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Missions & Complexes

 
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Adapt, they say

Author
Richard Stallmanu Stallmania
Perkone
Caldari State
#61 - 2013-01-24 16:34:14 UTC
Kery Nysell wrote:
Urgg Boolean wrote:

In actual practice, this procedure only works sometimes. Try this strategy in Mordus Folly 1 of 2. You will be swarmed, webbed and scrammed before you "melt the swarm" - you can't kill enough of them before they close in. If that happens, you have to sacrifice drones to whack the scramming frigs and flee to repair. Or maybe I just suck at EvE.

Additionally, even dual TPs on my tengu won't hold aggro. I've said this since the test phase. Gaining aggro is not hard. Holding aggro is the hard part.

The double whammy of new NPC AI and HM nerf make things much more difficult. And now I hear that TD will affect missiles "soon". Just great - a triple whammy for HM boats.

( not spell checked )


From what I can find on the web, there's only 3 Frigates and 5 Cruisers in the first wave of that mission, plus 5 more Cruisers in the second wave ... the rest are Battleships, staged in several waves ... and none of those scramble, but eve-survival might be out of date ...

I fail to see the problem for a properly tanked BS in that mission, honestly.

Frankly, I don't see the appeal of the Tengu ... it's a Cruiser, a very versatile one indeed, but still a Cruiser, it doesn't have the tank nor the punch for L4 missions, in my humble opinion.



PLEASE STOP POSTING ON THE FORUMS IF YOU KNOW NOTHING ABOUT THIS GAME.

YOU FIRST SAID SENSOR BOOSTERS HELP TRACKING.

NOW YOU SAY A TENGU HAS NO TANK OR DPS.

PLEASE STOP. JUST STOP.
vice vortex
Autopsy
#62 - 2013-01-24 18:25:18 UTC
and once we adapt to this we will have to adapt to something else :(
Baron Dmitri Harkonnen
State War Academy
Caldari State
#63 - 2013-01-25 01:47:17 UTC  |  Edited by: Baron Dmitri Harkonnen
vice vortex wrote:
and once we adapt to this we will have to adapt to something else :(


If by adapt you mean get used to a frustrating and tedious experience, sure.

This whole NPC AI change reeks of lack of testing and bugs.

I'm all for change but make sure it works first. Geez CCP, get your s***t together.

Edit: It doesn't help that we're getting no communication from them on the subject.
Mund Richard
#64 - 2013-01-25 03:23:31 UTC  |  Edited by: Mund Richard
Baron Dmitri Harkonnen wrote:
Edit: It doesn't help that we're getting no communication from them on the subject.

That's just not true.
We had so far multiple types:
  • ~"This is how we plan to do it, feedback is welcome."
  • The version went live with minor adjustments.
  • ~"We know it's not ideal, we'll get back to you later, give feedback in the meantime."
  • Took a while to get that response as I remember, and then instead of getting back, we got:
  • Communication by patchnote!
  • Or at least I missed the deep discussion about it with multiple devposts.
  • Quoting said patch notes, admitting that things were messed-up before it
  • Was nice to get a post there, and it did sound reasonable.
  • Providing metrics that things aren't as crazy as they were
  • Unrelated joke: there are lies, damned lies, and statistics.

    Joke aside, it's true that drones are in a better shape after the patch hard-capping rat targeting (ofc still in a worse shape than before the expansion, the interface and the rest are still as miserable as they were for years), and even I am training another Gallente alt atmo with drone skills.
    Now the why... the why is interesting...

    "We want PvE activities to require active participation and mirror PvP more closely." Stacking penalty for NPC EWAR then? Lock range under 9km from over 100 in a BS is not fun. Nor is two NPC web drones making me crawl 10m/s. PvP SW-900 x5: 75m/s.

    L0rdF1end
    STA'IN
    Stellae Renascitur
    #65 - 2013-01-25 14:18:48 UTC
    How about just make a new game CCP.
    Players that want to play the new game with all of these changes you are making can sign up for it.
    People that want to play Eve the way they love Eve can stick with Eve.

    So many pointless changes breaking the things we love.
    Moonlit Raid
    Doomheim
    #66 - 2013-01-25 21:12:07 UTC
    Akuma Tsukai wrote:
    CCP did the right thing, they say Lol
    Adapt to that, ya morons.
    http://postimage.org/image/s2p7v200l/full/
    http://postimage.org/image/3z9anndcx/full/

    P.S. and soon TD will affect missiles too Lol


    I learned something a year or so ago, I've never really needed it.

    GGGAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAYYYYYYYY

    ^^^It's called the gay alarm.

    If brute force isn't working, you're just not using enough.

    Please Note: Any advice given comes with the caveat that nothing will be suitable for every situation.

    Erick Voliffe
    Deep Core Mining Inc.
    Caldari State
    #67 - 2013-01-27 20:17:14 UTC
    I wonder what higher percentage of the player base, pve or pvp? I bet its pve by a large margain and yet they keep doing stuff that doesn't really do anything except annoy people who just want to pve. Oh they do that for pvp also, nvm keep up the good work CCP, one of these years you'll figure it out. LolLolLolLolLol
    Morrigan LeSante
    Perkone
    Caldari State
    #68 - 2013-01-27 21:10:05 UTC  |  Edited by: Morrigan LeSante
    Kery Nysell wrote:
    Frankly, I don't see the appeal of the Tengu ... it's a Cruiser, a very versatile one indeed, but still a Cruiser, it doesn't have the tank nor the punch for L4 missions, in my humble opinion.



