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So i wanna mine in lowsec...
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Dave Stark
#41 - 2013-02-01 17:33:42 UTC
Dracvlad wrote:
Dave Stark wrote:
Dracvlad wrote:
Dave Stark,

Obviously you do not mine


except mining is all i do, so good luck with that one.

anyway, i get it, you want to be self sufficient. however don't use "i want to waste half of my time to say "i did it all"" as a justification to call low sec a good place to mine.


Apologies but this sentence "if you want to have fun you wouldn't be mining" made me think that, in which case your fixated on yield and I understand that, my point of view its a fun place to mine because you have to use your wits to do it, plus the I did it all and not rely on Concord, and it can be profitable. Obviously if you are a full on miner with multiple accounts and an Orca with bonuses you would not go near low sec with a barge poll, but I don't think the OP was looking at it from your prespective, and I wanted to give him mine as I do what he wants to do, or at least I believe so.


As for the RL comparison with low sec by another poster, its like getting copper out of the Democratic Republic of Congo instead of Australia...


OP was new, and wanted to mine in low sec.

so all we did was point out it's a **** place to mine (hence why practically nobody does it) to save him the trouble of losing a ship and wasting his time.
Krixtal Icefluxor
INLAND EMPIRE Galactic
#42 - 2013-02-01 18:36:05 UTC
Dracvlad wrote:
Dave Stark,

Obviously you do not mine..........


Thank goodness it's not just me who notices this.

"He has mounted his hind-legs, and blown crass vapidities through the bowel of his neck."  - Ambrose Bierce on Oscar Wilde's Lecture in San Francisco 1882
Krixtal Icefluxor
INLAND EMPIRE Galactic
#43 - 2013-02-01 18:39:51 UTC
Bugsy VanHalen wrote:
. Harlem or area's referred to as the getto would be low sec. Still part of the city, but police stay out and criminals reign.


THIS is so patently untrue I am for the first time ever embarrassed for something you stated.

"He has mounted his hind-legs, and blown crass vapidities through the bowel of his neck."  - Ambrose Bierce on Oscar Wilde's Lecture in San Francisco 1882
Dave Stark
#44 - 2013-02-01 19:29:06 UTC  |  Edited by: Dave Stark
Krixtal Icefluxor wrote:
Dracvlad wrote:
Dave Stark,

Obviously you do not mine..........


Thank goodness it's not just me who notices this.


again, mining is all i do.

i invite you to find an error in what i've said.
low sec mining is terrible, for all the reasons i've listed.

must be a kneejerk reaction on the eve forums to tell people what they do and don't do depending upon whether you agree or disagree with a post they make.
Arcaus Rotrau Romali
Empyrean Enterprise Conglomerate
#45 - 2013-02-01 20:12:19 UTC
What's the problem if the OP wants to try, sure it may or may not be profitable but if he enjoys it what difference does it make? It's one thing to tell him what he can expect but to tell him not to try or that he's wasting his time isn't going to help him make an informed decision for himself, and that's what he came here for imo.
Jacid
Corvix.
#46 - 2013-02-01 22:37:48 UTC
not to change the topic but you certainly would get more mining ops in low sec if certain minerals were only available in low sec would make people like the OP more areas to explore their profession and give a reason to have asteroids in low sec belts besides objects to run into while pvping in belts.
Dave Stark
#47 - 2013-02-01 23:33:30 UTC
Arcaus Rotrau Romali wrote:
What's the problem if the OP wants to try, sure it may or may not be profitable but if he enjoys it what difference does it make? It's one thing to tell him what he can expect but to tell him not to try or that he's wasting his time isn't going to help him make an informed decision for himself, and that's what he came here for imo.


