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Arena-pvp in hisec?
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Captain Tardbar
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#41 - 2013-01-21 22:46:16 UTC  |  Edited by: Captain Tardbar
Sura Sadiva wrote:
Warp Planet6 wrote:

Why should I go to the dangerous lowsec when I can pewpew in hisec?


Because...

Because if you decide to live in high sec with all the advantages, safety and benefits of high sec you have to renounche to something; cannot have everything for free.

As well as people living in low, null, or WH renounce to some high sec benefits.


More safety = less freedom




Its like arguing piracy reduces sales. Sure it might in some cases, but chances are those people would not have bought the product anyways.

Why would hi-sec dweller go to low-sec because he can't duel in hi-sec?

Carebear: "Herp! Derp! Because of all those duels in hi sec that I am not participating in, I don't want to take my mining barge to low-sec!!"

Seriously, do you think people are going to avoid lowsec any more than they do now because they can duel?

People are going to avoid lowsec just as much as they did before.

You're just mad they can lose ships without your involvment.

Does hi-sec corp wars make you mad too?

[edit]

WTF was I thinking. Duels can exist now between two corporations in hi sec as long as they pay the fees.

Technically that is the whole point between Red vs Blue (and they have a gentleman's agreement not to pod each other).

Does the fact that exists make you mad?

Why does adding the simple feature letting people consent to blow each other up in hi sec make you mad?

They can do it already if they want and it only makes sense to make it easier, quicker, and less costly to duel.

Looking to talk on VOIP with other EVE players? Are you new and need help with EVE (welfare) or looking for advice? Looking for adversarial debate with angry people?

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Silivar Karkun
Doomheim
#42 - 2013-01-21 22:58:58 UTC
i totally aprove organizated duels, i know eve is about non consensual PvEpeen, but hey, as long as i can battle in a rookie without having to travel to low/null.....i go for it.
Inxentas Ultramar
Ultramar Independent Contracting
#43 - 2013-01-21 23:04:22 UTC
Karrl Tian wrote:
Inxentas Ultramar wrote:
I think such an option could privide some fun. Imagine two dudes duelling, with a third biding his time to carry out a gank as soon as one of the duelists is below 20% shields. AFAIK a dueling option doesn't have to be more difficult then generating a LE between two players when they both consent.


Scenario. A mach and a nightmare are dueling, both go deep into structure. Finally the mach wins and CCP's dueling systme stops the duel at 1hp (just like the WoW model they want to emulate for some weird reason.) But scarcely do they have time to exchange GFs before a dozen catalysts warp in and pop them both.


Thats why I believe this WoW arena type thing isn't gonna work. All I want is a way to say OK, we'll fight without convoluted can mechanics. I don't mind sending you a voucher with a secure location if we want to dance in private. I do mind having to litter Hek like a drunken bum to get a simple 1-vs-1 going on. I just want a way to set up an LE, a let's dance button, but in some way that it doesn't mess with your UI like a chat invite. I dunno, display one of those new fancy icons or so. If you hover over it with your mouse you see a list of people who are open for LE invites or whatever. Once both consent, initiate LE. That would be an application at a base level. I wouldn't be surprised if we ever get 'tournament' tools to generate LE's between larger consending parties, and even less so if you can rig them to hell and back (we honour our prize winners...honestly!).
Ayuren Aakiwa
Shadow Legion X
Seriously Suspicious
#44 - 2013-01-21 23:31:51 UTC  |  Edited by: Ayuren Aakiwa
This is a terrible idea, as op said why leave high sec when you can safely pvp there. Eve pvp is great because of all the sneaky tactics, chasing, baiting etc... Arenas are just plain dumb in this game. Evil
Agonizing Mining
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#45 - 2013-01-21 23:42:14 UTC
The arena has been around for years it's called alliance tourney. Also it would be great. No more idiots camping undock with cans. You can also make wagers based on odds. Fight outside of your class and get good rewards or pack back on bets.
Sura Sadiva
Entropic Tactical Crew
#46 - 2013-01-21 23:52:53 UTC
Captain Tardbar wrote:

Technically that is the whole point between Red vs Blue (and they have a gentleman's agreement not to pod each other).
Does the fact that exists make you mad?



