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So what Anti-Missile/Rocket defenses will be provided by CCP?

Author
Tyberius Franklin
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#21 - 2013-02-14 02:49:14 UTC
Tul Breetai wrote:
Dude, he said he wants to change the way they work. CHANGE THE WAY THEY WORK. CHANGE.

Ah, thank you. Apparently I did misread.
Lili Lu
#22 - 2013-02-14 03:19:41 UTC  |  Edited by: Lili Lu
Paikis wrote:
Anti missile defenses already exist. They are called (in no particular order):

Afterburners
Micro Warp Drives
Armour tanks (i.e NOT shield extenders/rigs)
Smartbombs
Defender missiles (LOL, but still, they exist)
Skirmish Warfare Link - Rapid Deployment I and II
Skirmish Warfare Link - Evasive Maneuvers I and II
Low and High grade Halo implants
Low and High grade Snake implants
'Rogue' Navigation implants

And none of these things are missile specifc, and not also simultaneously anti-turret, except the broken defendersLol, and smartbombs which only work in a fleet situation and even then not so well. Ugh Smarties are a better anti-drone defense than anti-missile.

The tracking disrupter (and TE and TC) changes are still stated to be in the pipeline. There's been no statment that the idea has been abandonned. It's just that they recognize the danger of either making missiles too powerful or tracking disruptors too mandatory.

Tracking disruptors already royally **** over turrets and many ships the spew missiles sport them and roll over turret ships for this very reason. The only way I see them implementing this is if they decently nerf the effects on turrets, and make the new missile effects weak also (just as they will have to make the missile effects of TEs and TCs as well). If the effects were made weak enough on non-bonused boats then we might see less use of TDs on so many ships not bonused for them and more use of ships bonused for them.

As for the above bandied damp idea, frankly damps are fine atm. Where this proposed effect could make a difference is with the painters themselves. Painter boats are rarely worth using. But then CCP would have to reevaluate the rather pronounced smaller sigs on Minmatar ships and especially the ships bonused for painters.

Absent either of these, CCP will have to come up with something very new and different like a chaff/flare launcher or some such that is not "my ship only" specific like the failure defenders are.

As things are now there really is no specific missile defense. You either have enough hp/resist tank or enough speed tank to mitigate the missile damage. Which again are things that are not missile specific.
Paikis
Vapour Holdings
#23 - 2013-02-14 08:12:34 UTC
Any tracking disruptor change that messes with missiles will have to come with a base damage buff for missiles, due to being required to fit tracking enhancers instead of a BCU.
Debora Tsung
Perkone
Caldari State
#24 - 2013-02-14 09:06:16 UTC
Tul Breetai wrote:
. CHANGE THE WAY THEY WORK. CHANGE.


Yes we can! :)

Stupidity should be a bannable offense.

Fighting back is more fun than not.

Sticky: AFK Cloaking Thread It's not pretty, but it's there.

John Ratcliffe
Tradors'R'us
IChooseYou Alliance
#25 - 2013-02-14 13:38:55 UTC
Meditril wrote:
Hi All,

I remember that CCP discussed some time ago to make Tracking Disruptors also work on missiles. However, since this has the potential to completely break missiles they decided to wait a bit and rework their ideas. Current status is that Defender Missiles are still broken and I haven't heard anything about Anti-Missile defenses recently. Did I miss something or is this topic already burried?

Regards.
Med


Hopefully that will never be implemented. Missiles have enough issues as it is.

Plus ça change, plus c'est la même chose

Seraph IX Basarab
Outer Path
Seraphim Division
#26 - 2013-02-14 18:35:37 UTC
Tyberius Franklin wrote:
Tul Breetai wrote:
Dude, he said he wants to change the way they work. CHANGE THE WAY THEY WORK. CHANGE.

Ah, thank you. Apparently I did misread.



Exactly...so lower the scan res of the ship being affected AND making your ship appear smaller sig wise to targeted ship. This in effect would make a TD for missiles.
Carniflex
StarHunt
Mordus Angels
#27 - 2013-02-15 06:22:21 UTC
I would like it when tracking disruption would affect missiles. That would mean that tracking computers and enchancens would affect them too giving me something other than target painters or BCU's to fit in the mids/lows. And ofc lets not forget the tracking links which can be pretty substantial when applied from a logi with bonuses to these.

Implementation could be pretty straightforward. Optimal range script lowers either flight time or missile speed - I would prefer flight time and tracking disruption script could increase / decrease missile signature. Raven might be pretty good at spanking frigs then if you drop the cruise missile sig down to ~50 with 3x shadow Serpentis tracking link from a minmatar logi orbiting it.

Here, sanity... niiiice sanity, come to daddy... okay, that's a good sanity... THWONK! GOT the bastard.

Gabriel Karade
Coreli Corporation
Pandemic Legion
#28 - 2013-02-15 07:34:15 UTC  |  Edited by: Gabriel Karade
Double (or even triple*) missile damage, halve (third) launcher ROF and make all ship 'missile damage bonuses' ROF only. Then add in a proper CIWS (racial flavours) that can target the missiles - we know this is possible as in Castor you could manually target missiles to shoot them down.

In doing those 'utility missile slots' that have been around forever are not a complete waste of space - if a missile hits, it really hurts, but can countered by a working CIWS that you could have installed instead. Also it lowers some of the strain on the server.

* This would put the alpha strike of a cruise Raven (faction) to around the same ballpark as a full rack of 1400's, Torp (faction) alpha strike (with BCU's) would be peak over the 15K mark.

War Machine: http://www.eveonline.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=386293

Meditril
Hoplite Brigade
Ushra'Khan
#29 - 2013-02-15 09:26:01 UTC
Carniflex wrote:
I would like it when tracking disruption would affect missiles. That would mean that tracking computers and enchancens would affect them too giving me something other than target painters or BCU's to fit in the mids/lows. And ofc lets not forget the tracking links which can be pretty substantial when applied from a logi with bonuses to these.

