EVE Information Portal

I think "big difference" may be overstating it somewhat, no?

Skills wise (which is what we're talking about here) the difference between them is a grand total of 3 hours and 1.5 million ISK.

For the new Command ship prereqs:



Take Sleipnir as this is a 'shield' ship you would fly after training CS:
Think about the times it can dip into armor before logi / local reps catch on, Armored Warfare bonus helps with a little more buffer before the ship explodes.
Consider that it is a bc, so Skirmish Warfare bonus helps it get into, around and out of a fight faster.
Contemplate that faster locking generally means faster application of DPS, so Information Warfare helps here.

A better negitive arguement to this would have that the Siege Wafare skill does not match the armored CS. However, I find I like those few seconds that a tiny shield buffer will give me before I need to be worried about my armor tank, so Siege Warfare is beneficial here. Also the shield/gank Astarte would like to say hi. And btw, the Damnation / Absolution enjoy that agility bonus.

As Freighdee Katt said "Shield fleets "don't need" Hull Upgrades, Signature Analysis, or Evasive Maneuvering either"

To agree and add to this solid line of thinking, there are many skills that have a indirect positive effect on a ship which are not 'needed' but very helpful. They could have used other skills that did not really enhance the ship. In the removal of the Cruiser / Assault / Heavy Assault / Logi skills which had no direct positve effect on the ship and replacement of skills that do have a positive effect, I believe that the Dev's have decided on the correct course of action for Command Ships.

having ship skill u can fly the ship, and learn the EAF/interdictor skill pass lvl 1.

So lets say I have BC at 5 with all racial cruiser skills at 3, same for destroyers at 5 and all racial frigates at 3, will CCP automatically assign me the racial BC and destroyer skills at 5 each or will they just give me skill points so I can allocate them?

I like the way of thinking like "no low specialism to fly a big tech II ship" . personally for me, that is fitting my trained skills very well and besides, it really makes sense.

But i ask myself, how about the pilot who decides to fly a tech II Battleship with according firepower. What i try to ask is, if this changes are planned to set accordingly to wepon specialisations? what absolutly would make sense as well, since a artillery operator doesn´t have to be a pro in Handguns. (something like "/small turret III / medium turret III / heavy turret V", and if the loss in training time is to much, add " /motion prediction III / Rapid Fireing III / sharpshooter III ... " to it. Is something like that in plan?

I also got somewhat "made interested" into the Command Ship Changes. I also like the idea here, to take out the whole tertiery skill. But lvl 5 in all link specialisations is a bit to much of the good. No "specialisation rquireie argument" and than force every Command ship commander to Lvl 5 the different boosts? Lvl 3 or 4 for each, and say Warefare link specialist to lvl 5. That would cover the "all arround boost argument" for "the specific Roll of this particular command ship" ass well. Remember it can fit 3 Boost modules,and each cathegory of Link specialisition has 3 Modules availeble. And if this isn´t enough training time yet, you could always add a Wing Command level, since these is a COMMAND Ship - in the end.

Industrials.. to fly an Iteron 5 with aprox 35km³ Cargo (with rigs and hullupgrades) sounds pritty nice, but besides a few Pilots who want the slightly difference in speed, there would be not much use anymore for all five Itron Versions. Not to speak about the hole between Industrial I (Iteron clases) and Industrial V (Blockaderunner). Basically i´d say if between the Iterons is a bigger difference in speed/Armor/Shield/whatever, then it makes sense. Also Maybe a new ship class/lvl on Industrials Lvl 3 wich lies somewhere in corgo capacities of, dunno 50-100 Km³ (what also would be another change to the "Orca Transport Ship thingy"). I can only talk out of the sight of Gellente ships, but i´d say this (maybe) somehow could be aplied to other races, ass well. Besides there is a big hole between "Industrial Class Haulers" and "Frighter class Haulers" anyway. Especially when the Frighters get the need for Advanced Spaceship Command V, then !