Yes, but the main point is just this: RvB is a player created and player driven content. So is for people arranging duels using can flipping (that still can be done) and so on. Are all agreement, or pratices developed and built by players and their interactions.
An integrated duelling system erase and replace all this with premade mechanics.

And believe me, I think people should play where fit better to their playstyle. I don't want people moving in low sec, it's already too crowded for my taste.

But also I think that high, null, low, Wh are be part of the same universe and same game and adding mechanics that progressively split us is not good for the game in general.
Renzo Ruderi
Doomheim
#47 - 2013-01-21 23:53:05 UTC  |  Edited by: Renzo Ruderi
Agonizing Mining wrote:
The arena has been around for years it's called alliance tourney. Also it would be great. No more idiots camping undock with cans. You can also make wagers based on odds. Fight outside of your class and get good rewards or pack back on bets.


Those same idiots would still be camping undock with cans. WoW has always had dueling, but foam-at-the-mouth PvPers will still sit their characters under quest markers hoping someone will right click on them. The problem isn't the system, it's the people.

EDIT: When I say "foam-at-the-mouth PvPers" I mean the subset of PvPers who would find more happiness in Call of Duty than in EVE Online. The sort who don't want the MMO called EVE, just the F1 button.
Super spikinator
Hegemonous Conscripts
#48 - 2013-01-21 23:53:46 UTC
I wouldn't mind seeing tournaments being added to EvE, heck it would be nice if you could specify the ruleset. However, any changes should not be made that would exempt any tournament from the normal ruleset of eve. I would see about the only exemptions being either mass limit or class limit since those two exist (wormholes and some accel gates respectively). That is, people can gate crash it, people have to bring their own ships and ships of course blow up. Podding can be optional since podding is the teabag of EvE. If you want a low risk tourney, set it up in high (CONCORD ho!). Which would make it more amusing since people with -5 can be killed without concord so there would be instances of brawls in the audience and other fun things.
Sura Sadiva
Entropic Tactical Crew
#49 - 2013-01-21 23:55:15 UTC
Silivar Karkun wrote:
i totally aprove organizated duels, i know eve is about non consensual PvEpeen, but hey, as long as i can battle in a rookie without having to travel to low/null.....i go for it.


Do not believe who says you cannot have fights in high sec. you can. And do not trust who try to scare you with fancy tales about traveling trough New Eden: they only want to cut your wings and keep you caged in high sec.
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#50 - 2013-01-22 00:18:26 UTC
Nicolo da'Vicenza wrote:
"literally all changes must be put in perspective within EVE's 10 year span" - some idiot
Well, if you don't want to be compared to an idiot, don't use that length perspective.

The fact remains: a duel mechanic was put in place in this game pretty much right out the gate. Ten years later, we have still not arrived at the second step if your slippery slope, and for all we know, it may take another ten years before we do. If that's the pace of change, then your three-step evolution will take at least 40 years…


Of course, the real problem here is that you are being dishonest in trying to paint duel mechanics as anything other than ancient in EVE. That's where the real idiocy comes in.
FourierTransformer
#51 - 2013-01-22 00:24:55 UTC
For 9 years, hisec had can flipping duels. During that time Nullsec Empires rose, fell, rose, and fell again. Lowsec thrived, and became a depopulated wasteland, and thrived again.

Honestly, I think 9 years of evidence proves the naysayers wrong.
Ginger Barbarella
#52 - 2013-01-22 00:35:00 UTC
FourierTransformer wrote:
For 9 years, hisec had can flipping duels. During that time Nullsec Empires rose, fell, rose, and fell again. Lowsec thrived, and became a depopulated wasteland, and thrived again.

