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Andreus Ixiris
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#41 - 2013-02-16 12:34:00 UTC
Lyn Farel wrote:
I thought that admiral was called rogue by the Navy after the incident ?

A fact that almost every Provist conveniently ignores.

Besides, Noir wasn't flying that ship.

Andreus Ixiris > A Civire without a chin is barely a Civire at all.

Pieter Tuulinen > He'd be Civirely disadvantaged, Andreus.

Andreus Ixiris > ...

Andreus Ixiris > This is why we're at war.
Valerie Valate
Church of The Crimson Saviour
#42 - 2013-02-16 12:39:38 UTC
Andreus Ixiris wrote:
Lyn Farel wrote:
I thought that admiral was called rogue by the Navy after the incident ?

A fact that almost every Provist conveniently ignores.

Besides, Noir wasn't flying that ship.


Who was flying it ?

Doctor V. Valate, Professor of Archaeology at Kaztropolis Imperial University.
Andreus Ixiris
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#43 - 2013-02-16 12:41:09 UTC
Valerie Valate wrote:
Who was flying it ?

Clone impostor. As to who precisely the impostor was, we may never know, but whoever was inside Noir's body, it wasn't Noir.

Andreus Ixiris > A Civire without a chin is barely a Civire at all.

Pieter Tuulinen > He'd be Civirely disadvantaged, Andreus.

Andreus Ixiris > ...

Andreus Ixiris > This is why we're at war.
Valerie Valate
Church of The Crimson Saviour
#44 - 2013-02-16 12:49:24 UTC
Andreus Ixiris wrote:
Valerie Valate wrote:
Who was flying it ?

Clone impostor. As to who precisely the impostor was, we may never know, but whoever was inside Noir's body, it wasn't Noir.


You should send your evidence for this to Gutter Press. They'll be able to identify the Caldari Plot behind it reasonably efficiently, I'd think.

Doctor V. Valate, Professor of Archaeology at Kaztropolis Imperial University.
Andreus Ixiris
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#45 - 2013-02-16 12:54:35 UTC
Valerie Valate wrote:
You should send your evidence for this to Gutter Press. They'll be able to identify the Caldari Plot behind it reasonably efficiently, I'd think.

Joke around if you want. I don't really have the time to bicker with racist genocide apologists such as yourself, but Verin had an exceptionally clear and concise argument for why we believe what we believe.

Andreus Ixiris > A Civire without a chin is barely a Civire at all.

Pieter Tuulinen > He'd be Civirely disadvantaged, Andreus.

Andreus Ixiris > ...

Andreus Ixiris > This is why we're at war.
Valerie Valate
Church of The Crimson Saviour
#46 - 2013-02-16 13:06:49 UTC
Andreus Ixiris wrote:
Valerie Valate wrote:
You should send your evidence for this to Gutter Press. They'll be able to identify the Caldari Plot behind it reasonably efficiently, I'd think.

Joke around if you want. I don't really have the time to bicker with racist genocide apologists such as yourself, but Verin had an exceptionally clear and concise argument for why we believe what we believe.


It is the Theology Council that are the racists. Not True Believers, such as I.

For it is Written, that All are Equal in God's Kingdom.

Which the Council deny.

Doctor V. Valate, Professor of Archaeology at Kaztropolis Imperial University.
Andreus Ixiris
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#47 - 2013-02-16 13:13:55 UTC
Valerie Valate wrote:
It is the Theology Council that are the racists. Not True Believers, such as I.

For it is Written, that All are Equal in God's Kingdom.

Which the Council deny.

And yet the Minmatar somehow owe a "debt" to the empire that attempted a full-scale genocide against them, for "services rendered" that they never requested? Pull the other one.

You can call yourself a "True Believer" if you want, but the simple fact is that you're just as wrong as the Theology Council because both your religions are fiction.

Andreus Ixiris > A Civire without a chin is barely a Civire at all.

Pieter Tuulinen > He'd be Civirely disadvantaged, Andreus.

Andreus Ixiris > ...

Andreus Ixiris > This is why we're at war.
Seriphyn Inhonores
Elusenian Cooperative
#48 - 2013-02-16 13:20:15 UTC
Now, now, Andreus Ixiris, I saw you indulging in a Ni-Kunni cardreading over FTL last night. We can't pick and choose our hokey-pokeyness, surely.
Andreus Ixiris
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#49 - 2013-02-16 13:30:40 UTC
Seriphyn Inhonores wrote:
Now, now, Andreus Ixiris, I saw you indulging in a Ni-Kunni cardreading over FTL last night. We can't pick and choose our hokey-pokeyness, surely.

