EVE General Discussion

I completely disagree with the post.

And for me the whole point got blown with the reasoning behind throwing a ship out to die in a drunken stupor cause the insurance runs out. I love EVE's complexity and meta and whatever, but it's at that point I feel like I am playing the game, just going out throwing space pixels at someone's face, just cause "the insurance will out". And although I would do that anyway,one more reason is always a good reason to pvp and another push to combat dynamics in the game. ISK inflation is only an issue if ISK becomes the driving power of the game.To many spreadsheets and seriousness sometimes. I say give pod insurance too! Make people take out their shiny pods to die in a drunken stupor!

I feel like there's an obligatory "burn the null-sec alliances " banner needed to be thrown around, just to promote some more pvp.

no

it provides no benefit for me.


RISK is what makes eve work.

the fact that when you undock, you have something to lose if you screw up.

The longer you play the game, the better you should become and not losing your clone. Sure, it'll still happen, but you should be better and better as time goes on.

If you remove that RISK, then you remove part of the fun of undocking.

if you remove that RISK, then what risk will you remove next?

I say double clone prices, and half insurance costs. That'll add some excitement to eve.

successful possibly, depends on what their goal was.

WoW is hugely popular, but that doesn't mean EvE should try to be the same.

Yes, it has more tedium for not gaining anything real. The true EvE experience is about mundane upkeep and bills. Human factor, Ha ha! human.

Just wanted to share a bit more information in regards to the, "Just train an alt to enjoy small ships." crowd.

Let's say you want to enjoy flying one race assault ship - only. Including all the core skills associated, your optimized learning plan is...

*drum roll*

589 days, 13 hours, 54 minutes and 5 seconds.

That's right folks. Over a year and a half of training an alt to fully use an assault frigate to the capacity your main already does. Total skill points invested is 28,085,020. Which means you need the clone upgrade that covers 32,800,00 skill points. That lower one wont cut it. Granted your clone now cost 2,990,00 ISK; you still had to train for over a year and a half to get to that point.

I guess one would say training alt characters is the best bad plan to work around a terrible game mechanic that clone upgrades are. Clone upgrades are just as bad as learning skills. Perhaps it made sense at the time when it was designed, but the game marches on and needs to evolve.

Being against their removal because you chose to train an alt and are now invested in retrained core skills does not mean this mechanic should stay. That is just the same as those who proclaimed that learning skills should stay because they had to train them. So if they had to suffer, so should everyone else.

Again people. Over a year and a half for one race assault ship. Oh and the assault ship I picked was the armor tanked Retribution. If I picked a Gallente assault ship, that would mean I would have to train drone skills, which means the plan would take even longer. Vengeance you say? Well that is another weapon system...

Fining people 20% of their entire wallet balance and asset worth every time they undock if they don't fly their ship in a very specific pattern would also make eve hard.

It would also be a really stupid game mechanic.
Clone upgrade costs are another stupid game mechanic.

or spend some isk and buy a character that's already trained.

seriously, put in the time, or pay someone else to, or better yet just train everything to level 4. most 5's are not necessary. i'm so sick of the gimme gimme gimme crap. go play skyrim on godmode or something, that should appease your ego for awhie.

Undoubtedly, quite a lot of people are going to be bumped up another bracket with the implementation of racial ship skill change from the latest dev blog:

I'm rather sad that CCP hasn't addressed clone bill costs already in the same way as learning skills. If the cost wasn't so exponential or was capped it would help... There's a difference between a hardcore game that is fun and a hardcore game that discourages fun/pvp with **** moves based on how long you've been playing.

I think it's reasonable that players with better support skills put more ISK on the line, but it's a fair point that many non-combat skills do not make you more combat effective yet increase your clone costs. Making an alt for frigate PvP is one option. Maybe CCP could make it possible to create a "downgraded" jump clone that can have as much SP removed from it as you want, and is capped at that SP, reducing clone costs. Your skill training continues on your other clones as usual.

I had stopped training before 92m SP on my PVP character . Cheap and cheerful T1 drunken roams cost me more than the cost of a small flotilla of such ships already, unfortunately I have BC V and Dest V so my clone costs are going to go up significantly when the extra 6m SP takes me up a clone.

I believe in 'Don't fly what you can't afford to lose' as the essence of EVE, but setting the floor to that cost of loss at 6x the cost of a cheap ship is a disincentive to PVP not based on game balance. If I am in a cheap ship the chances are that I am only utillising a faction of those skills so the penalty is purely for being too old and not having a stable of characters, I just do not see the logic.