eve to be?

no. !!!!

why we killing stuff? cos its cost isk ? why should bother killing free stuff ?



clones should cost more for +100mil sp chars ( if u lower cost of pods, we just start using them to move yourself trough expresspod)