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Hard and Soft clones

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Archerus Tsero
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#1 - 2013-01-28 21:29:13 UTC
I've been looking through lore and forum posts for awhile now, but have not found an answer regarding multiple clones on a ship. I am a bit of a writer and came up with the idea of keeping a hard and soft clone aboard most of my larger (battle cruiser and above) ships. The hard clone being the actual body within the pod and the soft clone being an extra clone held aboard the ship for the purpose of moving about.

Simply being when my ship is safely docked or shutdown my pilot does a soft scan of his brain to transfer to the soft clone aboard. Similar to how we can transfer our minds between jump clones without destroying a body. This soft clone still has the same neural implants required of a capsule pilot but also a series of recording implants. Since a body outside of the pod can not be downloaded on death any memories of the soft clone would be lost. The recording implants would allow the hard clone to at least know what happened to his other body even if he lacks the memories of it. If the soft clone is not destroyed the pilot mearly has to do another soft scan to transfer his new memories back to his main body within the pod.


My questions being is this feasible and within the bounds of established lore?
Sepherim
Imperial Shipment
Amarr Empire
#2 - 2013-01-29 02:43:23 UTC
I don't see why would anyone want to do that? Why not simply leave the pod? :?

Sepherim Catillah Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris Liuteneant Ex-Imperial Navy Imperator Commander
Archerus Tsero
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#3 - 2013-01-29 03:37:51 UTC
ISK mostly. Most capsule pilots fit very expensive implants into their main body. Sometimes worth up a billion isk or more. I could risk that large investment when b-linging, or I could just invest into equipping my ship with an extra clone. There is also the idea that should something happen to the extra soft clone you real body is still nearby to handle any situatition and still fly/fight with your ship.
Archerus Tsero
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#4 - 2013-01-29 03:49:41 UTC  |  Edited by: Archerus Tsero
UghI should probably also say that I'm saying this would not be something that would happen every day. This is totally for fiction sake. It is suppose to be a last line to protect the capsuler. Something has happened to bring the person outside of the safety of his pod. A hostage situation, illegal exchange, etc. This way the pilot can still do whats necessary and still be able to get himself, his ship, and crew out of a tight spot when things go south.
Sepherim
Imperial Shipment
Amarr Empire
#5 - 2013-01-29 03:50:47 UTC
Problem is that the extra clone, either is a reduced version of yourself (not able to hold all your skill points) and so you can never return from it to the previous one without losing that knowledge... or it soon ends up becoming a rather expensive thing to have. If it's a safety issue, it'd be quite cheaper to hire a full set of mercenaries to guard you or anything else you may need to protect you.

Sepherim Catillah Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris Liuteneant Ex-Imperial Navy Imperator Commander
Archerus Tsero
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#6 - 2013-01-29 04:32:32 UTC
I see your point. Thank you Sepherim.
Eija-Riitta Veitonen
State War Academy
Caldari State
#7 - 2013-01-29 04:39:22 UTC
Also there's a point on why clone jumping is only allowed once in 24 hours. Because so much clone changing would definitely damage your mind.
CCP Falcon
#8 - 2013-01-29 12:13:16 UTC
This is kind of a mish-mash of both Capsuleer and DUST merc cloning lore that doesn't really work.

The EVE side of the lore being the capsuleer, and the DUST side being a clone that's somehow recording events that are going on so no memory is lost.

Capsuleers and DUST mercs are very different animals, and their two technologies are wholly different and not interchangeable. As such a DUST merc can not be a capsuleer, and vice versa.

In terms of the ability to leave pod on board a ship, most vessels that are sub super-capital don't have the on board facilities to provide a place for capsuleers to decant and walk around, hence the need for this kind of facility in station. Of course, you're perfectly able to decant and run around on board your ship (in theory at least) while it's docked, just not in space, as it would have catastrophic effects on your ship's systems if you were unsafely disconnected from it mentally while everything was online as your ship and its systems are heavily dependent on pilot knowledge and familiarity to function.

For instance, this is why when your ship is heavily damaged into the last few percent of structure, sometimes if you eject from it, it'll explode due to the fact your skills are no longer applied to it and your overall hitpoints are reduced P

CCP Falcon || EVE Universe Community Manager || @CCP_Falcon

Happy Birthday To FAWLTY7! <3
Garviel Tarrant
Beyond Divinity Inc
Shadow Cartel
#9 - 2013-01-29 13:08:19 UTC
CCP Falcon wrote:
This is kind of a mish-mash of both Capsuleer and DUST merc cloning lore that doesn't really work.

The EVE side of the lore being the capsuleer, and the DUST side being a clone that's somehow recording events that are going on so no memory is lost.

Capsuleers and DUST mercs are very different animals, and their two technologies are wholly different and not interchangeable. As such a DUST merc can not be a capsuleer, and vice versa.

