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Care-bears may be physically unable to PvP

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Mr Kidd
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#201 - 2013-01-21 04:36:19 UTC
You can't force people into PVP. They have to come to it themselves. The pvp learning curve is very steep. The biggest barrier to more people pvping, IMO, is a lack of facilities in game to help people test their meddle and learn what they can/cannot do without dying a million times, losing lots of isk and possibly skill points.

As a noob, I mined and missioned for six months in a npc corp. Being some what interested in pvp I setup a group that met once a week to figure out pvp because, frankly, there was noone there to teach it. We failed miserably at killing anything and more times than not were blobbed to death. Then I went to w-space with a friend. It wasn't until 6mos after that when we fell in with the right crowd and started learning how to pvp.

Don't ban me, bro!
Cyprus Black
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#202 - 2013-01-21 08:13:50 UTC
Corey Fumimasa wrote:
Cyprus Black wrote:
You seem to confuse can't and wont. They can, they just choose not to. Drastically altering game mechanics for players who already choose not to participate is bad design.

Players would participate if they had some options for doing so. IDK why I even respond to you here. Eve will continue to evolve and change, some of those changes will be hard on you.
If you hesitate to respond, it means your argument has little ground to stand on and you're afraid of debate.

While newbies all by themselves are weak and inferior, in groups with players who know what they're doing they can be useful, especially with the T1 frigate and cruiser logistic changes. Proper guidance makes a world of difference to a newbie yet sadly most never get that guidance.

I will concede that new characters need some kind of buff to starting skills. New characters used to start with 800,000 SP, but CCP reduced it to 54,000 SP. A 93% reduction. Even with their 100% bonus to training time, it's still a heavy setback for newbies.

Summary of EvEs last four expansions: http://imgur.com/ZL5SM33
Valleria Darkmoon
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#203 - 2013-01-21 09:09:58 UTC
Nexus Day wrote:
The first time you take a flight you should have to fly the plane.


If you're a pilot IRL this is likely actually the case.

I flew the plane on my first flight, though granted I didn't do everything. 5000 feet in the air in a Cessna you have a lot of room to screw up.

Reality has an almost infinite capacity to resist oversimplification.
Tarryn Nightstorm
Hellstar Towing and Recovery
#204 - 2013-01-21 09:13:39 UTC
Carebears aren't people, they're giant flying goodie-bags.

Your thread is hereby rendered irrelevant, OP.

Star Wars: the Old Republic may not be EVE. But I'll take the sound of dual blaster-pistols over "NURVV CLAOKING NAOW!!!11oneone!!" any day of the week.
Malcanis
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
#205 - 2013-01-21 09:46:56 UTC
Cyprus Black wrote:
Corey Fumimasa wrote:
Cyprus Black wrote:
You seem to confuse can't and wont. They can, they just choose not to. Drastically altering game mechanics for players who already choose not to participate is bad design.

Players would participate if they had some options for doing so. IDK why I even respond to you here. Eve will continue to evolve and change, some of those changes will be hard on you.
If you hesitate to respond, it means your argument has little ground to stand on and you're afraid of debate.

While newbies all by themselves are weak and inferior, in groups with players who know what they're doing they can be useful, especially with the T1 frigate and cruiser logistic changes. Proper guidance makes a world of difference to a newbie yet sadly most never get that guidance.

I will concede that new characters need some kind of buff to starting skills. New characters used to start with 800,000 SP, but CCP reduced it to 54,000 SP. A 93% reduction. Even with their 100% bonus to training time, it's still a heavy setback for newbies.


New Characters start with 5.4M SP worth of learning skills.

I'll say it again: new players don't need free stuffs. That's just gets exploited by old players making alts. New players need easier access to active groups of players who can get them into playing EVE.

"Just remember later that I warned against any change to jump ranges or fatigue. You earned whats coming."

Grath Telkin, 11.10.2016
Sergeant Acht Scultz
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#206 - 2013-01-21 09:54:40 UTC
Malcanis wrote:
New Characters start with 5.4M SP worth of learning skills.

I'll say it again: new players don't need free stuffs. That's just gets exploited by old players making alts. New players need easier access to active groups of players who can get them into playing EVE.



