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Battleships still relevant?
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Satav
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#1 - 2011-10-26 15:37:21 UTC
Just thought i'd throw a question out there to see what u guys think.

Will Battleships still be relevant tools in large fleet warfare after the addition of tier 3 BCs?

Since a lot (not all) BS fleets are alpha fleets anyway is there any point in flying a BS anymore?

Looking forward to your input.
Jenn Makanen
Doomheim
#2 - 2011-10-26 15:56:38 UTC
Not having a paper thin tank?

Equal numbers against equal numbers, the higher tank wins. Unless you are foolish and just have everyone target a single ship, when you could be targeting two and taking both out.
Kamden Line
Sovereign Citizen and other Tax Evasion Schemes
#3 - 2011-10-26 16:00:27 UTC
Jenn Makanen wrote:
Not having a paper thin tank?

Equal numbers against equal numbers, the higher tank wins. Unless you are foolish and just have everyone target a single ship, when you could be targeting two and taking both out.


Do you even play this game?
Karl Planck
Perkone
Caldari State
#4 - 2011-10-26 16:05:06 UTC
Of course they will be. If i had a guess, for fleet fights i would say BS's are going to be the new anti-support fleet ship. With caps being able to do f*ck all to sub caps, BS hordes would demolish the new bc's. The new BC's seem like they are going to be primarliy anti-cap ships (lower sig radius than reg bc, huge damage, low tank).

But thats only a guess

I has all the eve inactivity
Algathas
Swamp Panthers
SONS of BANE
#5 - 2011-10-26 16:11:08 UTC
If you look at why alpha fleets are around then it will give you your answer.

The alpha fleet is designed to overcome the buffer tank of a ship so fast that the logistics don't have time to rep it.

If the fleet is made of ships with not enough tank, then they will pop before they can even get reps or in spite of being repped.

I agree with the poster that said the new ships are probably anti-cap weapons. If they made the drones/superweapons not work on smaller ships as well, and have smaller ships that can field large guns, those small ships would be weak against their similar sized counterparts but may do well vs the caps.
Vimsy Vortis
Shoulda Checked Local
Break-A-Wish Foundation
#6 - 2011-10-26 16:26:38 UTC
Vindicators will always be relevant.
Borun Tal
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#7 - 2011-10-26 16:45:12 UTC
The new ships strike me as great gank tools... Pirate
Kaaeliaa
Tyrannos Sunset
#8 - 2011-10-26 18:29:45 UTC
Here's a great reason not to use large fleets of the new paper-thin BCs in fleet action: stealth bombers (who even get brand new tech 2 bomb launchers, if the leaks are true). Battleships can still have much bigger buffers.

"Do not lift the veil. Do not show the door. Do not split the dream."
Dibblerette
Solitude-Industries
#9 - 2011-10-27 01:19:37 UTC
Kaaeliaa wrote:
Here's a great reason not to use large fleets of the new paper-thin BCs in fleet action: stealth bombers (who even get brand new tech 2 bomb launchers, if the leaks are true). Battleships can still have much bigger buffers.

Also, drone bays. According to leaks, the gallente T3 BC is the only one capable of fielding drones, and then only one set of lights, unbonused.
Katie Frost
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#10 - 2011-10-27 01:31:38 UTC
Remember that this is a T3 ship. If T3 Cruisers are anything to go by, the T3 Battlecruisers will be expensive to field. Battleships will still be a more financially viable option for large fleets.

So if T3 BCs tend to mimic T1 BS's in DPS and even in tank, they will carry 3-4x the pricetag.... so yes, BS class is still very relevant.
Demon View
Doomheim
#11 - 2011-10-27 01:39:50 UTC
Katie Frost wrote:
Remember that this is a T3 ship. If T3 Cruisers are anything to go by,


Tier 3, not Tech 3.
Goose99
#12 - 2011-10-27 02:25:05 UTC  |  Edited by: Goose99
Kaaeliaa wrote:
Here's a great reason not to use large fleets of the new paper-thin BCs in fleet action: stealth bombers (who even get brand new tech 2 bomb launchers, if the leaks are true). Battleships can still have much bigger buffers.