In terms of the ability to leave pod on board a ship, most vessels that are sub super-capital don't have the on board facilities to provide a place for capsuleers to decant and walk around, hence the need for this kind of facility in station. Of course, you're perfectly able to decant and run around on board your ship (in theory at least) while it's docked, just not in space, as it would have catastrophic effects on your ship's systems if you were unsafely disconnected from it mentally while everything was online as your ship and its systems are heavily dependent on pilot knowledge and familiarity to function.

For instance, this is why when your ship is heavily damaged into the last few percent of structure, sometimes if you eject from it, it'll explode due to the fact your skills are no longer applied to it and your overall hitpoints are reduced P




But if you're an RP nut you can eject from your BS in space and gloat manically at the thought of the crew suffering? ^^

BYDI recruitment closed-ish

Arline Kley
PIE Inc.
Khimi Harar
#10 - 2013-01-29 13:55:09 UTC
Garviel Tarrant wrote:
But if you're an RP nut you can eject from your BS in space and gloat manically at the thought of the crew suffering? ^^


I assure you, sir, that I do not gloat over the passing of ANY of my crew, and it will indeed be a sad state of affairs when all capsuleers act in the manner that you have described.

"For it was said they had become like those peculiar demons, which dwell in matter but in whom no light may be found." - Father Grigori, Ravens 3:57
Pinky Denmark
The Cursed Navy
#11 - 2013-01-29 14:49:12 UTC
But the crew has been plenty compensated for their efforts and suffering - or have they?
Garviel Tarrant
Beyond Divinity Inc
Shadow Cartel
#12 - 2013-01-29 15:09:12 UTC
Pinky Denmark wrote:
But the crew has been plenty compensated for their efforts and suffering - or have they?



Their life was basically payed for and included in the ship price :P

BYDI recruitment closed-ish

Altrue
Exploration Frontier inc
Tactical-Retreat
#13 - 2013-01-29 23:26:44 UTC
CCP Falcon wrote:
As such a DUST merc can not be a capsuleer, and vice versa.


Lies !! Look at this video : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xnt1tTlnqfY
See ? A capsuleer fighting as a merc ! How can I be so sure ? She has a head !!

Which, by the way, highlight the fact that some trailers are not very lore-friendly ;)

Signature Tanking Best Tanking

[Ex-F] CEO - Eve-guides.fr

Ultimate Citadel Guide - 2016 EVE Career Chart
Eija-Riitta Veitonen
State War Academy
Caldari State
#14 - 2013-01-29 23:36:19 UTC
Altrue wrote:
CCP Falcon wrote:
As such a DUST merc can not be a capsuleer, and vice versa.


Lies !! Look at this video : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xnt1tTlnqfY
See ? A capsuleer fighting as a merc ! How can I be so sure ? She has a head !!

Which, by the way, highlight the fact that some trailers are not very lore-friendly ;)

Where did you see that the main character is a capsuleer? All i've seen there is dust-related.
Altrue
Exploration Frontier inc
Tactical-Retreat
#15 - 2013-01-29 23:39:58 UTC  |  Edited by: Altrue
Yes.. but she has a head !!! It proves everything !

More seriously, that's an interpretation question but the trailer is (imho) somehow suggesting than it's two main characters (the two with visible head) are capsuleers. Perhaps it's only me, but this is how I felt the first time I saw it.

Edit : Quote from trailer's description : "As an immortal mercenary in DUST 514®, you face a lifetime of warfare across the worlds of New Eden. But as this epic trailer shows, you never have to fight alone."

My first impression remains, but this is clearly showing that I'm wrong. My bad.

Signature Tanking Best Tanking

[Ex-F] CEO - Eve-guides.fr

Ultimate Citadel Guide - 2016 EVE Career Chart
AstraPardus
Earthside Mixlabs
#16 - 2013-01-29 23:52:46 UTC  |  Edited by: AstraPardus
CCP Falcon wrote:
This is kind of a mish-mash of both Capsuleer and DUST merc cloning lore that doesn't really work.

The EVE side of the lore being the capsuleer, and the DUST side being a clone that's somehow recording events that are going on so no memory is lost.

Capsuleers and DUST mercs are very different animals, and their two technologies are wholly different and not interchangeable. As such a DUST merc can not be a capsuleer, and vice versa.

In terms of the ability to leave pod on board a ship, most vessels that are sub super-capital don't have the on board facilities to provide a place for capsuleers to decant and walk around, hence the need for this kind of facility in station. Of course, you're perfectly able to decant and run around on board your ship (in theory at least) while it's docked, just not in space, as it would have catastrophic effects on your ship's systems if you were unsafely disconnected from it mentally while everything was online as your ship and its systems are heavily dependent on pilot knowledge and familiarity to function.