Seri, has something happened to you lately? You used to be better than this.

Just because I don't believe in something, doesn't mean I can't enjoy the trappings of it. I don't believe in the Amarrian religion, but I can still enjoy reading Cathedral of the Oceans. I don't believe the holoreel Smash 4 The State depicts real events, but I can still find it an entertaining and well-directed movie. I'm not like some of those strange and frankly slightly disturbing otherkin who believe that they're actually wereslavers, but I absolutely love playing The Horror of Bogelek - I bought a Leisure Group lifetime subscription just so I could have access to that game and all the DLC wherever I am in the cluster.

I don't actually believe that a set of playing cards has any sort of genuine ability to foretell my future, or else I'd be doing a reading every ten minutes and winning the Empyrean War by myself. Fact is, it was an interesting experience, and the Theology Council considers divination to be heretical, so it was even more fun because of that.

Andreus Ixiris > A Civire without a chin is barely a Civire at all.

Pieter Tuulinen > He'd be Civirely disadvantaged, Andreus.

Andreus Ixiris > ...

Andreus Ixiris > This is why we're at war.
Lyn Farel
Societas Imperialis Sceptri Coronaeque
Khimi Harar
#50 - 2013-02-16 13:56:01 UTC
Andreus Ixiris wrote:
Valerie Valate wrote:
It is the Theology Council that are the racists. Not True Believers, such as I.

For it is Written, that All are Equal in God's Kingdom.

Which the Council deny.

And yet the Minmatar somehow owe a "debt" to the empire that attempted a full-scale genocide against them, for "services rendered" that they never requested? Pull the other one.

You can call yourself a "True Believer" if you want, but the simple fact is that you're just as wrong as the Theology Council because both your religions are fiction.


I thought genocide generally implies eradicating whole populations. How can someone reclaim someone else by killing him ? Isn't that something closer to what the EoM believe in usually ?
Andreus Ixiris
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#51 - 2013-02-16 14:10:45 UTC
Lyn Farel wrote:
I thought genocide generally implies eradicating whole populations. How can someone reclaim someone else by killing him ? Isn't that something closer to what the EoM believe in usually ?

CONCORD's definition of genocide is "any of the following acts committed with intent to destroy, in whole or in part, a national, ethnical, racial or religious group, as such: killing members of the group; causing serious bodily or mental harm to members of the group; deliberately inflicting on the group conditions of life, calculated to bring about its physical destruction in whole or in part; imposing measures intended to prevent births within the group; forcibly transferring children of the group to another group."

While the Empire admittedly only attempted the physical destruction of one Minmatar tribe out of seven (and, until recently, had apparently succeeded in this endeavour), it did attempt the destruction of Minmatar culture and religion and the replacement of same with its own. Regretably, it did manage to destroy a great deal of the physical and oral histories of the various tribes.

Andreus Ixiris > A Civire without a chin is barely a Civire at all.

Pieter Tuulinen > He'd be Civirely disadvantaged, Andreus.

Andreus Ixiris > ...

Andreus Ixiris > This is why we're at war.
Sepherim
Imperial Shipment
Amarr Empire
#52 - 2013-02-16 16:02:59 UTC
Andreus Ixiris wrote:
Joke around if you want. I don't really have the time to bicker with racist genocide apologists such as yourself, but Verin had an exceptionally clear and concise argument for why we believe what we believe.


I'd like to see his facts. As far as I remember, Noir wasn't a pod pilot and, as such, shouldn't have a clone of any kind.

Sepherim Catillah Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris Liuteneant Ex-Imperial Navy Imperator Commander
Wei Soikutsu
Doomheim
#53 - 2013-02-16 16:16:55 UTC  |  Edited by: Wei Soikutsu
I'm not sure whether I'd believe such a theory.

That aside, a capsule is a logical place to install a transcranial burning scanner, and a capsuleer a sufficiently high-value person to have one -- but cloning technology is in no way limited to capsuleers only.
Andreus Ixiris
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#54 - 2013-02-16 16:44:46 UTC
Sepherim wrote:
I'd like to see his facts. As far as I remember, Noir wasn't a pod pilot and, as such, shouldn't have a clone of any kind.