except we pointed out why it was also a waste of time, if he can't make an informed decision after we've explained why it's a waste of time then there's really no hope for the OP.
Arcaus Rotrau Romali
Empyrean Enterprise Conglomerate
#48 - 2013-02-01 23:37:58 UTC
ehh, maybe, but myself and Dracvlad do it for the challenge and it's fun for us, could be the OP would think so too, in which case it wouldn't be a waste of time

but to each his own
Dave Stark
#49 - 2013-02-01 23:46:47 UTC
Arcaus Rotrau Romali wrote:
ehh, maybe, but myself and Dracvlad do it for the challenge and it's fun for us, could be the OP would think so too, in which case it wouldn't be a waste of time

but to each his own


except he clearly states he wants to go there for profit, so "i find it fun lolololol" is totally irrelevant to the thread.
Dracvlad
Taishi Combine
Astral Alliance
#50 - 2013-02-02 10:14:26 UTC
Dave Stark wrote:
Arcaus Rotrau Romali wrote:
ehh, maybe, but myself and Dracvlad do it for the challenge and it's fun for us, could be the OP would think so too, in which case it wouldn't be a waste of time

but to each his own


except he clearly states he wants to go there for profit, so "i find it fun lolololol" is totally irrelevant to the thread.


Actually you can make a profit out of it, the thing is that it is less of a profit then mining in low sec with a full exhumer and bonused Orca support. The player is looking for quick and dirty profit for his skill level and low sec mining of low sec top end ores can do that.

He needs to have a Venture with a cloak and be able to fly transport ships such as the Crane. If he had a second account he would be able to use that to scout his stuff out. Doing that he is very difficult to stop and he will make profit. You are comparing that profit to your profit of full on mining in High Sec, he isn't there, so he wants to jump the curve a bit. My point of view is its fun and I made profit.

When the going gets tough the Gankers get their CSM rep to change mechanics in their favour.

Blocked: Teckos Pech, Sonya Corvinus, baltec1, Shae Tadaruwa, Wander Prian, Daichi Yamato, Jonah Gravenstein, Merin Ryskin, Linus Gorp
Dave Stark
#51 - 2013-02-02 11:19:27 UTC
Dracvlad wrote:
Dave Stark wrote:
Arcaus Rotrau Romali wrote:
ehh, maybe, but myself and Dracvlad do it for the challenge and it's fun for us, could be the OP would think so too, in which case it wouldn't be a waste of time

but to each his own


except he clearly states he wants to go there for profit, so "i find it fun lolololol" is totally irrelevant to the thread.


Actually you can make a profit out of it, the thing is that it is less of a profit then mining in low sec with a full exhumer and bonused Orca support. The player is looking for quick and dirty profit for his skill level and low sec mining of low sec top end ores can do that.

He needs to have a Venture with a cloak and be able to fly transport ships such as the Crane. If he had a second account he would be able to use that to scout his stuff out. Doing that he is very difficult to stop and he will make profit. You are comparing that profit to your profit of full on mining in High Sec, he isn't there, so he wants to jump the curve a bit. My point of view is its fun and I made profit.


no, you can't make a profit out of it. we've been through this.

if you're not mining with an exhumer you're not going to make more profit than high sec mining. the difference in isk/m3 of ore is too small for it to be true even in ideal conditions. more so if you've got orca support. if he's looking for quick and dirty profit at his skill level then low sec isn't the place to do it unless the local market offers similar prices to jita which i doubt. can't say i check low sec markets regularly i have them filtered out.

a better use of his time would be training mining skiills, rather than training to fly a crane. the crane's cargo is laughable at best when transporting things like ore which you'll want to do in mass quantities. transporting it in a crane is going to hurt his ability to make profit to the point where he may as well sell locally even if it's an absurdly low price. i'll wager you can earn more isk/hour contracting to blackfrog than you could hauling yourself in a crane.

congratulations, you find it fun. that's also completely irrelevant to this thread. stop wheeling it out like it trumps all the facts i've presented. it doesn't.
Dracvlad
Taishi Combine
Astral Alliance
#52 - 2013-02-02 11:41:26 UTC
And I keep saying you can make a profit out of it, the fun part is an added bonus.

You are arguing that as you can make more High Sec mining you should not bother and focus on that, no one is arguing with that, that is your straw man argument, I am disagreeing with your statement that you cannot make a profit out of it, because that was his question, you can!

OK let me put it this way I can make a much greater profit doing CA's in a carrier as compared to your high sec mining so I guess you do not make a profit! That is the sort of argument you are making, hmmmmmm your trolling me.

When the going gets tough the Gankers get their CSM rep to change mechanics in their favour.