They have much smaller sigs than current bcs though. Plus given the cost of those bcs, it's dubious how smart using sb blob against them really is...

The other thing is, due to the nature of alpha blobs, a fast small sig boat can actually live longer than buffer BS when against a lot of 1400s. Make a blob of those fast small sig boats, and you have some serious staying power.
Mekhana
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#13 - 2011-10-27 06:15:43 UTC
The new BCs aren't made to take out Battleships 1v1. Though they probably can do it very well in wolfpacks.

Vide longe er eros di Luminaire VII, uni canse pra krage e determiniex! Sange por Sange! Descanse bravex eros, mie freires. Mortir por vostre Liberete, farmilie, ide e amis. lons Proviste sen mort! Luminaire liber mas! 
Cannibal Kane
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#14 - 2011-10-27 08:31:46 UTC
Katie Frost wrote:
Remember that this is a T3 ship. If T3 Cruisers are anything to go by, the T3 Battlecruisers will be expensive to field. Battleships will still be a more financially viable option for large fleets.

So if T3 BCs tend to mimic T1 BS's in DPS and even in tank, they will carry 3-4x the pricetag.... so yes, BS class is still very relevant.


Lol Tier 3 is not the same as Tech 3.

These are Tier 3 BC's.

One universal Demerit for you.

"Kane is the End Boss of Highsec." -Psychotic Monk
Cillet Baang Scott
Allowance Pester Dread
#15 - 2011-10-27 08:34:54 UTC  |  Edited by: Cillet Baang Scott
I fly loki and battleships near exclusively. The rest of my corp fly battleships maybe half to the time as well. It's stupid to say they are past their day.

-Machs
-Nightmares
-pirate BS in general
-baddons (consistantly ahead of canes on evekill top 20)
-maels
-tempests
-RR BS
-Solo hypes

^ All of that basically.

This patch is abut balance. I don't think CCP are gonna f*** up twice in the same yr.
Wylee Coyote
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#16 - 2011-10-27 14:43:45 UTC
If the leaked tier3 BC info is true (and I'm reading it correctly), the new BCs have 8 highs but only 4-5 turrets (and can fit BS sized weapons). I am unable to understand how a ship with only 4-5 BS sized weapons, no drones (except lights for Gallente) and (supposed) crap for tank will replace a BS with 8 BS sized weapons (6 for Dominix), BS hp and tank and drones.
Satav
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#17 - 2011-10-27 16:19:08 UTC
Thank you for the constructive input. I appreciate all your comments.
Onictus
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#18 - 2011-10-29 10:42:13 UTC
Wylee Coyote wrote:
If the leaked tier3 BC info is true (and I'm reading it correctly), the new BCs have 8 highs but only 4-5 turrets (and can fit BS sized weapons). I am unable to understand how a ship with only 4-5 BS sized weapons, no drones (except lights for Gallente) and (supposed) crap for tank will replace a BS with 8 BS sized weapons (6 for Dominix), BS hp and tank and drones.



Exactly, I might start taking my nano-bs's out more just to bitchslap T3 BCs.

It'll be a new wrinkle, that is for certain.
Hidden Snake
Inglorious-Basterds
#19 - 2011-10-29 16:12:43 UTC
If they will have bs alfa or 700+ dps I am game ;) .... Gank/some nano or buffer and lot of fun. Bss are buffer fleet monsters ... I might get back to pvp from my meditation.
Aessaya
Independent treasure hunters
#20 - 2011-10-29 19:58:04 UTC
I think the new BCs will be somewhere around Command Ships for dps and nowhere near for tank, but maneuverable as other BCs. Should be great for small/medium wolfpacks to pick off stragglers and vanish before the main fleet reacts.

There's one thing, though, that worries me: the fate of HACs. They've already seen a lot of decrease in usage since nano nerf and Tech3 introduction, they vere hit greatly by tier 2 BC introduction as well. I'm afraid these new BCs might strike a finishing blow on this once universally feared shipclass or leave them only a niche role (think vagabonds). Yet i eagerly avait the rise of sniper bc gangs made up of tier 3 BCs :)

Ah, you seek meaning? Then listen to the music, not the song.
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