What i see so far is that the basic abylity to use more ships with smaller time effort is a good way to give new Player a faster "i got a shiny new toy" effect and therefore more ambition to stay in the game. thats basically a good - and maybe a necessary thing, given the complexity of EVE. I have to admit, that this kind of achivement also was the reason, why i looked further into the game, in my beginnings.
On second sight, i don´t know what a aged pilot really get out of it. For me, it looks a bit like, fast abylity for new ships and therefore a longer stay of new players, and either they find their playstyle in that time or they quit when the next achievement gets to far away.
So if my guts are right, and that would be the real reason behind that particular reballance, then i would see a lot of other (and/or) additional ways to archieve that goal with other (possible) game mechanics rather than make Navy Issue Battleship Available after 3 Days of Playing (instead of 7 Days). And much of them would be much more interesting for Newbies. Atlest it would have been for me, at that time.

After having read through this thread, its clear that there is allot of confusion over the basic principal, of :

Having the skills to fly a ship is one thing, having the support skills to be able to run / fly it effectively is another.

Please dont bur the lines between should be support skills & skills that are actually needed to be able to fly different ships.
If your going to say a certain ship now has this role or that role, thats fine, but leave the rest to the players to choose how they intend to make use of it, instead of incorporating skill requirements into the ships prerequist's.

Its each individual's players choice as to what support skills they choose to train, in order to run the ship the way they want to, for the purpose they intend to use it as opposed to the use you say it should be. Regardless if thats a good or bad choice.


I also question the removal of racial BS5 from capitals. Having BS 5 is nice granted, but with the intended changes there is clearly now no way, anyone would bother to train it and those that have, given a choice wouldnt have bothered either because its not needed. So they rightly so, can feel ripped off having spent time trainning and earning skillpoints that they could of applied elsewhere.

CCP Two Questions:

1) So If applying JCD & JFC requirements to carriers, then why isnt it being applied to dreads and titans ?
And on what basis did you determine that JDC3 & JFC4 were appropriate when you know full well JCD4 & JFC4 are the basic requirements for low/nul sec alliances. WH space alliances/corps are another story again, may not even use need/use these skills.

Something thats always puzzeled me is:

2) Why dose the Jump Portal Generation skill, only effected Titan bridge fuel usage and not Black Ops jump portal fuel usage/consumption ?
Makes sense that it should effect both right, but dosent in reality, when it should.

And what if I'm flying a Charon around right now with Advance Spaceship Command 4, and according to the blog I'll need it at 5, will I still be able to fly it after the implementation?

Yes you will be able to fly your Charon, you will just not be able to train the Freighter skill up any further until you get ASC to V.

Overall I like the skill changes, CC skills could do with some tweaking imho. 1st thing I did after reading the Dev Blog was get Mining Frigate Skill Books and trian them to III on all my chars.

I am amazed ccp even reads these forums anymore...Or haven't sold their brains yet...I am definitly considering selling mine after following this thread since the blog released.

The dev blog is pretty clear(Sure it has some vague points, but all of that has been answered by devs)

If you got the skills to fly a ship right now, you can fly it after the change and can still train the relevant ship skill up even if you no longer have the prerequisited skills.(As long as you got the skill injected you can train it)

The Command Ship changes are for the NORMAL boosting skills, NOT the LINKS. So as a boosting character, you should have them anyway.

They will be rebalancing the industrials, so don't be too worried about the Iteron's till atleast a month before release since we have no idea what they will consist of once tiericide hits.

And it was your choice to train for a capital with the current skill prereqs, you can now fly it so why do you even care if that changes? It wont affect you anymore since you can already fly your capital. And if you ever step inside a shiny BS once again, you will be glad with that lvl 5 skill I'm sure.

I'm not saying that the prereqs for carriers are perfect with what CCP has in mind. But just raging about it won't help, give some real feedback about it.