Alexander Noir was a pod pilot, and even if he wasn't, clones are not restricted to capsuleers in any case. You'll have to ask Verin for the explanation, because he gives it a lot better than me. However, the executive summary is essentially that the official account of events generally accepted by the public requires us to toss everything the entire cluster knows about psychology and history right out of the window if it's true.

Andreus Ixiris > A Civire without a chin is barely a Civire at all.

Pieter Tuulinen > He'd be Civirely disadvantaged, Andreus.

Andreus Ixiris > ...

Andreus Ixiris > This is why we're at war.
Simon Louvaki
Khaldari InnoTektoniks and Analytical Solutions
#55 - 2013-02-16 17:02:07 UTC  |  Edited by: Simon Louvaki
Lyn Farel wrote:
[
I thought that admiral was called rogue by the Navy after the incident ?


This is true, the Federation effectively washed their hands of Noir when he did what he did, the fact remains however that the Caldari people were outraged by this and saw it was a racially motivated attack. In the aftermath, Caldari Prime burned with riots and the State reacted in retaliation by invading. Pilot Andreus has made it clear he doesn't care what anyone outside the Federation think in any case.

Andreus Ixiris wrote:
Valerie Valate wrote:
Who was flying it ?

Clone impostor. As to who precisely the impostor was, we may never know, but whoever was inside Noir's body, it wasn't Noir.


and you persecute the religious for 'fantasies'? very mature.

-- "The weak of mind are quick to judge with slightest tempt; Thus fools go forth to spread false word." - The Scriptures, Book of Trials 2:13 - 2:21

--"At the narrow passage, there is no brother and no friend." - Hyasyoda Proverb
Andreus Ixiris
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#56 - 2013-02-16 17:06:38 UTC
Simon Louvaki wrote:
and you persecute the religious for 'fantasies'? very mature.

It's not a fantasy when one can provide evidence to back it up. Like I said, Verin explains it a lot better than me so you could go and ask him, but given your attitude I wouldn't be at all surprised if he told you to screw off.

Andreus Ixiris > A Civire without a chin is barely a Civire at all.

Pieter Tuulinen > He'd be Civirely disadvantaged, Andreus.

Andreus Ixiris > ...

Andreus Ixiris > This is why we're at war.
Simon Louvaki
Khaldari InnoTektoniks and Analytical Solutions
#57 - 2013-02-16 17:13:11 UTC
Andreus Ixiris wrote:
Simon Louvaki wrote:
and you persecute the religious for 'fantasies'? very mature.

It's not a fantasy when one can provide evidence to back it up. Like I said, Verin explains it a lot better than me so you could go and ask him, but given your attitude I wouldn't be at all surprised if he told you to screw off.


I think I get an sadistic amount of enjoyment out of watching you preach about 'attitude'.

-- "The weak of mind are quick to judge with slightest tempt; Thus fools go forth to spread false word." - The Scriptures, Book of Trials 2:13 - 2:21

--"At the narrow passage, there is no brother and no friend." - Hyasyoda Proverb
Andreus Ixiris
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#58 - 2013-02-16 17:45:33 UTC
Simon Louvaki wrote:
I think I get an sadistic amount of enjoyment out of watching you preach about 'attitude'.

Which is one of the problems with your attitude.

Andreus Ixiris > A Civire without a chin is barely a Civire at all.

Pieter Tuulinen > He'd be Civirely disadvantaged, Andreus.

Andreus Ixiris > ...

Andreus Ixiris > This is why we're at war.
Simon Louvaki
Khaldari InnoTektoniks and Analytical Solutions
#59 - 2013-02-16 18:00:13 UTC
Andreus Ixiris wrote:
Simon Louvaki wrote:
I think I get an sadistic amount of enjoyment out of watching you preach about 'attitude'.

Which is one of the problems with your attitude.


I inspire to be as witty as you one day Andreus. Maybe one day....

-- "The weak of mind are quick to judge with slightest tempt; Thus fools go forth to spread false word." - The Scriptures, Book of Trials 2:13 - 2:21

--"At the narrow passage, there is no brother and no friend." - Hyasyoda Proverb
Andreus Ixiris
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#60 - 2013-02-16 18:37:11 UTC
Simon Louvaki wrote:
I inspire to be as witty as you one day Andreus. Maybe one day....

You might try working that massive stick out of your behind.

Andreus Ixiris > A Civire without a chin is barely a Civire at all.

Pieter Tuulinen > He'd be Civirely disadvantaged, Andreus.

Andreus Ixiris > ...

Andreus Ixiris > This is why we're at war.