Honestly, I think 9 years of evidence proves the naysayers wrong.


wtf does one have to do with the other!?!??!

"Blow it all on Quafe and strippers." --- Sorlac
Rengerel en Distel
#53 - 2013-01-22 00:39:48 UTC
Ginger Barbarella wrote:
FourierTransformer wrote:
For 9 years, hisec had can flipping duels. During that time Nullsec Empires rose, fell, rose, and fell again. Lowsec thrived, and became a depopulated wasteland, and thrived again.

Honestly, I think 9 years of evidence proves the naysayers wrong.


wtf does one have to do with the other!?!??!


Duels didn't lead to the loss of pvp going on in other sectors.

With the increase in shiptoasting, the Report timer needs to be shortened.
FourierTransformer
#54 - 2013-01-22 00:40:58 UTC  |  Edited by: FourierTransformer
Ginger Barbarella wrote:
FourierTransformer wrote:
For 9 years, hisec had can flipping duels. During that time Nullsec Empires rose, fell, rose, and fell again. Lowsec thrived, and became a depopulated wasteland, and thrived again.

Honestly, I think 9 years of evidence proves the naysayers wrong.


wtf does one have to do with the other!?!??!


That was in response to comments like this one:

Ayuren Aakiwa wrote:
This is a terrible idea, as op said why leave high sec when you can safely pvp there. Eve pvp is great because of all the sneaky tactics, chasing, baiting etc... Arenas are just plain dumb in this game. Evil


It does help to read the entire thread for context before typing "wtf!?!?!?111eleventy!one11!!"
Rordan D'Kherr
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#55 - 2013-01-22 00:42:24 UTC
So what's wrong with duels in lowsec?

Don't be scared, because being afk is not a crime.
Super spikinator
Hegemonous Conscripts
#56 - 2013-01-22 00:43:38 UTC
Rordan D'Kherr wrote:
So what's wrong with duels in lowsec?


There is nothing wrong with duels in lowsec. There is a problem with duels in high sec since the mechanic that has been used to initiate them was taken away.
FourierTransformer
#57 - 2013-01-22 00:47:06 UTC
Rordan D'Kherr wrote:
So what's wrong with duels in lowsec?

There's nothing wrong with duels in lowsec, just like there's nothing wrong with hi-sec can flipping duels that have been around for 9 years that are being reinstated with more transparent mechanics Big smile.

Hisec duels don't have to be dysfunctional for lowsec duels to exist and vice versa, both existed for 9 years with no major problems.
Rengerel en Distel
#58 - 2013-01-22 00:48:06 UTC
My only wonder is why a corp hasn't set up an "arena channel" where they create gated sites (missions/ded/whatever) that restrict ship sizes in low sec. The corp is the one that keeps the area safe for the combatants, and others can enter in rookie ships to watch/bet. Any other ships that enter get blapped by the corp. You could set up 1v1, 2v2, whatever. Battles could be sponsored, champions could be crowned and win rewards, etc.

Of course, in eve fashion, other pirates or whatever could do their best to pop people entering the system. They could try and crash the gate to screw up the matches, etc. It would be up to the host corp to fend them off, or move to another spot.

With the increase in shiptoasting, the Report timer needs to be shortened.
Rordan D'Kherr
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#59 - 2013-01-22 00:48:44 UTC
So you can have it in lowsec, but want it in hisec. But why?

Don't be scared, because being afk is not a crime.
FourierTransformer
#60 - 2013-01-22 01:03:55 UTC  |  Edited by: FourierTransformer
Rordan D'Kherr wrote:
So you can have it in lowsec, but want it in hisec. But why?

Your question makes no sense.

I could just as easily say:
So you can have it in nullsec, but want it in lowsec. But why?

Or better still:
So you can have it in wormhole space, but want it in nullsec. But why?

The answer to all three questions is actually the same. Because having more options is preferable to having fewer options. Especially when one such option worked demonstrably well for 9 years.