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CCP! Please clarify the future plans for WiS!

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Ranger 1
Ranger Corp
Vae. Victis.
#421 - 2011-10-26 20:41:19 UTC  |  Edited by: Ranger 1
Ranka Mei wrote:
Kengutsi Akira wrote:

An yea, they still could but Im thinking the contract they signed merging with White Wolf has to play SOME kind of factor here, otherwise why the hell DID they keep ppl working on a game that will never see the light of day at this point? Theyre just wasting money :p


Yeah, it's gotta be a legal issue, as I can't possibly see any viable future for WoD (except maybe to cannibalize it for useful bits of code for WiS; you know, put the shoe on the other goose, for a change).


I imagine there is some truth in this. No doubt there are legal issues involved.

However, I imagine the larger issues are twofold:

1: From a PR perspective they need to distance themselves from other projects. At this stage in the game they can't really distance themselves from DUST anyway, it ties in more directly with EVE, and has a less direct connection with the red headed step child Incarna (not really, but people seem to think this). PR wise WOD is the logical choice to step away from.

2: From a financial perspective DUST stands to bring in an influx of income much, much faster than WOD could hope to, it is much closer to release (beta in a month or so). If it does well, in conjuction with stemming subscription bleed (and perhaps starting EVE's usual slow and steady subcription increases), this would go a long way towards fulfilling their current fiancial obligations and securing new funding to work on WOD at a later date.

This time if they are smart they will keep their mouths closed about sharing tech between EVE and WOD. Some people irrationally feel EVE proceeds should never be used to fund other projects, and it would also give the impression (again) that EVE has become nothing more than a test bed for WOD.

They need to keep any shared tech between the two games confidential, which is ironic considering we want them to be more open with us.

View the latest EVE Online developments and other game related news and gameplay by visiting Ranger 1 Presents: Virtual Realms.
MotherMoon
Tribal Liberation Force
Minmatar Republic
#422 - 2011-10-26 20:41:48 UTC
Eve online is a game about pilots and captains, flying spaceships.

http://dl.eve-files.com/media/1206/scimi.jpg
Bomberlocks
Bombercorp
#423 - 2011-10-26 20:47:32 UTC
Issler Dainze wrote:
Some key points I think were misrepresented by some of the posters.

1. We lost a lot of subs, that was not just in protest of WiS.

-It was a reaction to a lame single room/player WiS
-The golden ammo microtransaction face plant that is Nex (which is still here by the way)
-Stagnant FiS and rage over what had clearly been CCP sucking Eve dry while using that cash to build two other games
-Burnout when it became clear that nothing "new" can be expected in Eve anytime soon
-CCP's clear disconnect with NeX pricing and the greed is good leaked newsletter (monocolegate)

2. CCP describes Eve as a Scifi simulator, not a space combat game.

3. This thread is not WiS over FIS. It is "CCP please keep something on the burner, not on ice" for folks that believe WiS will make Eve better.

4. There is now way to know what percentage of folks in Eve want FiS only, Wis, Wis and FiS, a fox in a box or a train. But clearly to say no one in Eve wants WiS is simply wrong.

5. WiS is not space barbies, it is key to RP and emmersiveness and the community has already shared a number of ideas that would make WiS interesting to many folks in Eve.

6. WiS can be decoupled from WoD. Branch the code and move the team on WoD to WiS. CCP can come back to WoD when they get the increase in Eve subscriptions delivering ambulation creates.

Issler

Issler, I hate to say this, but you're starting to sound like a stuck record. But ok, let us say CCP stops working on FiS and goes back to working on WiS. Do you think CCP would survive the subsequent mass unsubbing (again)? You're not on the CSM, although you were and wanted to be again, and I presume you know a fair few people who know what the loss of subs really were. Go ahead, ask them whether they think that neglecting FiS in place of Wis again would be a good idea.
Envoy Achates
Safe Harbour Shipyards
#424 - 2011-10-26 20:48:18 UTC
MotherMoon wrote:
Eve online is a game about pilots and captains, flying spaceships.

decided to come back after you little hissy-fit, did you?

god bless the "block worthless poster" function on the new forums.
Mina Sebiestar
Minmatar Inner Space Conglomerate
#425 - 2011-10-26 20:52:03 UTC  |  Edited by: Mina Sebiestar
when "a lot of us" wanted something there was 500 pages thread monster with half mill of hits that's "a lot of us" not OP 3-4 friends with 2 alt each .

