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Target Painter vs. Web vs. Tracking Computer
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Tash'k Omar
Indefinite Mass
#1 - 2013-01-18 21:09:16 UTC  |  Edited by: Tash'k Omar
Hey all, just had a few questions on the benefits of each of these modules.

I am familiar with the equation for tracking in Eve, but was curious as to which of these modules would benefit a solo turret ship the most. (While I'm curious as the the mechanics in all aspects of Eve, I am in particular interested in trying to make T2 425s hit sleeper frigates with maximum efficiency)

Just glancing at the equation without running any numbers leads me to believe that a Meta 4 TP (+30% sig bloom, more with skills) would give exactly the same bonus as a Tech 2 Tracking Computer (+30% tracking speed). However the Target painter would help everyone in the fleet, assuming I bring a friend/alt along.

I would imagine the web would be better than either of those two, however the limited range could make it a problem in some instances. (All sleeper frigates orbit at <10km so I shouldn't have much problem there, however both the TC and TP would be a benefit against cruisers as well)

So, am I correct in my assumption that TP == TC, or did I read the equation incorrectly?

Thanks a bunch.
Paikis
Vapour Holdings
#2 - 2013-01-18 21:10:24 UTC
Looks to me like you've answered your own question already.
Flakey Foont
#3 - 2013-01-18 21:10:43 UTC
Kind of depends on what you are flying. Web is always good if you fight at that range.
Eternal Error
Doomheim
#4 - 2013-01-18 21:16:57 UTC  |  Edited by: Eternal Error
EDIT: I suck
Carol Krabit
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#5 - 2013-01-18 21:17:10 UTC
If your equation is right (I cba math) it would seem a tracking computer is superior for the solo ship, as it has no limit on range and can be scripted on the fly to increase range if needed. If you are using big drones on the other hand the TP might give a slight boost to their accuracy aswell, so yeah. I shouldn't have posted.
Carol Krabit
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#6 - 2013-01-18 21:17:45 UTC
oops
Klymer
Hedion University
Amarr Empire
#7 - 2013-01-20 03:51:33 UTC
A sensor booster scripted for scan resolution will let you lock frigs quicker, thus allowing you to shoot them while they are farther away and still flying straight at you so no need to worry about tracking.
Gypsio III
State War Academy
Caldari State
#8 - 2013-01-20 11:19:31 UTC
Eternal Error wrote:
TP only helps if your turrets' sig res is higher than the signature radius of the target.


no
RavenPaine
RaVeN Alliance
#9 - 2013-01-20 16:05:24 UTC
I'm a big fan of Target Painters. They work for all weapons types, have great range, assist the whole fleet.
Kahega Amielden
Rifterlings
#10 - 2013-01-20 16:16:56 UTC
The advantage of a TC is the ability to on-the-fly swap to range.

As far as either of those vs a web: A web is superior if you're within range (obviously) and the angular velocity is primarily coming from your opponent's movement. If your own movement is causing the angular velocity (IE you're orbiting him), then a web will not help you whereas a TP will.
Garviel Tarrant
Beyond Divinity Inc
Shadow Cartel
#11 - 2013-01-20 17:29:51 UTC
Webs >>>>>>>>>>>>> all the rest assuming they are close

BYDI recruitment closed-ish

Tash'k Omar
Indefinite Mass
#12 - 2013-01-20 18:50:54 UTC
Thanks all for the replys. I'll probably end up going with a TP, just in case a friend/alt tags along, plus with just a few days training I can get it to 36% boost instead of 30%.
Enilonee
#13 - 2013-01-21 15:21:42 UTC
If the TP gets jammed or popped your fleet will run without bonus. Also it has only 45km optimal.

A local tracking comp bonus will always be there.
Syrias Bizniz
some random local shitlords
#14 - 2013-01-21 19:32:43 UTC
A Target Painter will help when your target's signature is lower than your weapons sensorresolution.
A Tracking Computer will help when your target's signature is lower than your weapons sensorresolution and/or in combination with their angular velocity.
A web will help when your target is moving to fast for your guns to track.
If you are using closerange weapon systems, like autocannons, a targeting computer is probably the best way to go, since you already have a 'good' tracking, and it lets you also extend the range at which you can apply your damage. If you're using long range weapon systems, a webber will help you track targets that got under your guns by far more than a tracking computer would. However, the range is limited.
Also, with long range, a Target Painter would help you boost up the target's signature while it is approaching you, making it easier to hit - unless it's already big enough.
Cage Man
Fusion Enterprises Ltd
Pandemic Horde
#15 - 2013-01-21 21:15:24 UTC
Target Painter cycles slowly, so you will be on to the next target before it has finished, for this reason I prefer a TC.
Noisrevbus
#16 - 2013-01-21 21:27:13 UTC  |  Edited by: Noisrevbus
I guess your question have sort of already been answered, but i'll put it up clearly as well:

The power of the module corrolates to the difficulty of application.

The web is the strongest (yet hardest to apply).
The painter is the second strongest (from multiple ships up until diminishing return).
The tracking mods are the weakest (but most simplistic and with the least conditions to meet to be effective).

Few shots are fired with the weakest in power without the stronger effects having been applied ontop though.
ie., in most situations when you have a Tracking comp, someone else is already applying point-web-paint.
Verity Sovereign
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#17 - 2013-01-21 22:40:34 UTC
If target sig >> weapon sig/explosion radius, then the TP doesn't help much at all

if target traversal << weapon tracking, and its within optimal, then the TC doesn't help much at all, same goes for webs

For various combinations, its a lot more complicated.

I'd go with the TC for solo work
Gypsio III
State War Academy
Caldari State
#18 - 2013-01-22 01:26:25 UTC
The number of people who don't understand how target painting fits into the tracking formula never ceases to amaze me.
Eternal Error
Doomheim
#19 - 2013-01-22 15:34:40 UTC  |  Edited by: Eternal Error
Gypsio III wrote:
The number of people who don't understand how target painting fits into the tracking formula never ceases to amaze me.

I'll rephrase.

Given the diminishing mathematical returns in the tracking formula and the difficulty of realistically getting the turretSig:TargetSig ratio significantly below .5 (assuming target MWD off), the cutoff that players tend to worry about is TargetSig=turretSig.

I.E. we could have a debate over all the math and post up 50 different graphs, but given the prevalence of webs, the ease with which one can minimize transversal, the stacking penalties involved with TPs, and the fact that you're generally shooting at something of similar size anyway, most people don't worry about trying to bloom the target's sig radius as much as possible. It helps, but is generally the last thing you try except in extreme cases (sniper gangs, blap dreads, etc.)

To the OP, yes, the statement "target sig only matters if it's less than the resolution of the guns" is technically incorrect (see here: http://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/Turret_damage), but a very good cutoff to follow.
Cage Man
Fusion Enterprises Ltd
Pandemic Horde
#20 - 2013-01-22 18:22:58 UTC
Gypsio III wrote:
The number of people who don't understand how target painting fits into the tracking formula never ceases to amaze me.



The number of people who offer no help on the forums but feel the need to comment never ceases to amaze me Blink
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