    DPS is average, granted, but Tengu lacking tank for level 4s? Hahahahahahahahahahahaha.

    Tell me you weren't serious LolLolLol
    Kery Nysell
    #69 - 2013-01-28 03:04:51 UTC
    Morrigan LeSante wrote:
    Kery Nysell wrote:
    Frankly, I don't see the appeal of the Tengu ... it's a Cruiser, a very versatile one indeed, but still a Cruiser, it doesn't have the tank nor the punch for L4 missions, in my humble opinion.



    DPS is average, granted, but Tengu lacking tank for level 4s? Hahahahahahahahahahahaha.

    Tell me you weren't serious LolLolLol


    As serious as I can be without having flown the ship myself and going by the losses of the OP ...

    I do think that the combination of small sig, powerfull resistances, speed and good mods can make a tremendous tank, but I remain unconvinced ... more by the price tag than anything else really, at 200 millions for the hull, plus 20~100 millions for each subsytem, plus the modules, it SHOULD be a solid tanker ... or a glorified paperweight Blink

    But I can mount a solid tank for level 4 missions on a "basic" Tech 1 Raven with Tech 2 modules for a fraction of the cost ... WITH the better DPS of Cruises Missiles for the NPC Battleships ...

    ...

    Ildryn
    Idle Guns.
    #70 - 2013-01-28 03:27:15 UTC
    Kery Nysell wrote:
    Morrigan LeSante wrote:
    Kery Nysell wrote:
    Frankly, I don't see the appeal of the Tengu ... it's a Cruiser, a very versatile one indeed, but still a Cruiser, it doesn't have the tank nor the punch for L4 missions, in my humble opinion.



    DPS is average, granted, but Tengu lacking tank for level 4s? Hahahahahahahahahahahaha.

    Tell me you weren't serious LolLolLol


    As serious as I can be without having flown the ship myself and going by the losses of the OP ...

    I do think that the combination of small sig, powerfull resistances, speed and good mods can make a tremendous tank, but I remain unconvinced ... more by the price tag than anything else really, at 200 millions for the hull, plus 20~100 millions for each subsytem, plus the modules, it SHOULD be a solid tanker ... or a glorified paperweight Blink

    But I can mount a solid tank for level 4 missions on a "basic" Tech 1 Raven with Tech 2 modules for a fraction of the cost ... WITH the better DPS of Cruises Missiles for the NPC Battleships ...


    When in a raven you will have GTFO moments.
    A tengu can tank it just fine and usually never drop below 90% sheilds if fit properly (all t2)

    The best dps you can get with t2 and that is maxed out is 630 dps
    Provided 3 damage controls.

    Best dps for a Tengu t2 fit is 601 dps

    Those are both EFT fits.
    So add is the fact that cruise missiles suck on frigs and furies are terribad on cruisers.
    A tengu even after the nerf still beats a standard raven.
    Kery Nysell
    #71 - 2013-01-28 03:37:03 UTC
    I must be doing something wrong then, because I never really had a GTFO moment in a Raven ... but then, knowing the triggers, managing aggro, never boosting more than needed to preserve cap, and the like, are my usual style of running missions ...

    I'm not an EFT-Warrior (just re-discovered that program), but with Precision Cruises I can kill frigates in 1 to 3 volleys (3 for the Elites) and my Fury Cruises eat Cruisers in 2 to 4 volleys (again, 4 for the Elites) ... I sometimes have to turn a Target Painter on some really heavily tanked cruisers in some rare missions, but that's not the norm ...

    Oh, and I'm not at full Vs too, but I have 2 Rigor and 1 Flare rigs in there, makes a world of difference.

    ...

    Morrigan LeSante
    Perkone
    Caldari State
    #72 - 2013-01-28 08:05:44 UTC  |  Edited by: Morrigan LeSante
    Without perfect skills and various implants (1 favouring the CNR, the rest generic), my tengu/CNR DPS difference (ignoring drones), is about 100-150 depending on what I fit.

    The CNR probably slightly edges real world DPS, but needs 3x rigors and 2 TPs to do it, something which means I need to keep a (much) closer eye on the tank than the T3, which can ignore all triggers and simply orbit a wreck trashing the room.

    The real strength of the tengu though, is the fact that tank is so damned good it can ignore everything and just blitz select targets, a raven doesnt have that luxury.

    Also mine is a CNR, a regular raven minus a launcher would probably be slightly behind the tengu. Of course, you get what you pay for Blink
    Mike Whiite
    Deep Core Mining Inc.
    Caldari State
    #73 - 2013-01-28 11:17:50 UTC
    The TD on missiles isn't implanted yet, because it can't be done without changing, modules, skills and the fear for the TD becoming OP.

    This is something they already found out at the drawing board, even for Retribution 1.1. there isn't any mention of this change.

    Also there is untill now only spoken of a minor effect on missiles.

    all in all way to soon to draw any conclusions