WIS is me stepping down from ship in busy station market area with 2 rapid fire cyber desert eagles uber guns, having image and location of drug lord/slave trader/who ever projected in my left eye while wearing minmatar desert style cape with hood wearing alien4 stile army boots.

racing in high speed domes with who knows what,watching giant robots filling your tempest with ammo hell jogging in hover boots in weird station interior etc.

WiS in not having lack of emo face barbies with boob jobs playing poker with stiffed dudes running two loop animation total.

its just not worth time nor money that's not eve that's poker in room with avatars.

I will skip NeX joke due to puke reflex i have from it,

You choke behind a smile a fake behind the fear

Because >>I is too hard
Ranka Mei
TANoshii Incorporated
#426 - 2011-10-26 20:53:07 UTC  |  Edited by: Ranka Mei
Bomberlocks wrote:

Issler, I hate to say this, but you're starting to sound like a stuck record. But ok, let us say CCP stops working on FiS and goes back to working on WiS.


There ya go again: setting this up as if it's about WiS vs. FiS. It isn't. Never was. There is some concern, however, from the way Hilmar spoke in the eurogamer interview, that CCP has chosen to pretty much abandon WiS altogether. And I, and many others with me, are asking CCP to reconsider.

-- "All your monies AUR belong to us!" -- CCP
Mekela
Vinyl Roid
#427 - 2011-10-26 21:03:03 UTC
Here is a simple question - how many of you loved "Clear Skies"?
Why did you like it? Was it only because of the space ship parts?
How cool would it be if we could do the things that they did in the movie?

This is what EVE could be.
Skunk Gracklaw
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#428 - 2011-10-26 21:07:20 UTC
Ranka Mei wrote:
Bomberlocks wrote:

Issler, I hate to say this, but you're starting to sound like a stuck record. But ok, let us say CCP stops working on FiS and goes back to working on WiS.


There ya go again: setting this up as if it's about WiS vs. FiS.

The space barbie fetishists are making it that way. CCP never said WiS was dead just that they were going to focus on Eve's core gameplay which is internet spaceships. If they can work on both without the core gameplay suffering then that would be great but that's not what they were doing...they neglected Eve and have now made a commitment to focus on it. Let them fix the game and *then* add space barbie.
Ilkahn
Ideal Mechanisms
#429 - 2011-10-26 21:12:15 UTC
Dax Golem wrote:
Impliment WiS with a poker room and I'm sold! Shocked


Ditto !! It's really that simple.
Ranka Mei
TANoshii Incorporated
#430 - 2011-10-26 21:26:02 UTC
Skunk Gracklaw wrote:

CCP never said WiS was dead just that they were going to focus on Eve's core gameplay which is internet spaceships. If they can work on both without the core gameplay suffering then that would be great but that's not what they were doing...they neglected Eve and have now made a commitment to focus on it. Let them fix the game and *then* add space barbie.


Come to think of it, the problem is even deeper. Basically CCP's marketing people have convinced the brass that they need to release a major new Expansion every 6 months or so, or watch the game die. And this has been going on for quite a while. The result? More and more half-implemented and/or buggy features wind up left unattended, as they are being starved at each new expansion. This effect has accumulated over time; and if you think about it, has actually scaringly little to do with Incarna per se.

It has been argued that marketing folks should never be allowed to make direct, unsupervised decisions that affect the real world. And I agree. If CCP were to ever put up a poll about this, you'd be surprised how many people don't mind not gettng something new each time, but rather see old things fixed first. In that light, I can understand CCP wanting to fix old things first... except they're already talking about countless new FiS stuff. Maybe they haven't fully gotten it yet? :)

-- "All your monies AUR belong to us!" -- CCP
Smoking Blunts
ZC Omega
#431 - 2011-10-26 21:44:07 UTC
WIS to me highlights everything that went wrong with ccp and eve over the last few years. 18months of just letting things slide while working on WOD and Dust while forgeting about the game that made them. Thats WIS imo

fuckWIS. until they can finish it without forgetting about eve, but tbh i couldnt give a toss if they look at it again as long as they dont forget spaceships ever again

OMG when can i get a pic here
Nariya Kentaya
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#432 - 2011-10-26 21:48:58 UTC
Myfanwy Heimdal wrote:
Walking in Stations is a huge task and one which really hadn't been thought out properly.

We're talking stations of over 20 km in size. How are we going to walk around that lot? What are we going to do in there? In fact, what is in all those thousands of miles of corridors and how are we going to interact?

