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Tiericide Battlecruiser mineral cost adjustments
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Dave stark
#21 - 2013-01-21 11:03:30 UTC
enterprisePSI wrote:
The New Order has increased demand for procurer / skiffs. The plan is to make the miners think that they are safe in these vessels. Purging of these ships will commence, once a critical number has been reached.


I am only throwing 30 bil at this BC tiericide , RL is killing me atm.


no they haven't.
they've increased the demand for retrievers because you'll make more isk mining in an untanked retriever and replacing it when it pops than losing the yield and mining in an overtanked skiff. more so if you just mine anywhere but that one little system where they have their little circle jerk.

the skiff/procurer are filling a niche that simply doesn't exist.
enterprisePSI
#22 - 2013-01-21 11:49:31 UTC
Ok dave they haven't LolLolLol

The tears of the many, outweigh the tears of the few. Or the one. enterprise-psi©
Dave stark
#23 - 2013-01-21 12:09:48 UTC
enterprisePSI wrote:
Ok dave they haven't LolLolLol


:D
Toku Jiang
Jiang Laboratories and Discovery
#24 - 2013-01-21 20:25:08 UTC
It will be interesting to see all of the people that will be crying post patch that they can't build ships as cheap as they are selling for. Should make for good fun.
statu variabilis
Bitter Reproach
H Y E N A
#25 - 2013-01-22 01:58:38 UTC
mynnna wrote:
I just had a really good meal and the info is already in a spreadsheet of mine anyway, so I decided to be generous.

http://i.imgur.com/5VGbDMG.png

Enjoy.


et tu, brutix?
The Sardukar
Astrotech Industries Ltd
#26 - 2013-01-30 21:40:41 UTC  |  Edited by: The Sardukar
shar'ra matcevsovski wrote:
mynnna wrote:
I just had a really good meal and the info is already in a spreadsheet of mine anyway, so I decided to be generous.

http://i.imgur.com/5VGbDMG.png

Enjoy.


It might have been the meal, but I´ve the strong feeling that the~100bil Trit you invested in, werent totally unretaled aswell, heh?

just as a quick reminder:
Procurer price Jita : ~7.500.000 mil (current)
Procurer build cost: ~24.500.000 mil

why? because the over-production that happened 2-3 weeks before the changes took place, will simply cover the procurer demand for the next 3-4 years.

guess whats gona happen to Tier 1 BC´s, but make your own experience

and no I did not invest in anything this time ;)


The rebalanced Tier 1 BCs are going to die a lot more than Procurers dont you think?
shar'ra matcevsovski
Doomheim
#27 - 2013-01-30 23:14:58 UTC
The Sardukar wrote:
shar'ra matcevsovski wrote:
mynnna wrote:
I just had a really good meal and the info is already in a spreadsheet of mine anyway, so I decided to be generous.

http://i.imgur.com/5VGbDMG.png

Enjoy.


It might have been the meal, but I´ve the strong feeling that the~100bil Trit you invested in, werent totally unretaled aswell, heh?

just as a quick reminder:
Procurer price Jita : ~7.500.000 mil (current)
Procurer build cost: ~24.500.000 mil

why? because the over-production that happened 2-3 weeks before the changes took place, will simply cover the procurer demand for the next 3-4 years.

guess whats gona happen to Tier 1 BC´s, but make your own experience

and no I did not invest in anything this time ;)


The rebalanced Tier 1 BCs are going to die a lot more than Procurers dont you think?


if you compare a pvp ship and a mining ship, "dieing" is not a valid point regarding sell volume.
procusers cost now about 20 times the minerals they did before, forTier 1 BC`s that rate is only 1,5 to 1,7, should make quite some difference to your profit when the over production will be nearly the same

shar'ra phone home
The Sardukar
Astrotech Industries Ltd
#28 - 2013-01-30 23:28:50 UTC
shar'ra matcevsovski wrote:

if you compare a pvp ship and a mining ship, "dieing" is not a valid point regarding sell volume.
procusers cost now about 20 times the minerals they did before, forTier 1 BC`s that rate is only 1,5 to 1,7, should make quite some difference to your profit when the over production will be nearly the same



I'm just saying that I find it unlikely that you will find yourself one year from now with huge excess stocks of ships selling for much less than the build cost.
Gingerlord
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#29 - 2013-01-30 23:39:36 UTC
I dunno about you guys but Im building my pvp stock now to save is later.
Tauranon
Weeesearch
CAStabouts
#30 - 2013-01-31 02:35:15 UTC
Dave Stark wrote:
enterprisePSI wrote:
The New Order has increased demand for procurer / skiffs. The plan is to make the miners think that they are safe in these vessels. Purging of these ships will commence, once a critical number has been reached.