Implementation could be pretty straightforward. Optimal range script lowers either flight time or missile speed - I would prefer flight time and tracking disruption script could increase / decrease missile signature. Raven might be pretty good at spanking frigs then if you drop the cruise missile sig down to ~50 with 3x shadow Serpentis tracking link from a minmatar logi orbiting it.

Exactly this would make missiles completely overpowered because it would allow you to switch just per Tracking Computer Script from a very very long range weapon to a very very precise and frigate weapon. Currently logic is... you can go snipy but then are vulnerable to close range attacks or you go brawly which makes you vulnerable to long range attackes. You would get benefits of both worlds without the penalities of both! Bad idea in terms of game balance.
Carniflex
StarHunt
Mordus Angels
#30 - 2013-02-15 10:19:45 UTC
Meditril wrote:
Carniflex wrote:
I would like it when tracking disruption would affect missiles. That would mean that tracking computers and enchancens would affect them too giving me something other than target painters or BCU's to fit in the mids/lows. And ofc lets not forget the tracking links which can be pretty substantial when applied from a logi with bonuses to these.

Implementation could be pretty straightforward. Optimal range script lowers either flight time or missile speed - I would prefer flight time and tracking disruption script could increase / decrease missile signature. Raven might be pretty good at spanking frigs then if you drop the cruise missile sig down to ~50 with 3x shadow Serpentis tracking link from a minmatar logi orbiting it.

Exactly this would make missiles completely overpowered because it would allow you to switch just per Tracking Computer Script from a very very long range weapon to a very very precise and frigate weapon. Currently logic is... you can go snipy but then are vulnerable to close range attacks or you go brawly which makes you vulnerable to long range attackes. You would get benefits of both worlds without the penalities of both! Bad idea in terms of game balance.


Well - I could also live with it if it would be non-scripted mod and disrupters specifically for missiles. So you can either fit "missile tracking diruptor" that dirupts missile range or a diroutpr that disrupts missile sig or explosion speed. And same for the boost modules and tracking links.

If I could make my torpedos to go 100 km I would quite happily use them again in PvE. How hard it could be - just throw three faction tracking links on a logi alt orbiting you. For turrets a shadow serpentis tracking link with optimal range script from minmatar logi was giving pretty substantial bonus - if I remeber correct then approx 45% per link.

Having 3x +45% range links on a ship would increase the range from 40 km up to about 100 km with stacking penalties taken into account.

Here, sanity... niiiice sanity, come to daddy... okay, that's a good sanity... THWONK! GOT the bastard.

Ra1ne
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#31 - 2013-02-15 11:25:03 UTC
i wonder whether they could implement something like the airforce use, chaff's and flares ?

I know its similar to defenders but lets be honest, they really suck lol. Its fairly often that you get left with a spare high slot (not necessarily a a turret/launcher hardpoint but that one slot where you dont have much spare grid/cpu etc to put something like a nos/neut.

They could bring out missile counter measures which would be a launcher of sorts but not require a hardpoint to fit. you could have choice of flares ar chaff's, one being more effective but much slower cycle time and other less so effective but faster cycle or something like that.
GreenSeed
#32 - 2013-02-15 12:06:17 UTC
Seraph IX Basarab wrote:
I had always recommended that the sensor damp with sig res script making your signature size smaller to the ship you target.

...

sensor damps don't make your sig smaller, they make the sensor resolution on the targeted ship smaller.

no difference in DPS, only locking time.
To mare
Advanced Technology
#33 - 2013-02-15 12:32:43 UTC
Paikis wrote:
Anti missile defenses already exist. They are called (in no particular order):

Afterburners
Micro Warp Drives
Armour tanks (i.e NOT shield extenders/rigs)
Smartbombs
Defender missiles (LOL, but still, they exist)
Skirmish Warfare Link - Rapid Deployment I and II
Skirmish Warfare Link - Evasive Maneuvers I and II
Low and High grade Halo implants
Low and High grade Snake implants
'Rogue' Navigation implants

wich except for smartbombs they are also effective as anti turrets since a better speed/sig ratio screw up gun tracking as well.


oh btw im totally contrary to TD affecting missile just for weapon diversity sake.
Seraph IX Basarab
Outer Path
Seraphim Division
#34 - 2013-02-17 05:00:29 UTC
GreenSeed wrote:
Seraph IX Basarab wrote:
I had always recommended that the sensor damp with sig res script making your signature size smaller to the ship you target.

...

sensor damps don't make your sig smaller, they make the sensor resolution on the targeted ship smaller.

no difference in DPS, only locking time.



No sh!t....learn to read
Katran Luftschreck
Royal Ammatar Engineering Corps
#35 - 2013-02-17 06:55:33 UTC
What I'd like to see is point-defense guns.

Just add a module called "Point Defense Tracking." When activated, all your regular turrets can be toggled to "point defense mode" and they'll only aim at any non-friendly missiles that come within range. Said guns get +50% to tracking speed while active.

Why this is Cool:

1) Any non-friendly missile in range means that you can actually cover your buddies, like an AEGIS ship.
2) Things like tracking and weapon range actually come into play. Setting large guns to point defense probably won't be as effective as a destroyer fitted with eight autocannons (again, AEGIS ship).
3) Not a "one to rule them all solution." Want to defend with autocannons? Go ahead. Lasers? Fine. Railguns? Give it a shot. Any ship that can mount the basic module could then take a stab at missile defense.
4) Doesn't cripply the ship entirely for other roles. Want to go back to shooting at enemies? Turn module back off.

http://youtu.be/t0q2F8NsYQ0

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