Wormholes

Your analogy isn't really applicable. The people complaining in this thread aren't complaining just because the tactic is used against us. We use/abuse dread blapping as often as we get the chance tbh. It's just that we've realized how much of a fight hindrance it's become: fights are harder to get—and even when you do get them they're more like ganks for whoever has the dreads. This thread is about making w-space pvp less stale and more frequent.

TL;DR: the complainers aren't the victims. We just want more fights.

Your other ideas about counters to cap ships could be worth considering, however.

good to know you can tank 40k dps for 3 minutes, does it go invulnerable or something after that? no..thats when it stops shooting and then goes pop


get in a moros if you want the moros capability...it shouldnt be nerfed b/c someone else has a rev. the rev shines with its tank, and ability to reach out and touch targets at range. Its not a cap hungry ship like the moros is. it makes no sense to nerf a ship so its just like all the others.... each ship should have its strength...moros has blasters its strength is tracking/dps which also means a big cap consumption.


get in a moros if you think you are at such a disadvantage and then pew with it...you will see how vulnerable they are. They can die too, or be hindered if you play them right

also...check that km against the sub cap fleet, all those moroses [with their insane tracking and dps] there and there was a rev on more kms the only kill where any dread did notable damage was on the damnation the t3s suffered 95%+ of their damage from the other t3s tier 3bc etc... and there were 5 moros present at the end of that fight.

Edit: whats the plural of moros? moroses? morai? lol..help me out here

Where to begin.....


That's called burst tank. It can also tank 25k dps for 5 min until it cycles out of siege and receives reps...

Show me your rev that tanks way better than that.



Haha... no.



You should go back a reread this:

read the last bit you quoted



most of them dreads turned up at the very end of the fight, that example was more to show just how much of the fleet could have ewar on it to be jammed out the second fight aharm v exhale is the one where teh caps were on the field the whole fight

1. It's 15k DPS vs 11k DPS if you fit them correctly (armor version)
2. The Rev and Moros are different ships, shouldn't it stand to reason one is better at one thing that the other?
3. Why haven't we nerfed the archon seeing as that carrier is better than the others in WH space.. cry some more?
4. I think if your fleet comp cant counter 10 bill in ships that were just dropped on to the field in the shape or 2 moros you deserve to die, or retreat.
5. Reship to a T3 comp that can manage (with some ECM added, if someone misses a jam, get better jamming pilots)
6. Dafug is this thread, delete it now please :P

This complaint is a side effect of how wormhole space has evolved. It will continue to evolve to counter these things. Just because team 1 like their fleet comp and wants to be able to stick with said fleet comp, doesn't mean that team 2 has to get nerfed based on what team 1 says. Team 1 have to come up with a counter strategy to beat team 2.

15k is almost 50% better than 11k. The tracking is also much better on a Moros. Different is fine, 50% better is not. Also, what is the Rev better than the Moros at? Not using ammo? I would say that the Rev is about where Dreads should be, the Moros is too good, and the Phoenix and Nag are two slightly different flavours of useless.

I fully expect that once Fozzy gets to the capital ships, there is going to be much wailing and gnashing of teeth as both the Archon and Moros get bought back down to where they should be. I also see large buffs to the Nag/Phoenix, with the phoenix probably changing to a hybrid ship, or getting VERY large bonuses to sig res/explosion velocity. The Nid/Thanny will most likely be buffed, as well as a small buff to fitting for the Chimera.

But that isn't until late this year at the earliest. until then, the Moros is overpowered, and no amount of training for it will change that.

This originally start off as a "dreads can blap anything" not a "one dread can do more DPS than another". The Rev has lower DPS because of the weapons system that the Rev uses. Instead of having horrible terrible AWEFUL capacitor problems for the Rev they decided to give it a 10% bonus to capacitor usage per level for lasers. It "would" be 25% more DPS effective if they had two DPS bonuses like all other dreads do but you would still be unhappy because hybrids in themselves are 25% better on top of that as a raw DPS platform.

You're only looking at this one sided, how good hybrids are for all out DPS... Lasers have no reload time, can instantly switch to snipe ammo, no charges needed. And are NOT that far behind if the Rev had the same bonuses.

The Rev itself due to it's low cap usage of lasers can out-tank a mid sized T3 gang, out EHP all other dreads, and has the best capacitor out of the lot, as well as having the same blapping properties on subcaps.

It's not that terrible, unless you want to utterly ruin the revelations capacitor you will either have to balance hybrids to bring them down to lasers damage, then lasers will have range and many other things over hybrids. Or bring lasers damage up to hybrids, then you have the same issue. Lasers will just end up a prettier version of hybrids and I would hate to see that happen. I know... let's start ranting about projectiles and how they don't use capacitor at all! Oh wait.. they don't do as much damage. See how this works??

Statistic: There is a percentage of the worlds population that will never see the bigger picture, no matter how well things are explained or how plain things are to understand. Therefore I feel I'm wasting my time here to some extent.

P.S. I don't fly either of these ships on a day-to-day basis.

The problem was that the moros has it much easier to apply that raw dmg bonus.

So exactly the same as every other area of Eve. Can't hold your Sov? Bring more stuff. Can't hold your FW systems? Bring more stuff. Can't mine belts out before others? Bring more stuff.

Eve is built around "bring more stuff" from the ground up. If there is a problem, it's not exclusive to wormholes.



There are counters to dreads. You only need to look at the evictions that happen by the major WH alliances. No one fields a fleet of nothing but dreads in a WH and wins. You still need a subcap fleet to support them.

If your cruisers are at the point where they're multi-webbed and multi-painted, the subcap fleet is going to kill them anyway.



Again, this isn't a WH problem.

I think the issue you're talking of here is a slightly different one than what you're saying - it's not easy to deploy a counter fleet in a target WH due to mass limitations. *That* is WH specific, but even then, I don't think it's an issue.

Wormholes are quite literally the only place in Eve where small corps can almost exclusively use a 0 sec system if they use their brains. If a small corp tried to field dreads in null, they'd get blobbed in seconds.

It's great that smaller corps can have a home advantage in a WH. I know of quite a few carebear corps that have ended up in WHs because of it. It's hardly unreasonable that a multi billion ISK ship + subcap support can kill "small sig cruisers". Those cruisers were dead anyway.