For instance, this is why when your ship is heavily damaged into the last few percent of structure, sometimes if you eject from it, it'll explode due to the fact your skills are no longer applied to it and your overall hitpoints are reduced P



Oops... >__> ...Oh well! Too late to change those few posts! XD
Every time I post is Pardy time! :3
Eija-Riitta Veitonen
State War Academy
Caldari State
#17 - 2013-01-30 04:17:34 UTC  |  Edited by: Eija-Riitta Veitonen
AstraPardus wrote:
CCP Falcon wrote:
This is kind of a mish-mash of both Capsuleer and DUST merc cloning lore that doesn't really work.

The EVE side of the lore being the capsuleer, and the DUST side being a clone that's somehow recording events that are going on so no memory is lost.

Capsuleers and DUST mercs are very different animals, and their two technologies are wholly different and not interchangeable. As such a DUST merc can not be a capsuleer, and vice versa.

In terms of the ability to leave pod on board a ship, most vessels that are sub super-capital don't have the on board facilities to provide a place for capsuleers to decant and walk around, hence the need for this kind of facility in station. Of course, you're perfectly able to decant and run around on board your ship (in theory at least) while it's docked, just not in space, as it would have catastrophic effects on your ship's systems if you were unsafely disconnected from it mentally while everything was online as your ship and its systems are heavily dependent on pilot knowledge and familiarity to function.

For instance, this is why when your ship is heavily damaged into the last few percent of structure, sometimes if you eject from it, it'll explode due to the fact your skills are no longer applied to it and your overall hitpoints are reduced P



Oops... >__> ...Oh well! Too late to change those few posts! XD

My thoughts exactly! =]

Also as far as i know the DUST and Capsuleer implants are not only non-interchangeable but also incompatible? DUST implants are sleeper-tech, while pods are jovian, and regular-cloning technology is of local origin? (acording to the information i have so far capsuleer cloning tech and capsules themselves have been developed separately from each other and only campe together because of its efficiency and ease of application)

I'd also very much would like to get more lore for jump clone technology, if there is any, please? Especially the technological side :)
Alizabeth Vea
Doomheim
#18 - 2013-01-30 09:12:19 UTC
Altrue wrote:
Yes.. but she has a head !!! It proves everything !

More seriously, that's an interpretation question but the trailer is (imho) somehow suggesting than it's two main characters (the two with visible head) are capsuleers. Perhaps it's only me, but this is how I felt the first time I saw it.

Edit : Quote from trailer's description : "As an immortal mercenary in DUST 514®, you face a lifetime of warfare across the worlds of New Eden. But as this epic trailer shows, you never have to fight alone."

My first impression remains, but this is clearly showing that I'm wrong. My bad.


I'm a little high on blue pill right now. What does having a head have to do with anything? I would hope that everyone would have a head, it's kind of important. It holds this thing called the brain, see? And your visual sensors, auditory sensors, and a mouth. Gallente girls really know how to use their mouths. Right, back to topic. Head. . . . Crap! I mean: having a head. Why does having a head make someone a capsuleer?

Retainer of Lady Newelle and House Sarum.

"Those who step into the light shall be redeemed, the sins of their past cleansed, so that they may know salvation." -Empress Jamyl Sarum I

Virtue. Valor. Victory.
CCP Eterne
C C P
C C P Alliance
#19 - 2013-01-30 10:34:36 UTC
Altrue wrote:
Yes.. but she has a head !!! It proves everything !

More seriously, that's an interpretation question but the trailer is (imho) somehow suggesting than it's two main characters (the two with visible head) are capsuleers. Perhaps it's only me, but this is how I felt the first time I saw it.

Edit : Quote from trailer's description : "As an immortal mercenary in DUST 514®, you face a lifetime of warfare across the worlds of New Eden. But as this epic trailer shows, you never have to fight alone."

My first impression remains, but this is clearly showing that I'm wrong. My bad.


Dust soldiers have heads too. They just tend to be a self-conscious lot and tend to refrain from removing their helmets.

EVE Online/DUST 514 Community Representative ※ EVE Illuminati ※ Fiction Adept

@CCP_Eterne ※ @EVE_LiveEvents
CCP Falcon
#20 - 2013-01-30 13:01:31 UTC
CCP Eterne wrote:
Altrue wrote:
Yes.. but she has a head !!! It proves everything !

More seriously, that's an interpretation question but the trailer is (imho) somehow suggesting than it's two main characters (the two with visible head) are capsuleers. Perhaps it's only me, but this is how I felt the first time I saw it.

Edit : Quote from trailer's description : "As an immortal mercenary in DUST 514®, you face a lifetime of warfare across the worlds of New Eden. But as this epic trailer shows, you never have to fight alone."

My first impression remains, but this is clearly showing that I'm wrong. My bad.


Dust soldiers have heads too. They just tend to be a self-conscious lot and tend to refrain from removing their helmets.


T'is a terrible affliction, and we should honestly try to get them help, and promote the fact that cloned mercenaries are people too so that they'll take off their helmets more.

Sad


CCP Falcon || EVE Universe Community Manager || @CCP_Falcon

Happy Birthday To FAWLTY7! <3
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