Very much this, only because as you say it quite clearly and obvious for every one around for a couple years already, it will only profit to older players to screw and mess even more with newer players.

removed inappropriate ASCII art signature - CCP Eterne
Corey Fumimasa
CFM Salvage
#207 - 2013-01-21 10:05:09 UTC  |  Edited by: Corey Fumimasa
Cyprus Black wrote:
[f you hesitate to respond, it means your argument has little ground to stand on and you're afraid of debate.



There are many reasons I might choose to delay a response, it is by no means indicative of ...well lets just get back to the topic at hand.

I'll be back in a few minutes, I am going to go and review logical fallacies so that I don't say something that is immediately recognizable as unprovable and have people laugh at me because I'm not able to form coherent thoughts. I think I will start with http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Non_sequitur_(logic)
Corey Fumimasa
CFM Salvage
#208 - 2013-01-21 10:32:52 UTC
Corey Fumimasa wrote:
Cyprus Black wrote:
[f you hesitate to respond, it means your argument has little ground to stand on and you're afraid of debate.



There are many reasons I might choose to delay a response, it is by no means indicative of ...well lets just get back to the topic at hand.

I'll be back in a few minutes, I am going to go and review logical fallacies so that I don't say something that is immediately recognizable as unprovable and have people laugh at me because I'm not able to form coherent thoughts. I think I will start with http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Non_sequitur_(logic)

Its a shame that you cannot "like" your' own posts. There really is no need to disinclude that option.

As Malcanas and Skultz have pointed out new characters need training not a leveling of the playing field. If people want a fair game with balanced options they will have to look elsewhere.

In any case this thread has wandered off course. The OP asked "what options for destruction and mahem could be implemented that will appeal to players for whom FiS and hotseat PvP are not enjoyable activities?"
Whitehound
#209 - 2013-01-21 10:39:10 UTC
Corey Fumimasa wrote:
The OP asked "what options for destruction and mahem could be implemented that will appeal to players for whom FiS and hotseat PvP are not enjoyable activities?"

There is the quit button. If you don't like PvP and flying in spaceships then quit EVE and stop trolling our forum.

Loss is meaningful. Therefore is the loss of meaning likewise meaningful. It is the source of all trolling.
Corey Fumimasa
CFM Salvage
#210 - 2013-01-21 10:44:36 UTC
Whitehound wrote:
Corey Fumimasa wrote:
The OP asked "what options for destruction and mahem could be implemented that will appeal to players for whom FiS and hotseat PvP are not enjoyable activities?"

There is the quit button. If you don't like PvP and flying in spaceships then quit EVE and stop trolling our forum.


I love Eve and PvP. I just think that the options for damaging the assets of other players are not usable by some of the players. It is a good point and something that people want to discuss and read about.

If you don't like the things that I write about or the ways in which I write them then block me.


Whitehound
#211 - 2013-01-21 10:54:34 UTC
Corey Fumimasa wrote:
Whitehound wrote:
Corey Fumimasa wrote:
The OP asked "what options for destruction and mahem could be implemented that will appeal to players for whom FiS and hotseat PvP are not enjoyable activities?"

There is the quit button. If you don't like PvP and flying in spaceships then quit EVE and stop trolling our forum.


I love Eve and PvP. I just think that the options for damaging the assets of other players are not usable by some of the players. It is a good point and something that people want to discuss and read about.

If you don't like the things that I write about or the ways in which I write them then block me.

I don't care how much you love EVE and PvP. I don't believe you do.

People who don't like to PvP and flying in spaceships don't need you to voice their opinions. They simply don't play EVE, which is the right choice.

And just like they know what to do and when to stop with it should you now stop pushing a non-issue.

Loss is meaningful. Therefore is the loss of meaning likewise meaningful. It is the source of all trolling.
Corey Fumimasa
CFM Salvage
#212 - 2013-01-21 11:02:44 UTC
Whitehound wrote:


And just like they know what to do and when to stop with it should you now stop pushing a non-issue.


I will stop posting when the idea stops getting hits.


ISD TYPE40
Imperial Shipment
Amarr Empire
#213 - 2013-01-21 15:47:38 UTC
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