I am only throwing 30 bil at this BC tiericide , RL is killing me atm.


no they haven't.
they've increased the demand for retrievers because you'll make more isk mining in an untanked retriever and replacing it when it pops than losing the yield and mining in an overtanked skiff. more so if you just mine anywhere but that one little system where they have their little circle jerk.

the skiff/procurer are filling a niche that simply doesn't exist.


Characters that are training and have implants is the skiffs niche. New order logistics are habitual podders.

I'm sure they'll get around to killing a skiff, but they don't have any on the new order logistics kb as doing so does in fact inflict all sorts of downtimes and logistics on their pilots, that don't occur if they just patrol the systems they patrol and kill the low hanging fruit, which will also generate many times more 10 million donations, because afk and alt miners don't notice demonstrations of power until its their barge that pops.
shar'ra matcevsovski
Doomheim
#31 - 2013-01-31 06:36:02 UTC
The Sardukar wrote:
shar'ra matcevsovski wrote:

if you compare a pvp ship and a mining ship, "dieing" is not a valid point regarding sell volume.
procusers cost now about 20 times the minerals they did before, forTier 1 BC`s that rate is only 1,5 to 1,7, should make quite some difference to your profit when the over production will be nearly the same



I'm just saying that I find it unlikely that you will find yourself one year from now with huge excess stocks of ships selling for much less than the build cost.


and why you find this so unlikely? because it sounds wrong, iyho? its simple math...if there is a over-production of 2 years of the avg. demand of a ship, how long does it take till price will stabilize?

stop thinking too much about buildcost when it comes to the price of a ship, its always supply&demand what makes the price.

wana bet 5bil that procurers will still be way under 24 mil sell price in a cple month (reg. 1 year after the change)? secured by a third party if u like

shar'ra phone home
The Sardukar
Astrotech Industries Ltd
#32 - 2013-01-31 18:51:09 UTC
shar'ra matcevsovski wrote:
The Sardukar wrote:
shar'ra matcevsovski wrote:

if you compare a pvp ship and a mining ship, "dieing" is not a valid point regarding sell volume.
procusers cost now about 20 times the minerals they did before, forTier 1 BC`s that rate is only 1,5 to 1,7, should make quite some difference to your profit when the over production will be nearly the same



I'm just saying that I find it unlikely that you will find yourself one year from now with huge excess stocks of ships selling for much less than the build cost.


and why you find this so unlikely? because it sounds wrong, iyho? its simple math...if there is a over-production of 2 years of the avg. demand of a ship, how long does it take till price will stabilize?

stop thinking too much about buildcost when it comes to the price of a ship, its always supply&demand what makes the price.

wana bet 5bil that procurers will still be way under 24 mil sell price in a cple month (reg. 1 year after the change)? secured by a third party if u like


Supply and demand was actually my point. The demand of the rebalanced tier 1 BCs are likely to spike because 1) they will be much better than they presently are and 2) they are going to be used in PVP and thus die in droves. Compare that to the Procurer that 1) ended up the least favourite of the rebalanced barges (yield and hold more attractive to miners than tank) and 2) doesnt die at all because of its non-combat role and huge tank.

On the supply side, the battlecruisers are already costing 30-35 million a piece to build, neccessitating players to invest huge amounts of isk to build significant qunatities, while the Procurer costed 2.5 mill a pice to build pre patch, enabling even the not so space-rich to build rather big stocks.

Procurers will rise eventually, but it will take years to deplete the current stocks. Tier 1 BCs? Thats not gonna happen.
shar'ra matcevsovski
Doomheim
#33 - 2013-01-31 19:20:58 UTC  |  Edited by: shar'ra matcevsovski
The Sardukar wrote:

Supply and demand was actually my point. The demand of the rebalanced tier 1 BCs are likely to spike because 1) they will be much better than they presently are and 2) they are going to be used in PVP and thus die in droves.



point 2) is p. much a result of point 1), so a bit trivial. SOME Tier 1 BC`s are going to be better, fine. But again they are still no where near as fleet suitable as their Tier 2 or 3 variants wich still keep them in a niche postion. there is simply no reason to chose any Tier 1 BC over the other Tiers, not now, not later.