Blocked: Teckos Pech, Sonya Corvinus, baltec1, Shae Tadaruwa, Wander Prian, Daichi Yamato, Jonah Gravenstein, Merin Ryskin, Linus Gorp
Dave Stark
#53 - 2013-02-02 11:57:55 UTC  |  Edited by: Dave Stark
Dracvlad wrote:
And I keep saying you can make a profit out of it, the fun part is an added bonus.

You are arguing that as you can make more High Sec mining you should not bother and focus on that, no one is arguing with that, that is your straw man argument, I am disagreeing with your statement that you cannot make a profit out of it, because that was his question, you can!

OK let me put it this way I can make a much greater profit doing CA's in a carrier as compared to your high sec mining so I guess you do not make a profit! That is the sort of argument you are making, hmmmmmm your trolling me.


why shouldn't i bother focusing on high sec when the OP is clearly interested in making profit? high sec is where the profit is (unless you're in a 0.0 corp).
actually his question was a fit for a procurer so he can make *more* profit. to which we're all pointing out he can't do. did you even read the OP? you can't make *more* profit mining in low sec in a procurer. perhaps, on paper, you can but that doesn't translate to reality due to the myriad of factors that have been pointed out so far.

yes because in a discussion about mining in location A vs location B mentioning carriers are relevant. right? by the way that's not "an argument" that's an absurd statement of which i've made none. i've simply pointed out facts and countered every point both relevant and mostly irrelevant that you've put forward.

i'm not trolling anyone, you just seem to be unable to comprehend the OP's request.
Dracvlad
Taishi Combine
Astral Alliance
#54 - 2013-02-02 13:08:55 UTC
Trolling of course you are, people quite rightly pointed out that doing it in a Procurer was not the way to do it, because you wil get caught and there goes all your profit.

I know people who found a rarely used low sec system and mined it having set up a POS and using Hulks with Orca's for bonus and industrials to move the ore to the POS, the issue came when they were spotted, they had to stop, again they made much more ISK then you do in High Sec. And they did not lose a ship, they killed a few pirates, they had two carriers cloaked above the Hulks, of all things...

When the Goons will killing ice miners in Gallente space they were ice mining in low sec and made a fortune, so more profit then you.

Its amusing this, I could keep pointing out your wrong too.

But its enough for me, so you can make a profit mining in low sec as a newish toon, but its based on using a Venture, any more than that and you will lose that ship unless you really for it in terms of skills and resources and be prepared to know when to cut your losses...



When the going gets tough the Gankers get their CSM rep to change mechanics in their favour.

Blocked: Teckos Pech, Sonya Corvinus, baltec1, Shae Tadaruwa, Wander Prian, Daichi Yamato, Jonah Gravenstein, Merin Ryskin, Linus Gorp
Dave Stark
#55 - 2013-02-02 13:12:47 UTC  |  Edited by: Dave Stark
Dracvlad wrote:
Trolling of course you are, people quite rightly pointed out that doing it in a Procurer was not the way to do it, because you wil get caught and there goes all your profit.

I know people who found a rarely used low sec system and mined it having set up a POS and using Hulks with Orca's for bonus and industrials to move the ore to the POS, the issue came when they were spotted, they had to stop, again they made much more ISK then you do in High Sec. And they did not lose a ship, they killed a few pirates, they had two carriers cloaked above the Hulks, of all things...

When the Goons will killing ice miners in Gallente space they were ice mining in low sec and made a fortune, so more profit then you.

Its amusing this, I could keep pointing out your wrong too.

But its enough for me, so you can make a profit mining in low sec as a newish toon, but its based on using a Venture, any more than that and you will lose that ship unless you really for it in terms of skills and resources and be prepared to know when to cut your losses...





no, people just pointed out low sec wasn't the way to make more isk.
oh look, another irrelevant comment about ice. the OP clearly said he was mining minerals not ice.

how about instead of trying and failing to 1up me, you address the topic of the thread?
Dracvlad
Taishi Combine
Astral Alliance
#56 - 2013-02-02 13:58:44 UTC
What was asked, sigh!

Hi everyone, im a fairly new player to this game but feel i have a good hang of it, and would like to start mining in lowsec for more profitable and rare minerals. I've acquired a Procurer but just need the right fit to feel like id have a semi chance of avoiding destruction if i get ganked. Can anyone help me with this fit?

He was told not to use a Procurer and a Venture was suggested, which is what I agree with and use myself.

