Assembly Hall

A few things come to mind. First, this idea goes way too far. Replicating exact player behavior for a large number of PvP scenarios isn't what PvE developers should waste their time with. Teaching PvP is all fine and dandy, but the best way to learn it is to go out and PvP. It's development cost free, does the job better and allows PvE devs to focus on actual PvE content. In the end PvP is about dealing with other individual people. Fighting NPCs is never going to fully prepare you for it.

Second, why are you worried about excessive farming in a set PvP tutorial missions? Are you suggesting some heavy rewards for a system that is primarily meant for training? Players aren't supposed to do them as a profession. The point is to do them until you get the basics, then get out and PvP. There is no need to give incentives for people to keep grinding them, so give them below normal missioning income potential or no income at all.

Third, it seems like you're just afraid to pay the learning fees of actual PvP. I'm not talking about just the ISK cost, but the reality of having to repeatedly lose to other people in a competition. Your PvP learning missions aren't going to change this no matter how many of them you do. Actual players aren't in it to teach you and offer a predictable challenging encounter. They're in it to win at all costs. They will post KMs and pod you. They will laugh at you mistakes and tease you about them. It's just part of the game and you're going to have to grow a bit thicker skin, if you ever hope to get into PvP.

Fourth, tactics change. Replicating the commonly used tactics of the current game will only be useful for so long. Many tactics that ruled the battlefield of the past are bad or impossible today. I question the rationality of trying to replicate them with a NPC mechanic, that is a poor imitation of the real deal and will be a constant drain for dev resources. It will also teach bad habits, that won't work in actual PvP or you don't want to teach to people. Is station camping basics really something you want to show and teach to everyone? When you create a tutorial for it, you're showing people it's the way the game is meant to be played no matter your intentions. I'm not saying there is anything wrong with the tactic, but I'm saying it's lame enough, that you don't want to give hand holding guides on how to engage in it.

I posted an idea long ago for B.

https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=1408239

Only if you don't read the mission briefing (or look at the warnings in local).

Most newbies I've come across always assume the destruction of your ship in that particular mission to be a glitch or bug and not part of the mission itself.

What is needed is a mission where losing your ship is clearly stated in the briefing and is more or less an actual "goal."

The most challenging part of the game is PvP, and you have won the fight before you have started, if the opponent is ignorant of the game mechanics. PvEs job is to teach game mechanics. PvE should be a challenge. the better the AI, the better.

I would like to see missions that emulate a large number of PvP scenarios, this is what I think PvE should be all about..



I'm not, I just added it so people wouldn't respond with some long winded argument about farming.



No, but I dont see a problem with providing an 'against the computer' challenge for players of the game, if the time/fun ratios are right, they will be another choice for PvE players.


I wont quote you directly....You simply argue that, PvP tactics should only be taught by PvP.


I think your whole argument revolves around PvE being 'PvE' and PvP being PvP and never the twain shall meet.

Why should 'against the computer' be a completely different to PvP in play style?

I would like missions that let me experience these tactics in a PvE scenario in highsec against rats which dont pod, dont loot your wreck and dont post KM.

No, I'm not expecting the AI to deliver that level of experience.

NPC escalation may be predictable, but the celestials they warp to and safe spots they make don't have to be static, in fact it would be a lot more complicated to make it like that. There has to be a level of randomness, else there is simply no point.

Teach the mechanics of EVE and put them to practice in PvE, so when players do attempt to PvP, they don't sit there thinking 'its because I don't have AWU5 that I failed'.

I'm not suggesting these missions give the players a green line in space - to manually fly along, I'm suggesting a simple, interesting mission which develops skills relevant to the game generally.