The Sardukar wrote:

Compare that to the Procurer that 1) ended up the least favourite of the rebalanced barges (yield and hold more attractive to miners than tank) and 2) doesnt die at all because of its non-combat role and huge tank.


again, not dieing for a non pvp ship isnt a rly good point BUT they are still getting sold 2-3 times as mch as any Tier 1 BC hull.

Investing has also nothing to do with the piece number, only the invested isk matters...god damn

Quote:
Procurers will rise eventually, but it will take years to deplete the current stocks. Tier 1 BCs? Thats not gonna happen.


its almost like we are talking about religion or something that you actually cant calculate....just check how many Tier 1 BC BPO`s have been sold in the last 2 weeks and how many ships those will make... not to mention those BPO's that have been sold via forums or contracts...

hint: depending on wich BC its already almost 3 years again even with a increased sell volume

shar'ra phone home
Jerry T Pepridge
Meta Game Analysis and Investment INC.
#34 - 2013-01-31 23:09:03 UTC
bc's will be much much worse than procurer, after the initial pubbie spike of hurr durr look guis new BC herp derp. it'll drop faster than claire coffee's lead turd in an outhouse.

@JerryTPepridge
Wyke Mossari
Staner Industries
#35 - 2013-02-02 11:04:29 UTC

Add in last weekend Supercide and we can only expect mineral prices to rise sharply.

(Yep ok I only posted this to introduce the neologism supercide)
Hulemand
Coreli Corporation
Pandemic Legion
#36 - 2013-02-03 01:56:13 UTC
Just wondering, someone must have known about the build cost changes to tech 1 frigs and cruisers, and they are well up in price now.

Admiral Hulemand Core Operations Overseer
Steve Ronuken
Fuzzwork Enterprises
Vote Steve Ronuken for CSM
#37 - 2013-02-03 02:40:18 UTC
Hulemand wrote:
Just wondering, someone must have known about the build cost changes to tech 1 frigs and cruisers, and they are well up in price now.



People have profited from them. People will profit from the BC updates. As long as the ships die, it's fine.

Woo! CSM XI!

Fuzzwork Enterprises

Twitter: @fuzzysteve on Twitter
Aryth
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#38 - 2013-02-04 16:00:06 UTC
Wyke Mossari wrote:

Add in last weekend Supercide and we can only expect mineral prices to rise sharply.

(Yep ok I only posted this to introduce the neologism supercide)


Glad the post was about introduction of a new word and not the content. Because the content is completely incorrect.

Leader of the Goonswarm Economic Warfare Cabal.

Creator of Burn Jita

Vile Rat: You're the greatest sociopath that has ever played eve.
Wyke Mossari
Staner Industries
#39 - 2013-02-04 17:23:01 UTC  |  Edited by: Wyke Mossari
Aryth wrote:
Wyke Mossari wrote:

Add in last weekend Supercide and we can only expect mineral prices to rise sharply.

(Yep ok I only posted this to introduce the neologism supercide)


Glad the post was about introduction of a new word and not the content. Because the content is completely incorrect.


Ouch butt hurt much?

The fact is identifying Goon's Jita alts got a whole lot easier for anybody trading minerals.
Aryth
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#40 - 2013-02-04 23:35:51 UTC
Wyke Mossari wrote:
Aryth wrote:
Wyke Mossari wrote:

Add in last weekend Supercide and we can only expect mineral prices to rise sharply.

(Yep ok I only posted this to introduce the neologism supercide)


Glad the post was about introduction of a new word and not the content. Because the content is completely incorrect.


Ouch butt hurt much?

The fact is identifying Goon's Jita alts got a whole lot easier for anybody trading minerals.


What. You must be joking or so clueless as to border on incompetence. You do realize, goons FLAG OUR ORDERS. Those evil goony alts are sure hard to pick out with their penising up the market like crazy.

You missed the point of my post. The wild speculation that the welp would impact minerals was incorrect. Because we had just purchased 600b in minerals 45 days earlier for BC spec. That we then just rolled into supers! Funny how that works.

But yes, continue trying to find the goon alts that identify themselves with their numbering. Just lawl.

Leader of the Goonswarm Economic Warfare Cabal.

Creator of Burn Jita

Vile Rat: You're the greatest sociopath that has ever played eve.