I've seen other games where we've had taverns in towns where players could meet and, always, they're empty. So, if we're wanting an Eve version of Mallory's Bar (The Gap) or that bar from Total Recall then we're going to have to have something worth our while going around walking in stations.

When I was playing other games I never once saw the point of towns or cities where we could meet other players. Not once did I say I'll spend the evening playing BadgerQuest or whatever and spend the time sitting around in a town. And neither did I once run into any players who were hanging around like extras in Westerns lounging around on the boardwalks.

In every MMO that I have played, players would come into town - because the had to - get whatever it was they had to have done done as fast as they could - and then beetle off to do some whatever they did out of the towns.

So, please tell me, and I mean this most sincerely, what possibly could CCP do to make walking in stations interesting or purposeful to the majority of players? I have, at the moment no interest in WiS and I can't see me every having any interest in doing so. CCP would have to pull a massive rabbit out of a hat to make me interested. And if they tried to force us to leave the pod to find an agent/repairshop/refinery then the recent rage would be nothing compared to that storm.

Walking In Stations/ It's not going to work.

to be fair adn offer a counterpoint, SWG, back before SOE killed it, the Taverns were pretty active, with several players itting around in chairs chatting for hours, i was often one of those, simply because it was a fun time to sit around listening to music having a meeting with buddies about the recent happenings. Now, they would ahve to make the bar pretty damn fancy, elaborate, and fun to be in and hang out in though before i would use it.
Kengutsi Akira
Doomheim
#433 - 2011-10-26 21:55:54 UTC
Skunk Gracklaw wrote:
Ranka Mei wrote:
Bomberlocks wrote:

Issler, I hate to say this, but you're starting to sound like a stuck record. But ok, let us say CCP stops working on FiS and goes back to working on WiS.


There ya go again: setting this up as if it's about WiS vs. FiS.

The space barbie fetishists are making it that way. CCP never said WiS was dead just that they were going to focus on Eve's core gameplay which is internet spaceships. If they can work on both without the core gameplay suffering then that would be great but that's not what they were doing...they neglected Eve and have now made a commitment to focus on it. Let them fix the game and *then* add space barbie.


eeew i agree with a goon

but yea, the FiS ppl arent the ones screaming "yay WiS is dead"
you WiS ppl are.

"Is it fair that CCP can get away with..." :: checks ownership on the box ::

Yes
Skunk Gracklaw
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#434 - 2011-10-26 22:05:40 UTC
Nariya Kentaya wrote:

to be fair adn offer a counterpoint, SWG, back before SOE killed it, the Taverns were pretty active, with several players itting around in chairs chatting for hours, i was often one of those, simply because it was a fun time to sit around listening to music having a meeting with buddies about the recent happenings. Now, they would ahve to make the bar pretty damn fancy, elaborate, and fun to be in and hang out in though before i would use it.

SWG was a great example of combining avatar play and space combat (after the Jump to Lightspeed expansion). It's too bad SOE killed it.
Ishtanchuk Fazmarai
#435 - 2011-10-26 22:10:15 UTC
Nariya Kentaya wrote:
Myfanwy Heimdal wrote:
Walking in Stations is a huge task and one which really hadn't been thought out properly.

We're talking stations of over 20 km in size. How are we going to walk around that lot? What are we going to do in there? In fact, what is in all those thousands of miles of corridors and how are we going to interact?

I've seen other games where we've had taverns in towns where players could meet and, always, they're empty. So, if we're wanting an Eve version of Mallory's Bar (The Gap) or that bar from Total Recall then we're going to have to have something worth our while going around walking in stations.

When I was playing other games I never once saw the point of towns or cities where we could meet other players. Not once did I say I'll spend the evening playing BadgerQuest or whatever and spend the time sitting around in a town. And neither did I once run into any players who were hanging around like extras in Westerns lounging around on the boardwalks.

In every MMO that I have played, players would come into town - because the had to - get whatever it was they had to have done done as fast as they could - and then beetle off to do some whatever they did out of the towns.

So, please tell me, and I mean this most sincerely, what possibly could CCP do to make walking in stations interesting or purposeful to the majority of players? I have, at the moment no interest in WiS and I can't see me every having any interest in doing so. CCP would have to pull a massive rabbit out of a hat to make me interested. And if they tried to force us to leave the pod to find an agent/repairshop/refinery then the recent rage would be nothing compared to that storm.