So if he really wants to do it, the ore he should go for is Hemorphite and its better variations, which is in 0.2 systems and he should only use a Venture, he can make profit, but he will make more in High Sec.

That is it, nothing much more to say about it, you can go around the houses making comments but at the end of it you are just going on about a point of view that evefryone agrees with, you can make MORE PROFIT in High Sec, its agreed. But you can make profit in low sec if he does as I suggested.

And that is my last post in this thread.

When the going gets tough the Gankers get their CSM rep to change mechanics in their favour.

Blocked: Teckos Pech, Sonya Corvinus, baltec1, Shae Tadaruwa, Wander Prian, Daichi Yamato, Jonah Gravenstein, Merin Ryskin, Linus Gorp
Krixtal Icefluxor
INLAND EMPIRE Galactic
#57 - 2013-02-02 14:35:39 UTC
Jacid wrote:
not to change the topic but you certainly would get more mining ops in low sec if certain minerals were only available in low sec would make people like the OP more areas to explore their profession and give a reason to have asteroids in low sec belts besides objects to run into while pvping in belts.



The Low Sec ores in descent quantities are found in High Sec Grav Sites of course, but honestly they are kinda rare, especially the good ones. A Large Hed/Hemo/Jasp Site fills my Orca EIGHT times over. Again, rare.

And these minerals are just sitting in Low, almost exclusively already....for a DECADE, and they are still not mined. And for good reason. No descent profit at all when dealing with the mechanics of obtaining them. Better to just grab High Sec Ores and be done. There really is not anything that's going to make people dive into Low for them, especially if nobody has figured out a descent way in 10 Years.

"He has mounted his hind-legs, and blown crass vapidities through the bowel of his neck."  - Ambrose Bierce on Oscar Wilde's Lecture in San Francisco 1882
Dave Stark
#58 - 2013-02-02 15:26:59 UTC
Dracvlad wrote:
What was asked, sigh!

Hi everyone, im a fairly new player to this game but feel i have a good hang of it, and would like to start mining in lowsec for more profitable and rare minerals. I've acquired a Procurer but just need the right fit to feel like id have a semi chance of avoiding destruction if i get ganked. Can anyone help me with this fit?

He was told not to use a Procurer and a Venture was suggested, which is what I agree with and use myself.

So if he really wants to do it, the ore he should go for is Hemorphite and its better variations, which is in 0.2 systems and he should only use a Venture, he can make profit, but he will make more in High Sec.

That is it, nothing much more to say about it, you can go around the houses making comments but at the end of it you are just going on about a point of view that evefryone agrees with, you can make MORE PROFIT in High Sec, its agreed. But you can make profit in low sec if he does as I suggested.

And that is my last post in this thread.



so he was given bad advice to the question he asked, and you blindly agreed with it. ok.

if the answer is to mine in high sec, why keep going on about mining in low sec in a gas ship? the guy is new, stop referencing advice contrary to what he wants. this game is complicated enough with people like you throwing irrelevant and/or bad advice at him.
Mire Stoude
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#59 - 2013-02-03 08:35:35 UTC  |  Edited by: Mire Stoude
Dracvlad wrote:
So if he really wants to do it, the ore he should go for is Hemorphite and its better variations, which is in 0.2 systems.


Jaspet is good too. It is usually more plentiful and is found in .3 systems.

Mining in low-sec is a challenge and not more profitable than mining in high-sec. However if you want to do it and are willing to learn how to stay alive it is more interesting than mining in high-sec. It's not as scary as people make it seem and even though they are harder to find, Low-sec people are more fun and less whiny than high and null-sec'ers.
Zenito
Lekhantsi Salvage Depot
#60 - 2013-02-03 10:30:27 UTC
Mire Stoude wrote:


Mining in low-sec is a challenge and not more profitable than mining in high-sec. However if you want to do it and are willing to learn how to stay alive it is more interesting than mining in high-sec. It's not as scary as people make it seem and even though they are harder to find, Low-sec people are more fun and less whiny than high and null-sec'ers.


Spot on. High sec mining is simply dull. Doing it in low sec keeps you on your toes and teaches you essential survival skills that you wouldn't learn from sitting in a high sec belt. That's the real profit, imho.

Zenitoka Katanga

Clan Chieftain

"A fair bargain leaves both sides unhappy."