Walking In Stations/ It's not going to work.

to be fair adn offer a counterpoint, SWG, back before SOE killed it, the Taverns were pretty active, with several players itting around in chairs chatting for hours, i was often one of those, simply because it was a fun time to sit around listening to music having a meeting with buddies about the recent happenings. Now, they would ahve to make the bar pretty damn fancy, elaborate, and fun to be in and hang out in though before i would use it.


Ironically, my proposal of "holographic videoconference" as a sort of chat could be one of the features most used by everyone, nullsec dwellers included.

Let's say your corpies are 20 jumps away. You all hire a "holo-booth" (=ISK faucet, or money for the owner...) in your current location and all you seat virtually around a table and have a (cough) text chat (cough). Your holographic, inmaterial avatars interact in a very limited manner... if all you meet in "reality" then you can go around the station and have the whole nine yards of Incarna emotes, so stll there is a lot of reasons to go meet someone in a place.

Content emerges, people get something from EVE, they pay their subscriptions, everyobody is happy withotu a need to go and kill someone for the n-th time..

Roses are red / Violets are blue / I am an Alpha / And so it's you
Hikaru Kuroda
Extheria
#436 - 2011-10-26 22:52:18 UTC
Issler Dainze wrote:
Some key points I think were misrepresented by some of the posters.

1. We lost a lot of subs, that was not just in protest of WiS.

-It was a reaction to a lame single room/player WiS
-The golden ammo microtransaction face plant that is Nex (which is still here by the way)
-Stagnant FiS and rage over what had clearly been CCP sucking Eve dry while using that cash to build two other games
-Burnout when it became clear that nothing "new" can be expected in Eve anytime soon
-CCP's clear disconnect with NeX pricing and the greed is good leaked newsletter (monocolegate)

2. CCP describes Eve as a Scifi simulator, not a space combat game.

3. This thread is not WiS over FIS. It is "CCP please keep something on the burner, not on ice" for folks that believe WiS will make Eve better.

4. There is now way to know what percentage of folks in Eve want FiS only, Wis, Wis and FiS, a fox in a box or a train. But clearly to say no one in Eve wants WiS is simply wrong.

5. WiS is not space barbies, it is key to RP and emmersiveness and the community has already shared a number of ideas that would make WiS interesting to many folks in Eve.

6. WiS can be decoupled from WoD. Branch the code and move the team on WoD to WiS. CCP can come back to WoD when they get the increase in Eve subscriptions delivering ambulation creates.

Issler
Beamer Grey
Perkone
Caldari State
#437 - 2011-10-26 23:08:22 UTC
We have been promised walking in stations for years that included bars, gambling, and other interaction with other players. What we got was ONE room where we cant customize anything or have any functionality what so ever. Why would anyone care about it other then the fact that it looks cool, but it has no effect what so ever on the game in any way.

Isk Watch - Trading Blog
Azahni Vah'nos
Vah'nos Family
#438 - 2011-10-27 02:17:39 UTC
There is a fairly simple solution to all this toing and froing if CCP really want to know what the community truly wants. Have a poll appear when people log into the game.


For example: Start the poll with some blurb defining what the Spaceship (FiS) and Avatar (WiS) descriptions actually relate to, then ask the following questions:

1) Would you like to see gameplay in EVE only involve Spaceships? Yes/No

2) Do you like having an Avatar (3d human) in the game? Yes/No

3) Do you want to see more Avatar based gamplay in EVE? Yes/No

4) Would having establishments and other in station avatar gameplay appeal to you? Yes/No

5) What in-game content should be given higher priority? Spaceship gameplay / Avatar gameplay / 50/50 split


That should tell CCP what the communities feelings are regarding WiS.

Nex (Cash Shop) / Aurum - removing sand from the sandbox since Incarna. Currently the only use for aurum is to buy virtual items in the in-game store, but Cockerill expects to expand its uses in the future.

Ladie Harlot
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#439 - 2011-10-27 02:19:33 UTC
Azahni Vah'nos wrote:
That should tell CCP what the communities feelings are regarding WiS.

They got all the information they needed when thousands of accounts got canceled over the summer.

The artist formerly known as Ladie Scarlet.
Elyssa MacLeod
Doomheim
#440 - 2011-10-27 02:28:53 UTC

1) Would you like to see gameplay in EVE only involve Spaceships? Yes

2) Do you like having an Avatar (3d human) in the game? No

3) Do you want to see more Avatar based gamplay in EVE? No

4) Would having establishments and other in station avatar gameplay appeal to you? No

5) What in-game content should be given higher priority? Spaceship gameplay



GM Homonoia: Suicide ganks are a valid and viable tactic in EVE.

Where is your God now carebear?